90 replies to this topic

[Ohio Retro Series]

If you have any questions regarding the Ohio Retro Series....... ask them here.

The ORS BOD will reply to all questions.

[Gary Adams]

Looking at the race day schedule posted, I think in terms of helping to grow the series that Flexi should be the first class to be run. I believe if you ask flexi racers, i.e., the "new guys", to hang around all day marshalling for the other classes, that they will quickly lose interest.

Further, there are enough of us with extra cars to loan to the flexi racers to race in the other classes to get their feet wet with the level of competition and skill required to make the step up to F1 and CanAm. I, for one, would be more than willing to loan cars to flexi racers who wanted to get some experience running the Retro cars, and I'm sure other racers would be generous and share as well.

Just my two cents worth, but I believe you should seriously look at racing flexi first.


Gary Adams

[The Number of]

The concours champion ship is really tough on finishing 2nd. 1st and 3rd get the same amount of points.

[The Number of]

In Retro-Pro,Will it be D-3 rules like last year at TT or IRRA Retro Anglewinder or a combo of both? Need a little more guidance than front and rear clearance and min. rear tire diameter. Thanks Bill

[Larry Mattingly]

How will racers be seeded after the ever exciting 'qualifying'...

LM

[Ohio Retro Series]

To answer the first few questions and / or comments.

It was decided to fun Flexi last because we felt that the majority of Flexi racers would be locals that would not have the long drive home that others might. Our thought was to give our traveling racers an earlier leave time which hopefully would encouage more travel to out-of-town races.

The points listed for Concours are incorrect. It should read: 1st - 3 pts. 2nd - 2pts and 3rd - 1pt. A correction is on the way.

The Retro Pro rules are based closely on D3 rules and are the same that Tom Thumb has been using in house. The two changes that were made include a "front to back" clearance minimum of .050 and the allowing of .790 minmum rear tires. The latter change was made so racers could get more use out of their worn down Can-Am and F1 tires. The final rules will be posted soon.

Seeding after qualifying will always be dependant on the number of entries. The process will be similar to the USRA consi/semi program but NO ONE will be seeded directly into any main.

[Mike Patterson]

Why try to run 4 classes in one day? Why not run 3 classes and start a little later in the morning? I might be able to make some of the TR races then.

I like Gary's idea of running Retro Flexi GT first. Then I wouldn't miss anything .

[The Number of]

The points listed for Concours are incorrect. It should read: 1st - 3 pts. 2nd - 2pts and 3rd - 1pt. A correction is on the way.

The Retro Pro rules are based closely on D3 rules and are the same that Tom Thumb has been using in house. The two changes that were made include a "front to back" clearance minimum of .050 and the allowing of .790 minmum rear tires. The latter change was made so racers could get more use out of their worn down Can-Am and F1 tires. The final rules will be posted soon.

Thanks for the quick reply. Bill

[Gary Adams]

The Retro Pro rules are based closely on D3 rules and are the same that Tom Thumb has been using in house. The two changes that were made include a "front to back" clearance minimum of .050 and the allowing of .790 minmum rear tires. The latter change was made so racers could get more use out of their worn down Can-Am and F1 tires. The final rules will be posted soon.

Seeding after qualifying will always be dependant on the number of entries. The process will be similar to the USRA consi/semi program but NO ONE will be seeded directly into any main.

Thank you for the fast reply. Great to see qualifying make a return. Sounds like it will be similar to the Tech 'n Go we ran at The Sano last year, is that correct? I felt that worked exceptionally well. Also, I'm especially glad to see the .790 tire spec, as we won't have to discard so many pairs of $9-$10 tires!

[GB14x]

I really like everything so far, especially the smaller tire rules for two of the four classes. What about the race fees? I'm hoping you'll keep it to a reasonable level, no need to buy awards & so forth. How about some inexpensive box stickers?

[Larry Mattingly]

Gary

Good to see your back...

Hope to see you at Tom Thumb, even though I detest qualifying...

LM

[Gary Adams]

Larry, good to hear from you. Hope you're feeling better, I know it's been a rough time for you.

Don't sweat the qualifying. As long as it's done properly and seeded fairly, I think you might grow to enjoy it. For me it was a smooth process in Chicago at The Sano last year, and I found it fairly simple to fall back into a qualifying mindset after running round robins.

