184 replies to this topic

[hfs3]

This King was picked up in New Haven, CT the day after we retrieved the Hillclimb from Binghamton, NY. We decided the Hillcimb would be easier get up and running, as it had relatively minor issues (paint, braid, wiring, etc.). The Hillclimb restoration has been completed, and we're hosting a few FCR series races on it this month.

On to the King. The previous owner had the track set up and partially installed inside Dadd's Xtreme Indoor Sports, but instead decided to put up a bunch of ping pong tables for the Yale students. Anyway, he thought it might be a Dadd's track, which would have been a funny coincidence. However, when I looked on the underside I could see that most sections had Made in Canada and perhaps the name of the section (Main St. #1, etc.) written on them in magic marker. Several other sections were additionally marked with #133 which is probably the track # (see below):


I haven't contacted Ogilvie about this one yet, so I don't know the origins of this track. My guess is 80's vintage. More on that as I find out...

Several of the lateral supports that the legs attach to were damaged, and were replaced with 1/2" MDF (same as original). The prior owner attached legs without exactly following the numbering scheme, and at some point a number of replacement legs were roughly constructed. The iffy/crappy ones were tossed and at least twenty new ones were made. Below, you can see the new ones in the process of being fitted:


Once all the legs were attached, the sections were moved roughly into place:


After a few hours of fitting we got the main straight and big bank all connected together:


It will take another day of work to finish connecting all the sections together. Then it will be on to fine tuning leg heights, making various repairs to the sidewalls, filling and routing the braid recess. Prior to assembly, my brother routed the gains until they were smooth and clear of contaminants. High Performance Wood Filler will be used to bring the gains flush to the surface. 1/8" thick styrofoam strips inserted into the slots will keep the filler from entering the slot, and is easily routed out. We're going to have to hang a lot of polyethylene to contain the ensuing dust storm caused by sanding and routing!

More to come...

[hfs3]

I heard back from Brian at Ogilvie Tracks today. He confirmed that our King is indeed an Ogilvie, but could only say it was made before 1990. The reason for that is they don't have any records older than that. So, it's at least 30 years old! Brian thought our method of using HP Wood Filler for raising the gains would work well, and said he's looking forward to seeing how the track turns out. He also complimented our work on the Hillclimb, which felt good to hear.

We managed to squeeze in a few hours of track assembly this afternoon, getting as far as the donut:




The donut and bridge will be attached tomorrow - shouldn't take us more than an hour or so. The joints on this track are extremely tight, and were originally lined on a red tape - presumably to facilitate sliding the sections together. But, after a few installations and de-installations the tape was starting to bunch up and tear, so it had to be removed. After everything is connected we'll go around the track and fine tune the leg heights, which will close up the seams and smooth out the transitions. Over the years sidewall repairs were performed on a few sections. But, whoever did them didn't really know what they were doing. When we correct the sidewall errors, the edges of the racing surface will be returned to their proper flatness. Once we're satisfied with the surface and sidewalls we'll proceed with filling the gains flush with the surface.

[hfs3]

We connected the remaining sections. However, we had to disconnect midway down the main straight because joining compound curves is extremely difficult (didn't even try). Once the donut and lead in were attached we used a cabinet maker's clamp to pull the two straight sections in line with each other. Another clamp pulled the two sections in close enough for the connecting bolts to pull them together snugly.

While there's considerable work left to be done, the track has held up pretty well over the years.




Leg heights need to be tweaked, sidewalls repaired, humps leveled out, driver deck built, and gains filled before we can do the glory stuff - sanding, routing, painting, striping, braiding, and wiring the track. The first part should take us a good 4-6 weeks to get through. The last part should take 3-4 weeks, if all goes well.

The original surface of the track was black, not latex grey. We used graphite on the Hillclimb and really like that look so the King will get the same treatment. Despite originally having red walls, I think the King should be painted blue because all King tracks should be blue! Despite the red walls, this one measures at a few inches over158', within 2% of the standard 155' and definitely not a short King.

