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Checkpoint Cup racing procedures discussion


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#51 Zippity

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 06:40 PM

That was clear enough.

Thanks for spelling it out Philippe.




#52 Gus Kelley

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 06:52 PM

Hey Zip! We gonna see you there? Gus in Sacto
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#53 Zippity

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 08:19 PM

Could do.

#54 redbackspyder

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 09:44 PM

Now they will be racing for the food line on Saturday. Jesus, is the feed bag that important ? I thought it was a slot car race, not a handout line at the Midnight Mission !

Mill Conroy
 

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#55 Tim Neja

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 10:10 PM

I had a dead motor --so I took it apart the other night. I'll bring it to the races Mike--you can try to show me how they could change the timing in this thing!! The comm and the stacks are all linked together--don't see how you can turn one and not the other. And the brush's are held in the end bell in such a way that I don't think you can move them either. Check it out!! I think PDL --Bryan and the other's are doing all they can to make this a fair FUN RACE!! Let's leave the debate's alone--and go race and have a good time. I'm planning on seeing lot's of old friends--and doing the best I can--but If I"m not in the A--so what? I'll race with the guys in the main I qualified for--- it's a "handout" race--so you'll be slotted with the guys you should be with if you drive your best. Let's race our toy cars!
T
She's real fine, my 409!!!

#56 Gary Donahoe

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 10:47 PM

Here is my idea for a Checkpoint Cup CanAM or F-1 race format, if something different is desired.
Let’s say there are 36 entries.
1-4 qualifiers to the A Main.
5-12 qualifiers to the B with top 2 finishers move up to the A.
13-20 qualifiers to the C (no traditional move up).
21-28 qualifiers to the D (no traditional move up).
29-36 qualifiers to the E (no traditional move up).
After the top 6 are set for the A, the top 2 lap totals from the B,C,D, or E move up to the A.

This format should take no longer to run than normal our normal format. 4 drivers will run 2 races, everybody else runs 1 race. Entrants need only 2 sets of tires prepared and there should be no problem for the handout motor to last 2 mains. If you had an excellent lap total and the stars lined up properly you could place 2nd in the E and still make the A.

Just a thought for consideration

#57 Mike K

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 12:15 AM

Amazingly simple Gary. I like it! From a great organizer......

So much DRAMA for such small cars....
Mike Kravitz

Don't DQ me for having the wrong SHADE of orange on my McLaren... after all, it's ONLY a toy car!!!


#58 Bryan Warmack

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 12:43 AM

Here is my idea for a Checkpoint Cup CanAM or F-1 race format, if something different is desired.
Let’s say there are 36 entries.
1-4 qualifiers to the A Main.
5-12 qualifiers to the B with top 2 finishers move up to the A.
13-20 qualifiers to the C (no traditional move up).
21-28 qualifiers to the D (no traditional move up).
29-36 qualifiers to the E (no traditional move up).
After the top 6 are set for the A, the top 2 lap totals from the B,C,D, or E move up to the A.

This format should take no longer to run than normal our normal format. 4 drivers will run 2 races, everybody else runs 1 race. Entrants need only 2 sets of tires prepared and there should be no problem for the handout motor to last 2 mains. If you had an excellent lap total and the stars lined up properly you could place 2nd in the E and still make the A.

Just a thought for consideration



Gary,
I think the R4 in Columbus does something similar and it works great. Under consideration also is qualifying by Laps and Sections instead of one timed fastest lap. ALSO under consideration is perhaps putting a choice of racing formats in the hands of the racers and let them decide by means of a poll on Slotblog. I think a racer poll on some of this stuff that directly effects them is a good idea!

#59 Tim Neja

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 12:58 AM

I like Gary's format---it sounds a little different and FUN!! Don't think we should have a poll--only the racers that are coming to RACE should be in the poll--and we've already established--that's not the case here on the blog. But--I"m IN for what ever you guys decide.
Thanks
Tim
She's real fine, my 409!!!

#60 redbackspyder

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 01:22 AM

When is the next SCRRA Race ?

By the way , Tim, solder a pinion onto the motor shaft, lock the armature stack through the hole in the motor casing, and twist the shaft. The Comm is epoxied to the shaft, and will turn and advance the timing. Now this has been explained numerous times, and has been demonstrated. By crushing the cans, you can close up the gap. By bending the springs, you can get more pressure onto the comm. Now , what else would you like to know about what these bastards have been doing to tweak the motors ? ? ? Motors with advanced timing, and /or crushed cans have been shown to be advantageous.

Cheaters , feel free to chime in with anything I might have left out, say like shimming the magnets, grinding on the motor cans, opening them up and replacing the armatures, dewinding, take your pick.

A couple of BAD APPLES spoiled it at Buena Park. Now we need a rules manifesto just to check in at the Checkpoint Cup.

Mill Conroy
 

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Deal me life's toughest cards, without chance for hope nor fame, just let me play this one last hand, and I'll win this whole damn game.