Looking forward to seeing you and Rick at some of our races. Take care.


Gary Adams

[Larry Mattingly]

Hi Gary

Getting better every day. Don't need the cane and walker any longer...

I seriously doubt I will ever 'enjoy' qualifying... My personal opinion is that it is a waste of time and effort. But, it's not my series, so they can do what they want.

I'll probably just scratch in qualifying...

See you in September.

LM

[The Number of]

I'll probably just scratch in qualifying...

LM

I was pitted behind you at the R-4 and noticed that you scratched alot!

Good to see you are up and about Larry,keep a close eye on your diabetes and especially the feet,

having it myself I know what you are going through. Bill

[Larry Mattingly]

Bill

...

Thanks Bill...

It has my 'attention' now...

LM

[Lucky Me]

I really like everything so far, especially the smaller tire rules for two of the four classes. What about the race fees? I'm hoping you'll keep it to a reasonable level, no need to buy awards & so forth. How about some inexpensive box stickers?

I understand what Gary is saying and respect his opinion,however.... I think awards are in order for the ORS
I personally would not have a problem with a small contribution to help reward racers for there efforts and success. I am sure there are many ways to skin this cat, maybe the ORS will take this under consideration as well
as some conversation from other participating racers in the ORS series.

Thank you.

[Mark Wampler]

With regard to CanAm rules, are you enforcing strict IRRA rules. Are there any differences?

(Hello Gary)

[Ron Hershman]

I really like everything so far, especially the smaller tire rules for two of the four classes. What about the race fees? I'm hoping you'll keep it to a reasonable level, no need to buy awards & so forth. How about some inexpensive box stickers?

Race Fees..... 15.00 for the first class entered and 10.00 for each entered class after that. The extra 5 is for practice time on race day

I understand what Gary is saying and respect his opinion,however.... I think awards are in order for the ORS
I personally would not have a problem with a small contribution to help reward racers for there efforts and success. I am sure there are many ways to skin this cat, maybe the ORS will take this under consideration as well
as some conversation from other participating racers in the ORS series.

Thank you.

There will be more awards per day this year handed out. Wait and see.

With regard to CanAm rules, are you enforcing strict IRRA rules. Are there any differences?

(Hello Gary)

F-1, Can-Am and Retro Flexi are using full and strict IRRA rules.

[Gary Adams]

"It was decided to run Flexi last because we felt that the majority of Flexi racers would be locals that would not have the long drive home that others might. Our thought was to give our traveling racers an earlier leave time which hopefully would encouage more travel to out-of-town races."

After giving this some additional thought, I'm afraid I still have to disagree with this line of thinking. Consider this: You're asking Flexi racers to wait around all day for their race, in order to give out-of-towners an earlier start back to encourage more out of town racers. As it stands now, it is no great difference in distance to attend races only being held at two locations. Racers who want to participate will travel whether it is to Tom Thumb or T/R, they're not that far apart.

Further, when the out-of-towners leave earlier, who will be around to marshal for the Flexi guys who have been marshalling Retro races all day? Doesn't seem quite fair to me for those guys. Especially if we are the least bit interested in growing this series! That's why I offered to provide loaner cars for Flexi drivers who want to experience what it's like to qualify and mix it up with the more seasoned racers. Not to mention it will help those in the business to sell more products at higher prices as these new racers get the building bug, and want to move up in classes, controllers, motors, the whole works.

Seems to me everyone wins in this scenario: Ohio Retro Series grows with the infusion of Flexi racers; Flexi racers gain exposure to the next step up in the hobby; track owners sell more products to those racers wanting to learn and grow who will need more and more expensive parts and pieces to become competitive; and finally, the level of competition itself will begin to grow as newer racers become more accustomed to the building and competing, resulting in increasing numbers of racers at each turnout.

I hope I'm not alone in my willingness to loan cars to the Flexi racers. To perpetuate and grow this hobby, we geezers are going to have to show them how it's done, and help them along the way. Everyone wins, in my opinion.

Climbing down off my soapbox now, thanks for listening to me, and please, other racers, let me know how you feel about a loaner program.

[Ron Hershman]

I would also like to point out that this coming years entry fees are the same as last years.