There will be five power taps, spaced every 30 feet, so there won't be any voltage drops the further you get from where power is applied. We'll use computer server supplies because they deliver clean, stable power. Powered by 240VAC, each one will deliver 12.2VDC @ 164A (adjustable up to 14.8VDC). Falcon motors will love running at 12.2v, and should last longer because of it. Two supplies will provide 328A to the track, or 41A per lane. Having more available current than even open cars draw (average of 20A) should also extend the lifetime of the supplies. They slide in/out of a module bay, so a failed unit can be slid out and immediately replaced with a spare. We have six spares, so we should be good to go for some time.

Onward to returning #133 to it's former glory!

[Mike Patterson]

Henry,

Looking good! I would especially work on the legs down at the 90 and under the bridge, that clearance looks kinda tight (in the pics) for an Olgilvie.

[hfs3]

Henry,

Looking good! I would especially work on the legs down at the 90 and under the bridge, that clearance looks kinda tight (in the pics) for an Olgilvie.

Thanks, Mike!

I spent a good four hours Thursday night to smooth the transitions all around the track. Starting at the donut, I lowered leg heights until there was clearance between the overpass and underpass - the underpass was closer to the Main St. side, with an inch of clearance between upper and lower walls there and several inches clearance on the donut side. Overall, the donut ended up being quite a bit lower than what is shown in the pix. I'll post more pix tomorrow. The lead in to the donut and the donut are now smooth and will be fairly fast! I might have to remove the sidewalls on the lead in to Main St. to get the proper angle, before reattaching them. I'm not shooting for Gerding style banking, just want to restore the track to OEM specs. After setting that corner, will work down Main St. section by section making sure it is straight and smooth. I hope to be filling the gains next week so the following week can be filled with dust from sanding the surface and re-routing the gains.

For the King, I'm leaning towards using contact cement to secure the braid (vs. 3M tape), though i'm not wed to the idea. Unlike the Hillclimb, the King will not be braided in sections - instead will run 30' lengths of braid, only dropping for power taps.

More to come...

[Steve Deiters]

Henry,

You may want to contact Mike McMasters at Tom Thumb-home of the R/4 for ideas on braid adhesive. He uses some 3M glue he calls "gorilla snot" that seems to work great. I don't know the part number of it.

[Mike Patterson]

Henry,

Maybe I missed something, but what are "gains"?

I would advise against running the braid from tap to tap, and braid each section separately. That's probably the reason your hillclimb went together so fast, no braid to repair.

[hfs3]

Henry,

Maybe I missed something, but what are "gains"?

I would advise against running the braid from tap to tap, and braid each section separately. That's probably the reason your hillclimb went together so fast, no braid to repair.

Mike,

Gains are the term for recesses in wood intended for inlay, which is technically what the braid recesses are!

The original owner of the Hillclimb used 3M tape to secure the braid, and it was braided by section (like every track I've owned), which is how I braided it. I am inclined to braid the King track in sections. If done properly, the joint gaps are smooth and the track can be moved without cutting braid. The only reason I considered running braid in 30' lengths (likely spanning section joints) was based on a recommendation from an avid wing racer. He was concerned with maintaining a smooth braid surface for the sake of speed, and recommended offset drops for taps as well as for the dead strips. I told him doing that would make it a lot more difficult to move the track. He asked if I was planning to move it any time soon, to which I replied all tracks get moved eventually.

I'm thinking most classes of car incur very little (if any) performance hit due to the braid irregularities inherent in parallel section drops - especially if front wheels touch the surface; perhaps the gaps at every section drop (especially on the long straight) would cause problems with open class cars? I can see how cars moving at such high speeds, with the only surface contact in the front end resting on the guide flag/track braid, could see those drops as potholes/speed bumps that impede forward progress...

Then again, I don't know if it really makes a difference? For practical purposes, it makes more sense to braid by section. For extreme performance I can see merit in the long braid philosophy. If it's all about voltage drop, there's no loss at section joints as the drops are stapled and pigtailed or soldered together. and taps every 30' should ensure there's adequate voltage at every point on the track.

