18 replies to this topic

[Alchemist]

I just stumbled across this:
 
Brushless motor
 
Ernie

[jimht]

Yeah, they put that up at the same time they posted their "price."
 
Modified brushless drone motor... check.
Anything done in limited quantity can have a high price... check.
Sales statistics have not yet been posted... check.
 
Comparing the NSR motor to a cobalt strap is like comparing a GTO to a Bugatti Veyron.
 
Price is determined by the seller, not the buyer.
Value is determined by the buyer, not the seller.

[team burrito]

It is a bit pricey.

[stoo23]

You think so??... I reckon it borders on criminal!!! 

[Samiam]

I'll wait for KC Racing to come out with a high performance version of their $20 motor. Some of the very useful features highlighted in the NSR may come to the lower price motors if there is any interest. Maybe a $100 blueprinted motor?

 

But these high end NSR motors are strictly intended for the high end ''Open Motor'' classes. Not the level of racing where $20 ''BIC motors'' are the norm now. But if I was racing Open Wing or any of the ES classes that allow brushless, the $320 US cost wouldn't seem unreasonable at all.

 

DISCLAIMER...This comment is completely unqualified. Ignore if it bothers you.

[stoo23]

Sometimes you just Have to Laugh

Found this Wonderful 'Nugget' of PR on the NSR Site, proclaiming the 'Virtues' of their Horrendously EXPENSIVE brushless motor.

 

Fixed to the chassis by soldering it, without the risk of loosing screws.

Hmmm, very interesting,...  especially considering the aforementioned bracket, is Held On,.. with,... 'Wait for it', ......

 

 

SCREWS !!      

[MSwiss]

I don't know how you are going to get away from screws/ bolts.

 

When people started doing this, I marveled at the Richard Mack cars in the fact that they apparently weren't eating spur gears, despite the motor not being triangulated.

 

Apparently once you get into Budrys-Castriacone speeds, you do indeed need the motor triangulated.

 

This seems like the only practical solution.

 

Maybe have the endbell (edit-actually called the base or the stator tube) plated to be able to also tack solder it on to that triangulation thingamabob.

 

More text to follow, later.

[Dave Crevie]

How sensitive are the field windings to heat in these motors? Soldering might damage them. 

[Eddie Fleming]

triangulation thingamabob

 

 Must be one of them engineering terms I reckon. 

[Bags]

The rotor and stator are made out aluminum, the motor must be bolted to a proper motor plate made of steel so it can be soldered to the chassis.

 

The motor brackets/plates are available to do this. Or like the new chassis KC is bringing out the bracket is part of the chassis to bolt the motor too.

[stoo23]

I marveled at the Richard Mack cars in the fact that they apparently weren't eating spur gears, despite the motor not being triangulated.

Apparently once you get into Budrys-Castriacone speeds, you do indeed need the motor triangulated.

 

Well I'm Not sure whether that IS actually even a Problem.

IF it is, people are Sure keeping it Damn Quiet !!

 

As We have All 'Marvelled' at Previously, there really is such little Mass !! I mean honestly, look at something like the GEPRC 1204 Series motors.

Not only are they Short, it Only weighs 3.8 grams !!! If it is 'Bolted-Up' to the Mounting bracket solidly, there isn't much that Wants to 'Pendulum' about the Bracket, especially if it is nice and Solid !! 

 

It has NOT proven to be a problem here, ... so far.

Even the 'Wing Car' guys Aren't chewing gears.

 

I appreciate the Fear and theoretical Issue, but it's a bit like this whole added 3rd bearing 'caper' !!?? AND both like the NSR bracket and that other 'clown' putting the Whole motor into an old 'Open Strap Can' setup ??

It Might be fine, ... until it takes a big shunt, Open cans do Bend, as could the NSR  bracket, then Axially, those 3rd bearings, are Now a mis-aligned 'Hindrance' !!

 

Makes me think of way back in the Old days. Some (even very famous people), would go to Stupid lengths Wire Wrapping Axles Tubes and other 'bits & bobs' to Frames etc

In my experience, if it has been built and soldered well (in the first place), ... Any accident Big enough to dis-lodge the front axle is gonna' be a biggie and I would rather it Broke-away cleanly, (allowing a much easier repair), than to have all that Wire wrapping transferring more energy to the rest of the chassis. Let alone the complete Pain in the proverbial to 'Fix' !!

