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Jail Door: Duffy's "Slithery Jungle Tails"


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#1 Duffy

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Posted 24 August 2011 - 09:52 PM

In a week where it seems everybody's arguing and nobody's building, I figure it's a good time to post some thoughts on a class that it seems--nobody's building...But, I'd passed along my veteran GP chassis (Duffy #02 if anyone's counting) and needed a new JD ride for the race this weekend, so I pulled out my brazing rod and went at it. Kind of a nice change from building Can-Am frames.

So as I set up this build, some of the stuff I've been applying to my current torsion-based Retro builds crept in. Here's how that worked:
One thing everybody talks about with these JDs is how fragile they are, how easily out-of-tweak they'll get if you wall 'em. Maybe so...I haven't found mine to be too crooked after a race, but maybe it's just because I'm so d@mned slow!--OR maybe there's something really viable in making these big swoopy gentle-radius bends and staggering 'em, and maybe there's a benefit to rigidity in soldering every wire available right up next to the other. --Making a [bronze & solder] pan, so to speak.
Maybe. Let's try it.

I chose to use the McLaren "Serenissima" bod from Howmet's Bodies For Beer International on this ride, and that's a pretty narrow car, a quarter-inch under the allowed JDGP width; but I want to play with the concept some guys have concerning keeping weight low & close to centerline with these cars; lacking any real width anyway, nor any aero advantage from a wide bod, it seemed like a good time to try narrow & dense.

Duffy 49 McL 03.jpg

So the inner run of rails just nuzzles up against the motor here, affording two runs inside the Duffy JD bracket. the inner-est one got a little bend to fetch up against the cheeks just like the forward set does--

Duffy 49 McL 02.jpg

--And the outer runs also snake around to keep everything as dense and in-contact as possible. Put 'em all together, and--

Duffy 49 McL 05.jpg

--And we get the "Slithery Jungle Tail" in all its glory. What I'm hoping by all this is to minimize any gaps or structural faults that might flex independently, in a sense creating a "pan" of wire. Initial bending tests indicate the idea works, and there's no need for those small right-angle gussets we like to use on Sports Car chasses.
The other thing you see here is the steel hoop I fit into the gap shere the bracket cheeks are; it needed grinding down to the .040" cheek thickness.

Duffy 49 McL 01.jpg

While I was doing all this fancy squeezy-narrow junk, I took the opportunity to do my math and stack up all the bits aforehand. A quirk in the Duffy JD Bracket (it's so hard to get quality components these days!) necessitated a droparm stackup of .615" width, so when I made up my droparm central unit I filed away half that loss before attaching the bearing rods, and then filed those to slip-fit. I vainly believe a perfect slip in the droparm is more stable: better & faster racers have pooh-poohed that conceit.

Duffy 49 McL 06.jpg

So there's the Duffy "Chillon Castle" GP Jaildoor, as close to a solid pan as I could manage. The droparm is also kept as close to minimum-movement as possible in up-down mode.

Duffy 49 McL 07.jpg

A couple of guys (YOU know who you are!) who like to mess with wire and the limits of motion will quickly hip to some interesting possibilities vis-a-vis selective rod grouping and partial-soldering. To those I say only, --it's a bright future.


Duffy 49 McL 11.jpg

Here's the body mounted. Livery is totally made-up. My sentimental approach to Jaildoor determined my exclusive use of brushes for the body; sometimes it's fun to be sixteen again.
I really do enjoy painting, I should gear up to do more.

Duffy 49 McL 09.jpg

I wanted to save as much of the transaxle as possible--like I say, I intended this to be a celebration 0f 16-year-old Duffy's scale-like leanings...so I spent more time than I should've cutting&fitting&trimming&cuttingsomemore...and even then, the crown gear was jammed. That's when I pulled out my soldering iron and dialed it up to LOW, & gently pulled the box out to clear. I swear, if I'd hipped to that trick before I'd started cutting away...