[Tom Thumb Hobbies]

Speaking as a raceway owner and NOT as a ORS BoD this is something that we, and every series I have ever participated in, had to wrestle with. The age old question of "Who goes last?" Back in the day Grp 7 ran last. Why should they have to wait all day?? So we reversed the program. Now another group of racers were unhappy. OK...so let's rotate every race. Guess what? Yet another group of dissatisfied racers. The only certainty about this is that there is NO perfect solution.

NOW...speaking as an ORS BoD...using our collective past experiences and, after peering into our crystal balls in an attempt to predict what the new season will bring, we made our decision to run Flexi last. Is it the perfect solution...maybe not. But it IS based on many hours of thought and consideration.

One more thing. Your offer to loan cars to Flexi racers is fantastic. Maybe by letting them know that other racers have Can-Am or F1's they can run might make them come earlier to join the fun.
We believe that the vast majority of Flexi racers will be local people just starting in the hobby. They have probably not been bitten hard enough by the "bug" yet to commit to much traveling to races. They can choose to come early and watch the other races previous to theirs or they can simply stay home until just before tech. The time to start getting them excited about racing is NOT at these bigger races but during house races or simply practice sessions. Including Flexi in the ORS series gives them something to shoot for. We hope that it will reinforce, but not necessarily start, their addiction to the hobby.

On the other hand comparing the distances between the raceways is not really relevant. We draw from all over the state and even some of the surrounding states. Giving these long distance travelers a earlier start home hopefully will encourage them to attend more events. One way to DISCOURAGE racers is to make the day drag on seemingly forever.

OK..putting my raceway owners hat back on....Gary, I DO NOT disagree with you. You make some valid points. Both points of view are equally supported. BUT, in my opinion (and by the BoD), past experience tips the scale slightly in the direction of running Flexi last. Once again speaking for the BoD, everything is always watched for possible improvement. If it doesn't work this season then changes will be considered for next.

[John Streisguth]

Well put Mike. No perfect answer to this, just trying the best anyone can.

[Jacob Shiplet]

What kind of rubber should we be taking down to TR? Wonder Rubber? Alpha's?

[Ron Hershman]

Now I am going to throw in my personal opinion.........................

In regards to the Retro Flex class in OVR, I did not want to run this class..... I was happy to have a series with just two classes being run in a day. F-1 and Can-Am.... the two "premier" IRRA classes.... that's all I wanted to see. There is nothing "retro" about flexi racing except the body used. But if Flexi racers can use what they already have to come to the races and then use that as a "springboard" into the other classes..... we have accomplished what we want to see happen.

Mike and Steve felt the need for a "entry level" class to be ran at the events and being all raceway run a flexi based class, Retro Flexi was a logical choice for this.

My concern is and always be... how do we keep it a true entry level class? In my opinion only newer racers should be allowed to race in it. The better drivers shouldn't be allowed to run off the newer racers. I wanted to see the class be controlled as to who or who couldn't run it based on what I just wrote.

So after much discussion, it was decided to run the Retro Flexi class and let it be open to all drivers.

While we want to see lots of new racers in Retro Flexi and then progressing into the other retro classes we are running, it is not our job to make the Flexi class the biggest class of the four we are running.

If we were to run Retro Flexi first class of the day...... EVERYONE would wind up racing Retro Flexi and possibly running off all of the newer racers. We already did that in regards to JK Spec.... it was open to everyone and it never grew or provided newer racers which was the concept of the JK Spec class to begin with.

So if we run off all of the newer racers, then how will we get the newer racers to move into the other classes? We won't.

Think about being a new racer and traveling to a track a hour away....getting your doors blown off..... are you going to spend the money and time to go back and do it all over again? Most will not.

To most of you who have already posted..... it makes no difference when Flexi is ran in the program...... if you want to run the class...you will no matter if it's first up or last.


But just remember.... the Retro Flexi class is there to get newer racers involved in what WE all are racing.... not another class for ALL of us to RACE in.

[Ron Hershman]

What kind of rubber should we be taking down to TR? Wonder Rubber? Alpha's?

Yes...... soft to medium Wonder Rubber..... anyone's choice to what MFG they choose to run. Maybe early in the day you will want Chem treated tires on a bigger hub.

I ran Chem treated on my F-1 and Wonder on my Can-Am both times we have raced retro there.