 

I also can't help think there is some fascinated 'hang-over' regarding rpm, and gear ratios from all those years running Cobalt motors.

By design, Outrunner style motors, have Bags of Torque and do not display operational tendencies (as our beloved Strap cans did) like Dentist Drills !!!

I mean, really, is 5:40 Plus actually needed or desirable ?? ... Does it Need to Rev it's Proverbials Off ?? ... They and most current ESC's can get Very Hot doing that, whereas using less extreme ratios and making use of the inherent torque, seems to allow things to run cooler (and from recent equivalency testing), also be easier to drive !!

 

Makes you wonder !! ... Early days,.. guess we shall see, as things develop.

[stoo23]

The rotor and stator are made out aluminum

 

Hey Tom, the 'Stator' isn't made out of Aluminium !!! , wouldn't be much 'Flux Flow' if it was,.. LOL

[MSwiss]

This guy refers to the aluminum piece as the stator tube.

 

https://youtu.be/jkx...TXt4h18n3Np5ZZR

[stoo23]

Yes, correct it could (in effect) be made of almost anything, as long as it was strong and light enough.

[MSwiss]

This person refers to the part attached to the stator as the the base.

 

Also, what we usually call the rotor, he and the previous guy call it the bell.

 

https://youtu.be/OCA...XHggqM_9JXMvtDT

[Bags]

I stand corrected on the terminology I used.

 

The base that the screws/bolts go into is made of aluminum on these small motors. Stators can be made from a lot of different materials. I have seen 3d printed stator motors too.

 

The larger the motors get, different materials can be used, they develop a lot of torque to fly bigger aircraft.

 

Stoo you are right in your findings too. Why fix something that isn’t broken? 

Martin has thousands of laps on wings and flexi type cars with bolted in motors without problems. 
 

Getting the bracket in the right place makes the difference, just like in all types of slot cars.

 

Thank you for your input guys.

[stoo23]

This person refers to the part attached to the stator as the the base.

 

Also, what we usually call the rotor, he and the previous guy call it the bell

Yeah, I guess the Popular 'Terminology will eventually Sort itself out.

 

Although, that said, I have tried to be careful when discussing the Rotor ,.. 'End', as especially in England, the 'term' "Bell End", is a rather derogatory (Male genital reference)     

There is also some confusion / variance in the descriptions used by (Mainly Europeans from what I have seen) regarding Magnets and Poles etc, often being referred to as Poles and Teeth ???

[Bags]

“When people started doing this, I marveled at the Richard Mack cars in the fact that they apparently weren't eating spur gears, despite the motor not being triangulated.”
 

 

Yes Mike they are nice chassis that dont eat gears, I’ve since changed out the Talon on this one.
It handles a flat very nicely.

 

Attached Images

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[MSwiss]

 

Well I'm Not sure whether that IS actually even a Problem.

..........................

 

I mean, really, is 5:40 Plus actually needed or desirable ?? ... Does it Need to Rev it's Proverbials Off ?? ... They and most current ESC's can get Very Hot doing that, whereas using less extreme ratios and making use of the inherent torque, seems to allow things to run cooler (and from recent equivalency testing), also be easier to drive !!

 

Makes you wonder !! ... Early days,.. guess we shall see, as things develop.

What the NSR guys are doing isn't aimed at average slot racers, running on a variety of tracks.

 

It's specifically for the top tier racer racing ISRA style cars on flat tracks.

 

Those racers firmly believe they want their motor to rev to the bejesus, for more gyro effect.

 

While quite a few racers have complained about the price of the NSR combo, if it proves to be 100% reliable, it would be worth it for the high end racer.

 

Your statement about the ESC's getting very hot, that must apply to situations with very fast motors.

 

Others have stated that the ESC doesn't get hot at all.

 

And speaking of ESC's, it seems like with I see on FB,  racers complaining of problems, the ESC producer always ends his post with something like "I'm working on my new, improved ESC, as we speak".

 

As others have stated, in reality, the people that have jumped on the brushless bandwagon are Beta users.

 

Of course, "new and improved" is a way of life with slot racing, but with brushless, it will be much, much more so. 

 

When brushless started gaining traction, Richard Mack portrayed it as a super-cheap alternative to $300-$400 motors, with the Eurosport crowd.

 

People involved in the hobby a long time, like Graham Woodward and myself, scoffed at that.

 

With the high end, top tier, Eurosport crowd, it was never going to be cheap.

 

Those racers are going to spend whatever needed to gain a few .01's.