So that's what I'm taking over to SAL this weekend. I'll report on how well I wrought after.
Duffy


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#2 Mopar Rob

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Posted 24 August 2011 - 10:01 PM

In a week where it seems everybody's arguing and nobody's building,


I've built 2 chassis this week, but don't want to show any photos. They're a secret :secret: Just kidding :laugh2: one's an Aero stock car, but everyones seen photos of them so I didn't post




BTW:


Nice JD build
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#3 slotcarone

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Posted 24 August 2011 - 10:41 PM

:D Duff that's a beautiful chassis!!!!! I don't know if it is legal though with the twisted rails in the back like that.

Mike Katz

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#4 Pablo

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 12:16 AM

I give it 2 thumbs up !!!!!!!!!! :D
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#5 Joe Mig

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 04:03 AM

Looks great I hope we have a JD race this weekend. :D
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#6 MrWeiler

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 04:12 AM

My sentimental approach to Jaildoor determined my exclusive use of brushes for the body; sometimes it's fun to be sixteen again.


I've been doing the (no air) brush thing on some of my vintage bodies too...it's fun and takes a while to finish...

I like the "bundle-o-snakes" chassis...
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#7 Duffy

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 04:53 AM

Duff that's a beautiful chassis!!!!! I don't know if it is legal though with the twisted rails in the back like that.

...Ah.

Well, that is a concern, innit? The strictest reading of the Rule--
3e. No tapering (or bending of the rails except for the bend up to bracket or axle tube) of the rails, only parallel rails
from the front to the rear connecting the axles.
--would disallow it. I didn't read quite that strict.

I've campaigned cars with work like this back to chassis #02 back in mid-2009:

jdCoop2.jpg

I have always understood this clause to refer to gross tapering along the whole chassis; what bends happen as the
rails rise up to meet bracket & axle, those don't affect the ideal of parallelism over the length of the chassis.


This didn't originate with me (I've just divined a possible structural advantage here), I've seen it on others' as well.
If there's a problem now, I can think of three cars showing up this weekend at SAL that'll share in it. (Too bad you'll
miss the fireworks, Mike!)

Duffy





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#8 JerseyJohn

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 07:32 AM

 a MASTERPIECE Duff. love the drop arm !!


JJ TRADE MARK BANNER copy.jpg

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#9 tonyp

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 07:51 AM

Duffy, Check rules on piano wire rear brace. I believe it states it has to be inside bracket....

"And if my thought-dreams could be seen they'd probably put my head in a guillotine. But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only." - Dylan

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#10 Noose

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 08:17 AM

This whole bent rail thing has been a controversy even in the sports cars rules. The "intent" of the rule, 3e, which you properly cited was that there would be no "squiggles" in the rails as they went from the motor bracket to the front. The last picture looks OK to me. Your latest one does not IMO.

Also, Tony is correct regarding the piano wire rear brace.3h. A piano wire U-brace may be used inside the motor bracket to reinforce the bracket and protect the crown gear and a single piece of straight .063 piano wire is allowed to be used inside the 3 piece drop arm hinge.

Now, will you be banned from this on Saturday? Only if Mistress Irene decides to cut the party short. Run em for fun. We'll have a protest claim afterward. :laugh2:

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#11 tonyp

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 08:18 AM

How much, Maybe Ill protest it....

"And if my thought-dreams could be seen they'd probably put my head in a guillotine. But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only." - Dylan

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#12 Marty Stanley

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 08:31 AM

{snip}
Livery is totally made-up. My sentimental approach to Jaildoor determined my exclusive use of brushes for the body; sometimes it's fun to be sixteen again.
{/snip}



Duffy,

Isn't that the philosphy that originally created the "1966 Rod & Custom" type of cars?

I remember one of the old timers here making a statement one day. That statement was, "Back in the 60's we went to the raceways to run our cars. Today we go to the raceways to race our cars."

To me this category of slot car can be a real hoot ro race. They don't handle as well as the more technical cars - which to me is a good thing. Of course many folks today tend to like the easy way - high banks, lots of positive camber and such to make it easier to negotiate around a track. Once they spend the time to learn a technical track, sll of a sudden they really start to appreciate that type of track. I think the same can be said for the types of cars.

Yes, a car like you have might be more susceptible to damage - I know I saw a car - not mine - make contact with the outer wall in a banked turn one day. A new car had to be constructed. Prior to the incident, all the rails were compliant with the 'straight rule'. After the incident they kind of resembled your wonderful 'bed of snakes' type of configuration. H'mmm, isn't that quite prototypical? I mean if you watch a Formula 1 race, when a car contacts the wall, it is usually finished?

