Magnet epoxy
#1
Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:24 PM
What's your thoughts on Skinner epoxy?
Thanks for the help.
Vic
#2
Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:33 PM
Since I quit using super glue a number of years ago, I've had good luck with cheap old JB Weld, the slow stuff, not the five minute variety. I butter the can and the magnets, and slide everything together. Makes a mess, of course, so I squeegee off most of it and place the set-up on the stand for my idling Hakko soldering iron (that's my heat source). After a few minutes, the epoxy start to gel and it's easy to "carve" the excess off with a screwdriver, a knife, whatever is handy. As the epoxy hardens further from more time on the iron stand, it becomes actually easier to remove.
Of course, I roughen the inside of the can, as well as clean everything with lighter fluid or lacquer thinner to remove all traces of oil or grease before epoxying the magnets in.
I can only recall one set of JB Welded magnets that came loose and it was an old set-up that got whacked hard.
Gregory Wells
Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap
#3
Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:44 PM
Rick Bennardo
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#4
Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:44 PM
#5
Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:49 PM
Real good glue for ceramics is Black Max by Locktite. It's a type of super glue.
Will that hang in there with the heat, etc., Rick? I've been using the Locktite super glue, and haven't had to many issues on the D and C-can motors. However some guys are saying the mags break loose after a while.
#6
Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:58 PM
On the other hand, repeated soldering in/removing of the set-up from the chassis will result in the superglue melting and shifting, and this perhaps is part of the problem as well. If using a superglue, use as much as possible to seal every area around the magnet and fill any gaps completely.
My personal preference is the black stuff Koford sells, but that is one that does require baking. I have used JB Weld with success before, and the only times I ever had magnets come loose with JB Weld was due to improper preparation on my part.
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#7
Posted 30 November 2011 - 08:14 PM
What I like about the JB Weld is how cheap and readily available it is.
James, I think that super glue is also sensitive to oil, as I recall that every time I had a super-glued magnet come loose, there seemed to be oil between the magnet and can.
Gregory Wells
Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap
#8
Posted 30 November 2011 - 08:18 PM
Is the JB weld something I can get at Lowes or Wal-Mart?
#9
Posted 30 November 2011 - 08:25 PM
Now that you mention it... I think you are right! I do recall finding oil between the magnets and can upon discovering loose magnets. Oil could then indeed be a factor.
Vic,
Any hardware store will carry regular JB Weld (Lowes/Home Depot/Ace/True Value, etc.), and it should be available at Walmart or Target, or any automotive parts store such as NAPA, Autozone, etc. I've even seen it at some gas stations!
obSCEne Chassis
HVR BB Fronts
Bodies by Weaver
"There is no such thing as a race you are destined to lose. You will always have a chance."
#10
Posted 30 November 2011 - 08:36 PM
I use it for everything from 16Ds to open G7 magnets and never had a mag come loose. if you have any questions about it call Doug at Port Jeff Raceway or myself at (517) 936-8503.
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#11
Posted 30 November 2011 - 08:43 PM
Greg is correct, it's not cheap and I stored it in the fridge. But he asked for a non-bake good magnet glue and I offered up the best of that type I have ever used.
There was a time when some were using high temp red RTV to hold magnets in with good success...
Rick Bennardo
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#12
Posted 30 November 2011 - 08:58 PM
As far as Skinners is concerned, what size container is it available in? I've never used it myself but have heard it recommended on more than one occasion.
obSCEne Chassis
HVR BB Fronts
Bodies by Weaver
"There is no such thing as a race you are destined to lose. You will always have a chance."
#13
Posted 30 November 2011 - 09:03 PM
Port Jeff would be my first call if you want some...
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#14
Posted 30 November 2011 - 09:22 PM
Is the JB Weld something I can get at Lowes or Wal-Mart?
Yes, I'm pretty sure you can, but I know you can get it at just about any auto parts store in the land.
Gregory Wells
Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap
#15
Posted 01 December 2011 - 03:46 AM
Barney Poynor
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#16
Posted 01 December 2011 - 06:19 AM
According to the packaging, it's good to something like 400F which, even if somewhat optimistic, is way more than you'd ever likely encounter with a set of magnets that weren't headed for doom. I don't know that it provides any advantage, but the fact that JB Weld's "filler" is powdered iron and the material is magnetic might be a good thing for the can/magnet field thing. In any case, it's inexpensive, strong as all get-out, and easy to work with.
As for process... what Greg said (of course!). Rough-up the inside of the can and clean the can and magnets with acetone and have at it.
-john
#17
Posted 01 December 2011 - 08:59 AM
I have seen the JB Weld at my local Ace hardware store, but their's a few different types. Does anyone have a part number or type I should be looking for?
Vic
#18
Posted 01 December 2011 - 09:15 AM
The marine version that John recommended, which I don't recall ever seeing and which may be more difficult to find, is THIS.
Gregory Wells
Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap
#19
Posted 01 December 2011 - 09:31 AM
Vic
#20
Posted 01 December 2011 - 11:22 AM
Barney Poynor
12/26/51-1/31/22
Requiescat in Pace
#21
Posted 01 December 2011 - 12:42 PM
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#22
Posted 01 December 2011 - 12:51 PM
As noted above, it takes a lot of heat to remove the magnets once they are glued in with this stuff. I have also found with my cobalt motors, the magnets themselves are less prone to breaking, or if they do crack, they stay in place better. I found using Koford glue on cobalt motors results in replacing the magnets pretty regularly, so the cost is too high.
Skinner's is easy to use, too. As far as removal, I have done it with a soldering iron even for cobalt magnets... just get a large lump of solder on the tip and hold it there... takes four-five minutes!!! Then the can needs to be cleaned and resprayed with Krylon wrinkle coat, then you're as good as new.
That's how tough this stuff is, and it's why it is the best for taking motors in and out with more frequency.
George Russell
#23
Posted 01 December 2011 - 03:06 PM
-john
#24
Posted 01 December 2011 - 05:11 PM
Barney Poynor
12/26/51-1/31/22
Requiescat in Pace
#25
Posted 01 December 2011 - 05:17 PM
Everybody has their own opinion on magnet glue, and they are all correct for the most part. You wanted a good cold set glue for the neo magnets. Well, you can't get there from here. The Loctite CA glue, while it is really good, does not stand up to the force of the neo magnets. JB Weld sets up overnight cold, but does not have the strength compared to heat set. Even 250 degrees for 5 minutes is enough to degrade the magnets to under ceramic magnet strength. So, I would use heat set glue and then have the cans rezapped. Sonic can rezap neo magnets to full strength.
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