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Jay Gee controllers?


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#1 rmjlmartin

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Posted 19 February 2023 - 03:26 PM

I ran across something about a Jay Gee Linear 200 controller recently, and thought it looked kind of interesting. Is anyone still using them?

 

I know that the company seems to be long out of business, and the website has been taken down. From what I'm reading, it looks like they were fairly decent controllers, at least in their day, and had some interesting features. Does anyone have any thoughts or info on them? Any opinions how they stack up against the current generation of electronic controllers? (Difalco, Third Eye, etc)

 

I know this is probably somewhat ancient history, but I was into slot cars as a teenager 25+ years ago, and now getting back into it in the last couple of years with my kids, I'm curious about the evolution from then to now...


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#2 Tom Thumb Hobbies

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Posted 19 February 2023 - 03:48 PM

Not a lot of my racers used JayGee controllers but those that did loved them. IIRC they were first with a “brake and release” feature.

 

Interesting note…I had an attorney call me asking how many I sold. He was going through a divorce and his soon to be ex-wife’s legal team were trying to value his controller business. Shame I didn’t keep detailed records <wink>.


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#3 Montoya1

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Posted 19 February 2023 - 05:09 PM

Brake and release?


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#4 Tom Thumb Hobbies

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Posted 19 February 2023 - 05:18 PM

I only tried it a couple of times so I may not be exactly correct in my description. Basically a short time after hitting the brake pad the brakes were released. In other words, coasting. The time was adjustable.
 


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#5 Guillermo Suar

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Posted 19 February 2023 - 06:39 PM

I still have two of the linear 200 model. You are correct about the braking. The brake is released after a set time. It has a knob to adjust the timing.
 
The power board is connected to the handle with a standard mini USB cable. You can replace this cable an if I remember it right, it was tested with a 20' cable and worked fine. This was useful for racers on a wheelchair.
 
Manufacturing quality is very good.
 
The speed circuit is transistor type with a full power relay. The brakes are FET controlled.
 
The one in the pictures has had an electronic choke added. That's the extra knob and switch.
 
2023-02-19_16-51-32_376.jpeg
 
Here there is a useful answer: Jay Gee 100 controller OK for serious Scale racing?
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#6 rmjlmartin

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Posted 19 February 2023 - 10:34 PM

Thanks, Mike and Guillermo.
 
Maybe I'll add another question. Are they good enough to be worth tracking one down to try? My current controllers are a Difalco DD281 and a similar controller that I built using a friend's design (single transistor instead of a Darlington pair), so I'm not hurting for nice controllers, but I'm always interested in trying something interesting.
 
And anyone else with thoughts or info, please chime in.
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#7 Lovinggood

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Posted 20 February 2023 - 11:43 AM

I started out with the 100 and moved up to the pro 200. Its been a great controller well made and very durable. I've raced open thru HO with it. One great feature is adding an USB extension and driving anywhere around the track.


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#8 Jay Guard

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Posted 20 February 2023 - 06:59 PM

I recall when I lived in California in the early 2000's the "controller JayGee", which is not me (Jay Guard), use to race at a raceway in San Jose that I often raced at.  The only thing I really remember about his controllers is that the guys that had one liked them but it seemed to be easy for the USB cable connection to come loose/apart during use.  No damage but something that you had to be aware of, especially during a race.  It seems like as I was moving out of California around mid 2004 he had sort of disappeared from the slot racing scene.


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#9 Tom Thumb Hobbies

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Posted 20 February 2023 - 08:07 PM

I think he moved to the Midwest. I want to say Illinois but I don’t remember for sure.


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#10 rmjlmartin

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Posted 21 February 2023 - 07:12 PM

If I remember correctly from what I've been reading, Jay Gee was the owner's initials, and I believe his name was Jeff Goldberg.

 

There was a comment on here earlier that seems to have been removed about him being involved in the design of the new controllers that Mid America is coming out with. Does anyone know if there's any truth to that? I have a MId America catalog, and there are some similarities to the electronic controller pictured there, including the USB cable, but that obviously doesn't necessarily mean there's actually a connection.

 

From what I'm reading on this thread, it sounds like they were good controllers, but weren't that widely used, possibly because he went out of business for personal reasons. All that makes me curious. If anyone has a Linear 200 that's collecting dust, and they'd like to unload it, I might be interested, if the price is right.


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#11 Guillermo Suar

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Posted 22 February 2023 - 05:45 PM

You a correct about the name. Many years ago I made a modification to the linear 200 fto add an  electronic choke and he contacted me to write an article about it.

 

This is the thread: http://slotblog.net/...e-for-under-20/

 

Unfortunatelly, the article itself was linked to Jeff's controller web page, which is long gone.

 

I used my Jaygee controllers many years. They have a nice feeling. The only thing is that you will need to get used to the brake and release braking. Jeff used to sell a chip to convert this to conventional brake setting.

 

I tried for some time to get a hold on him to get these chips, with no success. I still would be interested if they were avalilable.


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#12 Tom Thumb Hobbies

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Posted 22 February 2023 - 07:01 PM

Try to contact Paul Martin here on SlotBlog. He was one of my racers that had aJayGee and I know he had a chip. I’m not sure if he is still active. Let me know if you try and can’t contact him.


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#13 rmjlmartin

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Posted 28 February 2023 - 05:07 PM

I have one of these in hand now, thanks to Guillermo, who was kind enough to offer to sell me one of his. It looks like a nice controller, but I guess I'll see how it performs when I try it at the track.