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#61 Tim Neja

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 11:30 AM

Mill-- you're constant complaining about D3 and band wagon tactics for SCRRA gets very old. I've been to both D3 and SCRRA races and racers have enjoyed racing with BOTH of the organizations. There's nothing more being done at SCRRA to stop any cheating going on. Constant complaining about the past is not going to help anyone. Cheating is a problem that cross's all types of competition. The organizers can only do so much to regulate--the rest must be done by the racers. Knowing how to cheat is not the same as cheating! It's banning the cheaters that must be done--and the new D3 committee has said openly they will do it and are trying to implement rules/regulations/procedures to help--many at the suggestion of the racers! I hope both organizations thrive and grow-- SCRRA is not some new nirvana-- the same problem's exist there as in any group competition. What racers have been banned by SCRRA to stop the "cheaters"? If you hate D3 so much--don't race at the Checkpoint--but stop trying to tear it down every time you hit the keyboard. Enjoy the holidays and I hope to see you at the Checkpoint next year!
T
She's real fine, my 409!!!

#62 TSR

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 11:54 AM

Mill,

Rules have not changed a bit.

Racing procedures can and have changed to accommodate the needs and what the majority of racers wants. What is wrong with that and in which way does it change car preparation, timing in the event or anything else?

What has the new D3 Board accomplished so far?

1) It has refined rules that needed precisions regarding car construction and motors. Not changes, only precisions so that the rules are clearer.
2) It has refined racing procedures so that the track preparation is the responsibility of the raceway and no longer of D3, that tech and races run on time, that there is a clear policy on pitting, car repair, tech inspection, and established a procedure to catch the (very few) bad apples attempting to cheat.

This has simplified the running of races, made it more fair for all racers by creating a true impound, refined its tech inspection procedures with a zero tolerance, and is making strides in making the racing as enjoyable as it should be. I do not understand your concern here, what would any of these proposals mean to you? Like the suggestion by Gary? What would be wrong with it? It would take no more time, just as laps and sections qualifying would take no more time and truly qualify racers according to their own ability rather than on a hare lap.

Now we are discussing qualifying procedures, and the discussion is healthy. What's wrong with that? :)

#63 John Gorski

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 02:23 PM

2012 Checkpoint Cup racing procedures
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#64 Ron Hershman

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 02:54 PM

I had a dead motor --so I took it apart the other night. I'll bring it to the races Mike--you can try to show me how they could change the timing in this thing!! The comm and the stacks are all linked together--don't see how you can turn one and not the other.


Oh Tim... let me show you how it's done... it's very simple...

Stock Falcon 7.

DSCN1679.JPG

Falcon taken apart

DSCN1680.JPG

Timing is just a shade over 15 degrees...

DSCN1681.JPG

With a simple twist... timing increased to 30 degrees.

DSCN1682.JPG

No broken wires...

DSCN1683.JPG

#65 Bernie

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 02:56 PM

:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:
Bernie Schatz

#66 Ron Hershman

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 03:06 PM

:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:


What you laughing at Bernie??? ;) LOL

#67 TSR

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 03:13 PM

(John Gorski) All this discussion should be moved to another thread its confusing to people coming to the race.


John,
This was to be done yesterday, and has been done now along with a clean up uf some of the un-necessary posts.

However let's point out once more that the D3 RULES have not changed.

Some PROCEDURES have been set or refined to speed up matters and avoid long delays during the race weekend.

#68 Mark Wampler

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 03:51 PM

Oh Tim... let me show you how it's done... it's very simple...




Ron, I think the viewing audience should be entitled to a complete course on motor "enhancements", but on another thread :victory:
You can quote me.

-Mark

#69 Bernie

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 04:07 PM

What you laughing at Bernie??? ;) LOL


It just cracks me up, that's all. Merry Christmas to all :D !
Bernie Schatz

#70 TSR

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 04:21 PM

Tim,
It is just as well that Ron shows you that it can be done, and leaving few marks at that. The few in D3 racing who have used these "enhancements" in the past, will be in for a bad surprise if they try again. For the benefit of the guys who are playing fair.

#71 usadar

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 04:24 PM

John,
This was to be done yesterday, and has been done now along with a clean up uf some of the un-necessary posts.

However let's point out once more that the D3 RULES have not changed.

Some PROCEDURES have been set or refined to speed up matters and avoid long delays during the race weekend.


I agree with John & Philippe,

We have been looking forward to and preparing for the Check Point Cup of 2012 on condition that the basic style of this historic event will not change drastically but with some refinements for the benefit of participating racers.

The D3 committee has done a very fine job.

Let us enjoy racing at the Cup!!

Happy Holidays, :D

Haruki
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#72 Mike K

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 05:49 PM

Love the tutorial!!! :clapping: :victory:

So much DRAMA for such small cars....
Mike Kravitz

Don't DQ me for having the wrong SHADE of orange on my McLaren... after all, it's ONLY a toy car!!!


#73 TSR

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 08:28 PM

Just wait until he shows you the tools... :laugh2:

#74 Zippity

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 08:40 PM

What Ark did the timing guage come out of?

Surely that has to be a collectors piece :)

#75 Bill from NH

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 08:50 PM

The MEC timing gauges must be 20-25 years old, maybe older. They show up occasionally on ebay & always go for big bucks. :yes:

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