All that being said, the plan is to braid by section and tap every 30'.

[Rick]

Henry braiding by section is nice if being moved. I used to braid tap to tap also.

BTW, I would not recommend you remove any walls on the sections, remove the top turn from the other two sections and it go into the shape ad curve it was made for, then you will see the transition and how those sections should be adjusted. The top turn and straight look tweaked quite a bit.

[hfs3]

Rick,

Tap to Tap is in the equation still, since our plan is to be here for a minimum of 5 yrs. - hopefully much longer! The jury is still out, but theres time still.

The corner into Main St. angles up from the inner radius, but has a crown leading into the straight that is classic Ogilvie. It will make you drive that corner before punching the straight. I've been studying various King track pictures to get a feel for the track geometry and noticed that when the transitions are properly aligned (smooth), the track becomes coherent. It's taken a few sessions with the legs to get things close, especially the donut and overpass/underpass. While there's no doubt this King has lived a harsh life, overall it has survived well enough to be worth the effort of a restoration.

There are five or six sidewalls that were mis-repaired and need to be removed and realigned. Fortunately, the damage is on straight sections, which are much easier to deal with. Tomorrow (Easter Sunday), we'll work on the sidewalls for a few hours. One step at a time...

[hfs3]

Took a bunch of pictures today...

View from the donut end:


Closeup of the donut:


Lead-in to the donut:


Dead strip section:


Exit from finger:


Bridge to Main St. transition


Repairing a deformed sidewall:

[Keith Charles]

Hi Henry
Any chance you could post some info and pics of the power supplies your using. The track looks like it's coming together just fine, wish we had enough room to have two tracks in our club room here in Edinburgh Scotland
Regards Keith
www.ecuriebarnton.co.uk

[ChrisJ]

Hi Henry,
I own Ogilvie pinched King #100 (Slot Car Emporium), Richard Payne (Modelville Hobby) has a hill climb #122, he says both were delivered around fall of 1991.

I also have an Ogilvie hillclimb just like yours, can't find a number on it, but I think it was built around 1994-95, was set up new in Manchester NH (Queen City)(Need for Speed).

I re-braided by section, figured if ever had to replace a piece it would only be 10' or so. I did contact cement.

We did 3 pos+ taps and 3 neg- taps(Thanks to Jim Pavelski for helping me wire it). Pos-1 middle of main st, pos-2 entering deadmans, pos-3 entering 90*. That put all 3 taps closest to each other and the driver panel. 24 pieces of equal length wire. Neg taps half way between positive ones.

Sounds like nice power supplies. Your tracks are looking good, best of luck to you.

Chris

[Bill from NH]

Chris, your hillclimb was new when Matt K. opened Queen City Speedway in 1996.

[hfs3]

Hi Henry
Any chance you could post some info and pics of the power supplies your using. The track looks like it's coming together just fine, wish we had enough room to have two tracks in our club room here in Edinburgh Scotland
Regards Keith
www.ecuriebarnton.co.uk

Hi Keith,

Here are a few pix of the supply we're going to use...

Label

These are power supplies from an IBM Blade Center server; p/n DPS-2000BB

Front:

They run on 240VAC and draw up to 14A; outputs are 12.2VDC @ 164A (adjustable to 14.8VDC with a slight modification)

Rear:

If you don't have mating connectors or the server enclosure, output wiring is soldered to the pins. While soldering is very secure, it makes things difficult if one needs to replace a unit that has gone south.

Server power supply sub-assembly:

The assembly comes with cooling fans to cool the supplies, as they don't have internal fans. I'll make a shell for the assembly, and include power switches, voltage adjust control, and digital voltmeters.

Backplane:

The circuit board at the rear of the assembly has the mating connectors for the supplies. I removed all the components except the connectors, and will solder output wires to the modified board. That way, replacing a supply is as easy as unplugging the power cord, sliding the bad unit out, inserting the new one, and plugging the power cord back in.

