181 replies to this topic

[spudboy]

Can someone please describe the differences between all the King track variants?

Elsewhere in this blog (Ohio 1/32 racing series) there is a reference to a "speed" King, an "American" King and a "blue" King. I suspect a speed King has big banks, an American is original or based on original specs, and the blue King is...? I'm also aware of the "pinched" King and its straightaway/underpass.

I imagine there are other variants as well. If this has been discussed elsewhere on the blog please give me a pointer. Thanks.

Cheers!

[Marty Stanley]

Nate,

I do not claim to be an expert on the King track, but I have seen many different configurations.

To the best of my knowledge a King must have a lap length of 155 feet, and going around from the driver's station, a banked turn, a chute, a deadman, a finger, a short straight, a 90 degree turn, a donut, a lead on turn to complete the lap.

While the 155 feet is very defined, the amount of banking, tightness of any of the turns or amount of positive camber is not specified. I do believe that is where the many different names come from. Some track builders put more banking into the corners and some of their own personalities into the construction.

However the configuration is always the same and the tracks are a 'standard' that everyone likes to race on.

The "American King" was a 150 foot lap length, that grew into the "Blue King" that we all love today.

[Cheater]

Nate,

There isn't much to tell.

American Model Raceways created the original King track design in the early '60s. As you probably know, AMR color-coded the sides on their tracks and the King's color was blue, like the orange Monarch, red Imperial, black Regal, and the purple Sovereign. So an "American King" and a "blue King" are really the same track.

Since the '60s, every wooden track built has been essentially a one-of-a-kind custom job, i.e. they're built one at a time. And many trackbuilders have modified the original AMR design for various reasons: to fit a specific space, to make a faster track, etc., etc.

There really aren't accepted definitions for terms like "speed King" or "swoopy King". You're supposing a level of standardization that slot car racing has never enjoyed at almost any level.

[Cheater]

Marty,

Check the link in my first post and look at the picture of the King there. You'll note the caption is "The King 155". AFAIK, 155 feet was the lap length on the AMR Kings.

BTW, that's one of the dirty little secrets of the slot racing "world record" crowd: not every King listed as being 155 in length is actually that long...

One other point (and I may have my numbers wrong), but the AMR tracks all had 4 inch lane centers. Most modern tracks are build with wider lane centers, 4-1/4 inch usually (I think).

[tonyp]

The original American blue Kings were built on jigs and were essentially exactly alike. Nutley raceway upped the game when the Engleman was ruined by a leaking roof and it was replaced with a King. The surface was sanded and painted with epoxy paint. All the bumps were leveled out, and the slots re-routed so braid was below the surface. The corner sections were raised up and wedged at the bottoms for more banking. Lots of cool power that did not blow up motors. This track became the standard for King tracks until the European built tracks started to appear. (Joel's Race Place in MD was the only original blue King equal to Nutley's, and of course the one at BIR Bob Emott's shop as Bob was the one who did Nutley's.)

Once the Hasse tracks started to appear these was no standard any more and "World" records became meaningless. It got worse and worse, as my old friend JimHT said, they built the tracks faster to set a record, instead of the cars...

[W. J. Dougherty]

Most of the fastest King tracks are now being built by Gary Gerding. Here is his website. As you may see his tracks have the same basic feel but as was said earlier, he does do some tweaks to make them different. These tracks do not have radical banking but they do have the right combination of banking and turn radii that allow racers to keep a vast amount of speed up through the turns therefore making faster lap times.

Gerding Fast Tracks

Thanks, Gary, for all your innovative design and hard work making slots faster...

wjd

[Ron Hershman]

Simply put... an American Blue King is the original King track.

Anything else called a King track is just that.

While the layout is basically the same between an American Blue King and all of the others, any non original King is usually different in banking and turn radii from the original.

If you learned on a American Blue King track... you can drive any King track. If you are new and have a newer King track from one of the other builders... you may suffer a bit your first time on a original American King.

[TSR]

And as Tony says, if you want to set a new "world" record, no need for a new car, just get a track built in such a way that the "record" will fall...

[tonyp]

Ron,

I never ran a non-America King until I started Retro racing. I agree. If you can drive a real one, the rest are easy.

[Ron Hershman]

Let's put it this simpler way... if it's not a original American King... then it's a King in "name" only.

[tonyp]

PdL,

I remember getting on the phone from Nutley Saturday nights and calling California to find out if they broke the "World Record" during the big race going on. That was part of the fun and a big deal at the time. It was cool to be the fastest man in the world when it meant something...

[Ron Hershman]

The "real deal" or the original.



One that is King in "name only".

[tonyp]

Now that is a slot car track!