I think we really need to have more of this type of racing as it is fun and enjoyable for many of today's racers.

Just my opinion of course.
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#13 Pablo

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 10:09 AM

I postulate the clever Duffmaster chose "Scratchbuilding" forum vice "Retro" forum for this build because he well knew it was beyond the envelope :ph34r:
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#14 Noose

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 10:15 AM

The JD GP cars, are as the Sports Cars, lots of fun to run or race. The GP cars are quite the handful though as compared to the Sports cars that's for sure. The Falcon 2s are as fast as you want to go with these.

Resoldering a front axle tube seems to be commonplace after one of these takes one of those Sarti flying leaps. Keeping them sliding an not sticking is the trick.

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#15 Duffy

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 04:39 PM

I love these "astringent" moments, these little bubbling-ups of "I Wuzz WWRONNNG..."
I mean it, there's something really delightful in learning that I've goofed gloriously (and nobody's hurt, and no money or property lost--these disclaimers also need to be present to fully savor the fun). A mistake of ignorance carries a gift of clearer thinking. I really mean that.

So: awww shoot, all that cleverness and it's DQ'd fair and square.

Tony's spot-on with the steel hoop, under is not inside (and yah, Marty, I've had dates like that too).
On reflection, I recall not doing this in an earlier build, for precisely this reason. My bad.
And Noose has declared: squiggles past the threshold of the bracket, as part of the upward bend, legal; bends while in transit to the upsweep, not legal.
Okay then.

And I had a ball building this one this week & I'll see how it fares on the track, and now I can build another one too! Is this a great hobby or what?

The bad news is, I may not be getting over to run this on Saturday: got a situation that may not resolve by then (see my wailing & hand-wringing over in the "SAL Up Next!" thread). Stay tuned, though, I'll be sure to document a slightly-less-Slithery tail in this thread, soon.

Duffy
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#16 Duffy

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 04:43 PM

And: "Aww Shoot" ch.2:

Now I gotta go search the 'Net for a whole 'nother background-pic "Dungeon" to name the new chassis after. I tell ya, Medieval castles are few & far between these days. You guys're making me work too hard.

Duf
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#17 tonyp

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 04:50 PM

Duffy, see what happens when you think too hard. You don't want to damage that pink cauliflower thats already leaning off kilter inside your head.

"And if my thought-dreams could be seen they'd probably put my head in a guillotine. But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only." - Dylan

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#18 Marty Stanley

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 06:20 PM

Posted Image



Well, since you can't race it, have you thought of using it as a replacement for a 'lava lamp'?

You might want to put some mood music on and really test it to see if it would work.

I'm thinking it might just start a new trend.
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#19 Noose

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 06:57 PM

He can race it this Sat if he makes it.

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#20 Tex

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 06:57 PM

You can race it. Just cut the dang gear guard OFF and replace it with one INside the bracket.
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#21 Duffy

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Posted 25 August 2011 - 07:46 PM

Naah. I'm not in control of where I'll be Saturday (and anybody who says different is selling something!) but it's got nothing to do with this. Marty makes a good point: this car's to RUN and I had a ball building it. There're a couple new JD chassis coming, race-legal. I'm gonna keep this around just like it is, it'd be more trouble than it's worth to modify it at this point.

Part of what I do with my threads (since I can't lather my immense racing chops on y'all) is to provide experiential anecdotes that Weejuns like myself might draw from. I hope this is entertaining as well as instructive.

Duf
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#22 Prof. Fate

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Posted 26 August 2011 - 02:18 PM

Hi

What he isn't telling you is that on the phone, I am no help. No local JD class, no interest, however, every Friday, several of us get together and race survivors we have from 1966. Even with the class motor, none of them would be legal because of how they were built, but that is the experience I have!

That said, locally, people have had me build replicas of locally well known cars of this period, and we have had some relatively large fields. But as Mike said, no prizes, money or anything. Among the core group, one of the cars, a pianowire chassis under a Pactra '66 Ferrari has dominated most of the races since it was built.