Mating connectors:

Before I found the power supply sub-assembly (which came with another four supplies), I began looking for the connectors so I could easily replace a dead supply without any soldering. None of the connectors were available from stock, and anyone who could sell them wanted a substantial minimum order ($10k). The Molex site had an online sample request form, so I put one in for four of them. Much to my surprise, they showed up in the mail - though after the power supply sub-assembly was purchased.

I'm sure the King would be quite happy with just two supplies - that would deliver 12.2v @ 328 amps. Still debating how many to use...

[Keith Charles]

Thanks Henry
That gives me food for thought for some standby power supplies for our track, server supplies should be fairly easy to pickup . Once you have had a chance to mod the supplies post more pics as the track build progresses.
Many thanks for your quick reply
Regards Keith
www.equriebarnton.co.uk

[hfs3]

Hi Henry,
I own Ogilvie pinched King #100 (Slot Car Emporium), Richard Payne (Modelville Hobby) has a hill climb #122, he says both were delivered around fall of 1991.

I also have an Ogilvie hillclimb just like yours, can't find a number on it, but I think it was built around 1994-95, was set up new in Manchester NH (Queen City)(Need for Speed).

I re-braided by section, figured if ever had to replace a piece it would only be 10' or so. I did contact cement.

We did 3 pos+ taps and 3 neg- taps(Thanks to Jim Pavelski for helping me wire it). Pos-1 middle of main st, pos-2 entering deadmans, pos-3 entering 90*. That put all 3 taps closest to each other and the driver panel. 24 pieces of equal length wire. Neg taps half way between positive ones.

Sounds like nice power supplies. Your tracks are looking good, best of luck to you.

Chris

Hi Chris,

When I was in data collection mode, I noticed your raceway through the N.E.C.C. site. I thought it was kind of cool that we had nearly the same tracks. Yours look to be well cared for and in excellent shape!

Taps: Since I still have time before the issue has to be addressed, I'm mulling over the tap issue. Taps placed every 50' is often referenced as the standard, so three taps should be enough for a 155' track. More taps would make for a bumpier ride, but only for the fastest of the fast cars. From a driver's perspective, braiding over the section joints and using offset drops every 30'-50' is as close to ideal as is practical. I understand the object is to keep the braid surface as smooth as possible while maintaining equal voltage all along the track.

So, I'm wondering what method other King owners use wire their track, and why? I bought the Alpha Raceway booklet on track wiring, and while it made sense for a world class test track, is it overkill for most tracks out there? If so, what methods do other world class tracks use?

As for the age of the King, 1991-1992 is probably the vintage. I have seen other tracks with lower numbers from that same era, which makes sense to me. I would bet our Hillclimbs were made at the same time, likely mid-90's as Bill from NH suggested. Does yours have the rubber stamped branding underneath? Mine does.. Like you, I didn't notice if there was a track number anywhere on the underside.

We're working our way down Main St., repairing sidewalls and smoothing the surfaces. That should take another couple of sessions and then it's on to the other side of the track. Fortunately, the majority of sidewall damage is on straight sections.

Glue vs. tape is also a question for the King. The Hillclimb is doing quite well with the tape, as is my Figure 8. Because of the repairs to the gains I might be more inclined to use tape - except when rebraiding, use a router to remove the old tape.

The power supplies should provide the track with ample power for any class of racing. Hopefully, there will be a wide spectrum of racing on this track. With any luck, we'll find our niche here and be around for a long time.

[ChrisJ]

I raced last weekend, wing cars on Modelville Hobbies Gerding king. Very fast track. Braided by section with contact cement to glue braid. Didn't have any issues w/bumpy rides.

Our King was stored poorly for 5 yrs. in a drop frame trailer. Very damp and leaky. Spent 5 months on the space and track before opening.

Yes on the rubber stamp under hill climb.