 

I also found several archived incarnations of the JayGee website on the Wayback Machine. Here's a link to the page with Guillermo's article, if anyone is interested-

 

https://web.archive....m/Techinfo.html


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#14 rmjlmartin

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Posted 09 March 2023 - 02:18 PM

Another question about these controllers-

 

Does anyone know if the replaceable brake chip is a programmable chip with that's been coded for the specific brake application, or is it an off-the-shelf chip that could be swapped out if you knew what chip to get?

 

A friend of mine is speculating that the brake-and-release chip could simply be a timer chip. The chip in my controller has a sticker over the top that's obscuring any lettering that might be there. I may try at some point to get a better look, but I can't without removing the protective heat shrink, and I haven't gone to that trouble yet.

 

Any thoughts? I know these aren't that common anymore, and finding someone with the different chips could be challenging.


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#15 Guillermo Suar

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Posted 10 March 2023 - 12:07 AM

As far as I know, the chip is the same component, but with a different program. That's why I was tryng to contact Jeff and figure if he could either make a few or provide the code to program it.


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#16 chasbeeman

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Posted 30 March 2023 - 07:52 PM

The designer Jeff Goldberg lives in Missouri. He is on Facebook if you want to message him.
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#17 rmjlmartin

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Posted 30 March 2023 - 11:47 PM

I've pulled the sticker off of the brake chip in mine so I can read the numbers, and it is a programmable chip.

 

The designer Jeff Goldberg lives in Missouri. He is on Facebook if you want to message him.

 

Someone else pointed me to Jeff's Facebook page, and I sent him a message a couple of weeks ago, both on Facebook and here on Slotblog, but he hasn't responded. If someone does get in touch with him, and he does have the brake chips available, I may be interested in one, too.


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#18 rmjlmartin

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Posted 19 June 2023 - 10:11 PM

I've used the controller a bit now, so I'll update it with my thoughts/opinions.

 

My initial impression was that I like the controller, and the brake and release is definitely interesting. I don't know if it's "better" or "worse" than anything else, but it is different. I do notice that I tend to carry a little more speed into corners with it, compared to controllers with traditional brakes, and it's helped me realize that I needed to improve my driving skill. (not that there was ever any question about the need for improvement...)

 

However, I did notice that I was consistently running a tenth or two slower laps with it vs. my Difalco. I did a little poking around and discovered that there is a diode in the circuit between the power supply and the handle, and then a resistor in the return side, between the handle and the transistor. Both of those combined to limit the voltage going to the base of the transistor, which resulted in a full 2v drop just coming off of the full power relay. I got some advice from a friend who has a background in electronics, and we determined that the diode was likely for reverse polarity protection, so after testing it with a temporary bypass on it, and then also the resistor, I installed permanent jumpers to bypass both, and now it gets full track voltage back to the base of the transistor at full throttle, and seems to perform on par with my other controllers.

 

I also installed my favorite Difalco handle, as well as the Difalco trigger pin kit. I like the Parma handle that was on the controller when I got it, but my hands are too big, and I always end up with my pinky hanging over the end of the handle. I tend to get caught up in racing, and often will put a death grip on the handle, and that can get uncomfortable over the course of a race.The Difalco handle is very similar to the Parma, just a little longer, so it does the job nicely. The JayGee controller already had ball bearings on the trigger pivot, but the pivot allowed a lot of side to side play in the trigger, so I installed the excellent Difalco trigger pin kit, which took care of the play.

 

I raced with it several times, and noticed that the heat sink was getting warmer than my other controllers. I doubt it was warm enough to be a problem, but I swapped the heat sink out for a larger one, and it stays much cooler. That also gave me the opportunity to isolate the transistor from the heat sink with a ceramic insulator, so the heat sink no longer has V+ on it. (My automotive technician's brain says that exposed V+ is a short waiting to happen, so I avoid that, if possible.)

 

So, the bottom line is that, after the modifications, I like it, and will continue to use it. It doesn't work as well as my Difalco with some classes of cars, but it's a very worthwhile addition to my box. I find that, at least for me, trying different things helps me see why some things work better than others, and often helps me learn how to do things better, so this was a worthwhile experiment for me.

 

I see that the new Mid America electronic controller is a very similar design, so that might be the closest current production controller to it. I haven't tested the Mid America controller enough to know how close it actually is, but I'll throw that out there, for whatever it's worth.


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#19 NSwanberg

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Posted 19 June 2023 - 11:48 PM

Seems like you would want the transition resistor on the heat sink to you know like sink the heat?


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#20 rmjlmartin

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Posted 20 June 2023 - 12:55 PM

Seems like you would want the transition resistor on the heat sink to you know like sink the heat?

 

Do you mean the transistor? Let me clarify what I meant, since it isn't as clear as it should be...

 

What I should have said is that I electrically isolated the transistor from the heat sink with a thermally conductive ceramic insulator. The ceramic insulator will conduct the heat to the heat sink without making an electrical connection. Since the shell of the transistor is also the V+ connection (collector), if there is an electrical connection between the shell and the heat sink, the heat sink will also have V+ on it.

 

That's probably not really a problem, since most controller manufacturers do it, and I don't think there's been an epidemic of electrical shorts at slot car tracks, but my automotive technician's brain sees a big chunk of electrically hot heat sink exposed like that as a short waiting to happen, so I prefer to electrically (NOT thermally) isolate the transistor(s) and similar components from the heat sink.

 

Hopefully that makes a little more sense.


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