[Ron Hershman]

Which one??? Top or bottom? LOL.

[Jerry Ward]

Ron,

Does anyone have a Emperor 220 with the crossovers? Never seen one like in the picture. Looks like a cool track!!

Jerry

[spudboy]

Ah, so it really is simple. There are 1) original AMR Blue Kings, built on jigs to spec and 2) all of the "bastards". Got it!

When MVH moved to the Union St store in ~1980, Dick had an AMR Blue King and I loved it. I haven't raced on a King of any variation since so I am looking forward to running on MVH's new Gerding King when it reopens. I expect it will be fast and smooth so that's nice but I wonder if it might lack the character of the AMR track. Time will tell.

Thanks, folks.

[TSR]

I remember getting on the phone from Nutley Saturday nights and calling California to find out if they broke the "World Record" during the big race going on. That was part of the fun and a big deal at the time. It was cool to be the fastest man in the world when it meant something...

Indeed. In the new book, the record log is a lot more accurate than what's shown on various websites now, and you will like it a lot better. It starts earlier, too!

[tonyp]

I hope you have my two... LOL.

[tonyp]

Ron,

You have to ask? The top of course.

[TSR]

I hope you have my 2...LOL.

I will get back to you on this.

What's your name again?

[Ron Hershman]

Does anyone have a Emperor 220 with the crossovers? Never seen one like in the picture. Looks like a cool track!!

Buzzy's in New York... not sure it's set-up these days.

There were only three Emperors built.

[Kehlo]

Hi,

There's a nice recent "King" collection here. Be aware of German language . Horst's home track may be on top.

If you know a track that's missing please tell me or Horst, we'll be happy to add it (pics welcome!).

Have fun,

Christian

[MSwiss]

I remember getting on the phone from Nutley Saturday nights and calling California to find out if they broke the "World Record" during the big race going on. That was part of the fun and a big deal at the time. It was cool to be the fastest man in the world when it meant something...

Once it didn't mean anything, you had to do it more often to even have it be semi-cool.