No one is heartbroken. We are just playing with the cars.

Fate
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#23 Mike Patterson

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Posted 26 August 2011 - 08:59 PM

Duffy,

NEAT chassis! Just looking at that motor bracket makes my brain hurt. :D

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#24 Duffy

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Posted 26 August 2011 - 09:22 PM

Ohh yah, the bracket's the LEGAL bit!! You'll see more of that, I'm already plotting even sexier and snakier and legaler bendies.
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#25 JohnnySlotcar

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Posted 27 August 2011 - 07:01 AM

Trade it to me!!! I want it. John
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#26 Horsepower

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Posted 05 September 2011 - 10:24 PM

I can't quite put my finger on it, but it LOOKS Steampunk. :scratch_one-s_head: B)
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#27 NY Nick

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 06:54 AM

Hey Duffy how about that ,lets just race what we build, Kenny would not care.
I have one that is from 1966.
Only thing I want t use a 16D motor.
Nice work on the car, work of art.
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#28 Duffy

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 01:35 PM

Hey Duffy how about that ,lets just race what we build, Kenny would not care.

Fine with me, let's get some guys to the track--how 'bout Sunday?




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#29 NY Nick

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 04:43 PM

I will call the Guy's, late afternoon?
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#30 Duffy

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 04:50 PM

Cool. I started this over on the SAL board that nobody looks at, so we could stop hijacking my otherwise-useless thread here.
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#31 Duffy

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Posted 12 September 2011 - 09:24 PM

O--kay: so, I promised, More twist, more bends, more Snaky Goodness in every box of Jaildoor Golden Crisp...and gennulmenns, I do b' lieve I've hereby d' livered.

See, like the preceding conversation should point out pretty abundantly, it don't matter how Cool you are, it's how the Prevailing Wisdom (read: RULES Pirate) sees what you've done. (This should be no surprise, really: not to anyone who's attended High School in the US, if not elsewhere--you step too far outside the Dominant Paradigm, you get Sanded after school. It's Just The Way.)

So, after having a ball making the last <illegal> JD chassis, I set out to have a ball making one that fit the Rule. And even more so.
I should clarify: there's not much really new we can discuss with J/d frames-and that was the whole idea! But the fairly-standardized format of the type still allows for some creative wiggle room--and that's how I'm approaching these more and more. After a hard week of building Can-Am, how nice to settle in to a JD, and create. sorta.
Anyway, that's what I'm about here.

A JD Sports Car first:

Duf50 LT70 01.jpg
So, all rails but the outermost (in JDSC) must be parallel--"no tapering or bending...except for the bend up to bracket or axle tube"--okay, so I took that to heart. Now, I've got a lot of chassis out there now with this, so nothing's new except where I am trying to learn from the mistakes in this thread--and I played that literally. Look closely inside the upsweep bend and see the plier mark for the .062" sidewise bend on the innermost run of rails.

Duf50 LT70 03.jpg

I get two runs of rails inside the Duffy .875" JD Bracket--I'm experimenting with inboard mass distribution and durability in this series--and then the next one-and-pair outboard get fitted after. As many rails as I can affix to the bracket cheeks, I do; then the outer one splits off its sister and heads up to the carrier at the outermost spot.

Duf50 LT70 04.jpg

A while back I ran out of Duffy Flag Grommets, so I made some new. These are .38" diameter and undercut to .250" dia. for a bale of 1/16" rod. I like the depth of this groove, as it allows me to completely bury the ends of my fill rods inside the grommet.
It's at this point that I start to measure carefully, making sure my rod stackup is staying inside my allowed space; to save me some major filing & fitting later.

Duf50 LT70 05.jpg

Now, this is just pure arrogance: the extra stackup of my 5/8" wide main rails mean I get 10 spaced rods in the "drop" arm, tops. Okay, but as I chopped off and set alongside, I suddenly got all esthetic on my 'oss! and bent&flattened the dipping-end of each run of rod outboard--well I like it, it looks like a reeely good Parker 51 cap!! And this is the point of all this ramble: If you can't have FUN building, do you want to be here? So, any cutoffs on the side courses got a Bend & Clip job, resulting in something Sigourney Weaver oughta be shooting at. I kinda like that.

and--
More a plug for the R-geo chassis jig; the original, stonger and more versatile, and the more you build the more you need more pin holes...

Duf50 LT70 06.jpg

AND more in a couple days.

Duffy


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#32 Pablo

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Posted 12 September 2011 - 09:32 PM

I'm here. :)
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#33 Marty Stanley

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Posted 12 September 2011 - 10:04 PM

And . . . . we're waiting!
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#34 Duffy

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 04:48 AM

There's a reason for More Snaky Goodness, the way my fevered little mind works: I think the use of square and parallel joints allows flexure in a parallelogram sort of way, like a garden gate without diagonal bracing. So a few odd angles should cantilever things and give a little stiffness.

Duf50 LT70 10.jpg

--Oh hey, looka that, the guide grommet's a little crooked! Fix it.

In back, tying the uprights to the bracket takes advantage of the shear property of the bracket's motor face.

Duf50 LT70 11.jpg

Also in this pic, you see the steel bale obediently soldered in inside the bracket cheeks--it helps to go re-read the rules now and then, & find all the thinking you forgot you didn't want to know.

Duf50 LT70 12.jpg

Here's another angle on the angles: everything tied together in swoops and corners, and there's significantly less flex and bounce. --Too much less? I'm gonna find that out. Once I have a "baseline" on the stiffness of this chassis (and some guys will chortle when I use the terms "stiffness" and "JailDoor" in the same thread), I can start working back from that, beginning by selectively soldering along the joined rails to allow some more twist in areas where I can control it.
That's the plan, anyway. I really don't know, but it's fun to play at finding out; and the weird thing is, this work with bronze & pliers has become kinda second-nature to me with some practice, so I'm more casual about just whipping some experiment up for recreation.

So, Vanity Shots of Duffy #50 "Blarney Castle Dungeon"--I'll hang the gear on this over the week and get some shakedown time this weekend.

Duffy

Duf50 LT70 08.jpg

Duf50 LT70 09.jpg


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#35 Pablo

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 06:44 AM

Way to Go, Dufmaster :D SANO ;)
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#36 Mopar Rob

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 06:53 AM

Very art deco looking drop arm, Duff. :rolleyes:
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Rob was right!


#37 Jairus

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 10:09 AM

Shiny!

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#38 Duffy

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 05:43 PM

Thanks, but wait'll it runs. --Wait'll it doesn't suck.

I have nice friends. One PM'd me to ask if my droparm was trimmed off crooked in back--

Duf50 LT70 13.jpg


--and he nobly asked me privately first. Wasn't that sweet? --No, Marty, it's actually only a
little bit not-square but then I just took a blithe swipe with the file to debur--and that's what
you see.

What he didn't see (or ask about, anyway) was the 'orribly sloppy spacer over on the right!
Ohhh, that's gonna hurt for a while.
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#39 tonyp

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 06:12 PM

Duff, shoddy work my man,. For punishment 3 drops of acid flux on your tongue. Lol.

"And if my thought-dreams could be seen they'd probably put my head in a guillotine. But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only." - Dylan

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#40 Marty Stanley

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 06:16 PM

Duff, shoddy work my man,. For punishment 3 drops of acid flux on your tongue. Lol.



Tony,

No acid for Duffy!

Nor for you!
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#41 Duffy

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 06:35 PM

Speaking of flux...

I'm fussy sometimes and mostly not the right times, but here's a really laughable
bit I made up just because I can't bear to keep a rusty old motor around for builds...

Motorses 1.jpg


Pulled down a hunk of STN and made me a more-permanent template to jig chasses up with.

Motorses 2.jpg


It's hollowed out a good bit so as to make it somewhat less of a heat sink. You see a step in the diameter,
which reflects the difference between the PD and FK cans; and likewise the flats on two sides, as there's
a difference in heights as well. The big step across this top flat represents the PD length.

Motorses 3.jpg


These different steps & surfaces denote the minimum tolerances for any structure I may want alongside
the future motor, particularly if I use a non-hypoid setup and want the front edge to lie as close as possible
to the ground plane.

Two hours' work, just to avoid some rust. NOT a right time to be:

Fussy Duffy
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#42 Pablo

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 06:38 PM

One PM'd me to ask if my droparm was trimmed off crooked in back


If anything looks off, it is usually just the camera angle.