Group 7 - Pro Fast Lap - Qualifying
Date Name Time Location Event
3/3/2007 Paul "Beuf" Pedersen 1.404 Buena Park Rcwy - Buena Park, CA Western States
10/8/2006 Paul "Beuf" Pedersen 1.433 Buena Park Rcwy - Buena Park, CA BP 500
6/18/2006 Benny Justice 1.4632 The Track - Gaithersburg, MD Summer Shoot-Out
5/21/2006 Vlado Okali (SLV) 1.4808 Top Slot Racing - Rio de Janeiro Brazil NPRA 25th Worlds
11/13/2005 Marcio Paschoalin (BR) 1.492 Top Slot Racing - Rio de Janeiro Brazil Brazilian Nats
8/21/2005 Forrest Watchers 1.501 Buena Park Rcwy - Buena Park, CA USRA Nats
6/11/05 Luis "Gugu" Bernardino (BR) 1.503 Kouvola, Finland ESROC Worlds
5/29/05 Benny Justice 1.542 Chicagoland Rcwy - LaGrange IL Chicago 500
4/14/04 Jari Porttinen (SF) 1.548 Kouvola, Finland Finnish Nats
5/18/03 Mario "MSP" Schöne (G) 1.588 Monza Rcwy - São Paulo, Brazil NPRA Worlds
4/4/03 Ron Herrera 1.599 Slot Cars Intl - Tulsa, OK Tulsa Spring Fling
2/23/03 Paul Ciccarello 1.613 Port Jeff Rcwy - Coram, NY Barnburner
7/31/02 P.A. Watson 1.624 Buena Park Rcwy - Buena Park, CA USRA Nats Warmup
8/?/2001 Mike Swiss 1.632 Port Jeff Rcwy - Coram, NY USRA Nats
?/?/2001 George Teman 1.659 Port Jeff Rcwy - Coram, NY Worlds
?/?/2000 Paul "Beuf" Pedersen 1.662 Buena Park Rcwy - Buena Park, CA USRA Nats
1,673 John Tore Anderson (S) Buena Park, US 6-7/3 1999 16 volt USRA legal
1,720 Mike Swiss (USA) Buena Park 500 Buena Park, US 28-29/11 1998 16 volt USRA legal
1,740 Robert Pittman (AU) Australian Nats? - 1996 16 volt USRA legal
1,759 Don Perko (USA) JK raceway, Chicago, US 3/3 1996 16 volt USRA legal
1,814 Don Perko (USA) PCH Raceway, Ventura, CA, US 11/2 1996 16 volt USRA legal
1,821 Paul Ciccarello (USA) ? Oct- 1996 16 volt USRA legal
1,787 Paul Ciccarello (USA) - Port Jeffersson, US Febr 1995 Unlimited vo
1,840 Kimmo Rautama (SF) Worlds 1994 Monsteras, Sweden 12/5 1994 from Euroslot no 16
1,850 Craig Landry (USA) 1993 Nats California,US Sept-1993
1,955 Petteri Pihronen (SF) Monsteras Monsteras, Sweden Febr-1992 from Euroslot no 15
1,970 Mike Swiss (USA) Orlando, Florida, US Oct-1990 from Euroslot no 15
1,853 Andy Wasserman (USA) Florida USRA Orlando, Florida, US Oct-1990 Record under debate…
2,017 Mike Swiss (USA) Grand raceway, Broadview, IL, US March-1990 from Euroslot no 15
2,027 Gary Puetz (USA) Midwest USRA Chicago, US 25/2 1990
2,051 Andy Wasserman (USA) American Hobbies, US
2,070 Gary Puetz (USA) Worlds Chicago, US 1/7 1988
2,137 Gary Gerding (USA) DJ Summer Shutout DJ raceway, US 17/6 1988
2,168 Nick Csersics (USA) Chicago 500 Chicago, US 22/5 1988
2,181 Jon Laster (USA) Worlds Toulouse, F Nov-1987
2,220 Paul Pfeiffer (USA) Midwest USRA Grand raceway, Chicago, IL, US
2,251 Gary Gerding (USA)
2,297 Paul Pfeiffer (USA)
2,300 Jon Laster (USA) Nats W.U
2,307 Lee Gilbert (USA) DJ raceway, US 21/6 1987
2,335 Kim Burleson (USA) Electric Eagle raceway, US
2,361 Mike Swiss (USA) Broadway raceway, Chicago, IL, US
2,374 Mike Swiss (USA) Broadway raceway, Chicago, IL, US 23/2 1986
2,426 Mike Swiss (USA) Broadway raceway, Chicago, IL, US
2,459 Jon Laster (USA) ESRAC Euronats MRTU, Uden , NL 15/12 1995 from Euroslot no 14 (not record???)
2,455 Tom Hansen (USA) Speedway & Hobby Too, US 10/13/1985
2,460 Tom Hansen (USA) Speedway & Hobby Too, US 9/21/1985
2,475 Mike Swiss (USA) Midwest Nats Broadway raceway, Chicago, US 18/8 1985
2,490 Csaba Szekelyhidi (USA) - Broadway raceway, Momence, US 18/8 1985
2,511 Csaba Szekelyhidi (USA) Broadway raceway ,Bradley, IL, US from Euroslot no 15
2,544 Gary Puetz (USA) Broadway raceway, US 21/ 7 1985 Semi-Pro record
2,680 George Teman (USA) Broadway raceway, Bradley, IL, US June 1985
2,706 Jon Laster (USA) Sept 83 from Euroslot no 14
2,831 Stuart Koford (USA) Midwest USRA Broadway Raceway, US 1983
2,973 Justin Thomas (USA) Centerville, OH, US Oct-1982
3,202 Barry Magee (GB) MRTU 500 MRTU Uden, NL Aug-1982 info Hans van Es
3,501 Steve Bogut (USA) 1977
[3,66068] Jim Difalco (USA) (no record!) 1976 Limited glue record
[3,63] Dave Willits (USA) (no record!) Florida, US 1973 Model Car Journal
[3,65 or 3"75] Philippe de Lespinay (USA/F) (no record!) Cash & Burn, CA - US 1973 Model Car Journal
3,59 to 3,66 Frederic Strauss (USA) Buzzarama, Brooklyn, NY -US Nov- 1972 Miniature Auto Racing N°6/3 Jan 73
3,75 or 3"77 Philippe de Lespinay (USA/F) Speed & Sport, Lynwood, CA - US 1972 Model Car Journal
3,88 or 3"98 Earl Campbell (USA) Speed & Sport, Lynwood, CA-US 1971 Model Car Journal
1970 Joel "Monty" Montague 4.11 Stan's Hobby Shop, Tampa Bay, FL NCC Series Race #6
4,42 Mike Steube (USA) Speed & Sport, Lynwood, CA - US 11/1 1970
4,81 Chris Vitucci (USA) 2nd Mura Pro-Am Don´s raceway, US 5/4 1969

[tonyp]

4.74, New Worlds Record

April 26, 1969 - Wolcot raceway, second NY Car Model race..

Mike, you only need to do it once if you do it with a Marcos Mantis body...

[Neuspeed]

So what's the story with the King Cobra? How many are around? Is it a true 160" track? Would it be harder to drive than the King tracks today?