Nice jig motor, Duffmaster :D
Paul Wolcott

#43 tonyp

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 06:50 PM

There is your second Evil Duffmaster Products product. I would buy a couple in a heart beat, if I had a heart that is.

Very cool. For that your punishment is reduced to 2 drops of acid flux.

"And if my thought-dreams could be seen they'd probably put my head in a guillotine. But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only." - Dylan

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#44 Duffy

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 06:58 PM

Can I have my sentence reduced for "Drops Served?" Remember, I was the guy who got mixed up one solderin' night and used my mouth for a third hand--with the wrong tool. Meant the pusher stick, got the acid brush.

Products--hm. This is a tough one. it's expensive, for my one-off tooling. Toss-away cans are cheaper by at least a zero.
Not for me to do, I think.
Who do we know with a STAR CNC and a stock of machinable ceramic rod?
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#45 tonyp

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 07:04 PM

Sentence reduced to 2 chassis probation.

"And if my thought-dreams could be seen they'd probably put my head in a guillotine. But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only." - Dylan

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#46 Duffy

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 10:53 AM

This'll probably be the capper for this thread: how many ways can you build a JD roller anyway, and who's interested in building 'em? This ain't exactly a pressing issue. But, since I didn't justify my waste of protoplasm this week by writing the Manifesto for Occupy Wall Street / inventing Broadcast Power / Finding The Lost Chord (I think it's in my sock drawer), I figure there're a couple of things to follow-up on and then we'll let it go.

If you've been following the show up to now, the idea I was working with was to pack mass and rigidity into the confines of the JDGP chassis, both dimension- and rule-wise. So, stuffing things as narrow as possible, I got two rails inside the cheeks of my standard JD bracket and two outside. --That's where I ran into trouble, up above: the snaky bends to get around the bracket aren't legal.

Duffy 50 McFezzi 04.jpg

Okay, so I address that puzzle here, by running the third course directly under the cheeks, and then moving the upright portion over to the outside once the rod breaks the jig plane. This required filing off the bottom of the bracket to conform to the radius of the rod, and then bending the rod to move the upright over .040" (the thickness of the bracket material). I don't have real good photos of this, I hope the description helps--but here's the
rear view showing the inner course on one side of the cheek, bent over to pass the next-out course with its upright joined forward of the bushing; and the first outer course more subtly bent to nuzzle up against the cheek as well. That makes this one mightily-nuzzled cheek. Romantic.

Duffy 50 McFezzi 03.jpg

The happy advantage of this was, I was able for the first time to get continuous joining between the bracket and the rails. A real scientific grab&twist test between this frame and one of my earlier tries tells me that there's a huge improvement in stiffness gained by the triangulated upright segments and close-as-possible linking of any rod elements where they separate from each other.

Duffy 50 McFezzi 07.jpg

I think it's worth considering that flexy-ness in JD is not an advantage that we can control to our gain. The construction depends on soldered rails joining front and rear, and no room for incorporating motion in there. If that's true, I opt for the stiffest, crashproofest frame I can make; and this is heading a good way in that direction.

Duffy 50 McFezzi 10.jpg

I had this and the "illegal" car out last week on Slots-A-Lot's Hillclimb, and this car was showing lovely promise; a totally plotz motor kept me from racing it, but the couple of Real Drivers who tried it were lovin' it in the corners. I think I'm close to doing this right.

Duffy


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#47 Jairus

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 11:24 AM

You do very nice work Duf. Toss it into a tumbler for a bit and you could sell those on eBay for a pretty penny! :)

Jairus H Watson - Artist
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#48 Duffy

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 11:35 AM

Nah, they'll only get dirty again. Scotchbrite wheel at the end of things (last pic), & after that "THEY ARE ALL DOOMED."

Oh yah: capper to the capper--
Here's the body Noose did for this Slithery series. Look close at the logo.

Noose Snaky Maser F1.jpg
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#49 Pablo

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 03:18 PM

Very Elegant :)
Paul Wolcott

#50 Matt Sheldon

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 08:05 PM

Chassis looks fantastic and the body is perfect!


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