Chris

[hfs3]

Work on the King has been productive, though it doesn't show quite so much. My brother (the carpenter) has been making sidewall repairs on Main St., required because of well intentioned but poorly executed repairs. The edges of the track were not kept level when they were reattached to the wall, so there were some ripples along the edges. It was fairly easy to see where the original surface was supposed to be because the original paint lines were still visible beneath the grey repaint. After the first few sections had been straightened out I scraped off as much of the grey coat of paint as I could, then went over it with an orbital sander loaded with 220 grit paper. The Ogilvie black surface lurked just below.



The next day, the rest of the Main St. sidewalls were repaired. The first section of the big bank didn't have any sidewall issues, so I continued scraping. The grey paint was not uniformly applied, as seen in the picture below. The grey parts were either painted more thickly, the epoxy underneath was sanded so the new paint stuck well, or sanded down to the MDF before repainting. The newly scraped parts haven't yet been sanded, but it's going to take a lot of sanding to fully prep the surface. Still, it's starting to look more like it's old self.



While waiting for the repairs to proceed around the corner, I'll be tackling the cosmetic part of the sidewalls next, filling old holes, sanding them smooth, etc. Progress is being made!

[slot_car_tomato]

Hey guys. The king track is looking great. I was out of slot cars for the past 15 years and then stumbled across Modelville and have been getting back into racing. Do you folks have a racing program at pioneer valley? If so I would love to come check it out. I'm in Boston so it would be tough for me to come out there often...but given the paucity of tracks around here I might as well get used to driving!
Looking forward to seeing your facility,
-mike "tomato" forrester

[hfs3]

Hey guys. The king track is looking great. I was out of slot cars for the past 15 years and then stumbled across Modelville and have been getting back into racing. Do you folks have a racing program at pioneer valley? If so I would love to come check it out. I'm in Boston so it would be tough for me to come out there often...but given the paucity of tracks around here I might as well get used to driving!
Looking forward to seeing your facility,
-mike "tomato" forrester

Hi Mike,

It's fun work. What makes it better is at the end not only do we get to enjoy looking at a beautiful track, we get to drive on it any time we want!

We're still recruiting members, so our racing programs are not yet going. The warmer months are not traditionally slot racing times, aInd to make things interesting a commercial raceway just opened two towns over from us. What I'd like to do is run a few programs in the summer that won't officially start up until the fall. The goal is to keep your racing chops up for the experienced racer and an opportunity for newer or returning racers to get up to speed for the fall.The Hillclimb is challenging and a lot of fun to drive. We figure it will be sometime in June before the King is ready for racing. Below are a few shots of the latest progress, which includes more paint scraping. More importantly, the straight sections coming out of the big bank were smoothed out today.

View from donut end:


Big bank:


Donut:


Donut closeup:

[hfs3]

The scrape fest continues, with six sections yet to go. When I was clearing the section with the dead strip, I uncovered the original finish line. Here it is:



This track came from the New Haven, CT area - does anyone recognize the track from this unusual feature?

[hfs3]

Except for the overpass and underpass, sidewall repairs on the straight sections is complets. Those two will wait until after the track is disassembled for filling the gains and any surface defects (surprisingly few!). Tomorrow, we start in on the corner sidewalls.

Looking down Main St., the surface and slots look straight:


Another view down Main St.:


Exit from the finger and lead in to the donut looks like it will be fast:


Raising the donut greatly improves the spacing between the overpass and the underpass:


View coming out of the big bank:


View of the overpass:


Once everything is set, we plan on using construction adhesive to caulk the underside of the track. This should help lock the shape in place and protect against future mishaps. Light sanding with 220 grit will rough up the surface to accept paint and also take off most of the remaining grey. Most of the transitions are seamless, though on the outside lanes there are a few that will require some light belt sanding to restore the smoothness. All in all, things are going well!

[Larry Labounty]

Henery, Looks like you made a lot of head way in the last week. Looking forward in stopping by to see the progress first hand.
regards Larry

[hfs3]

Larry,

Thanks! We'll run a few laps on the Hillclimb the next time you stop in. Then I'll give you the guided tour on the progress.

The next step before filling the gains is to insure all sections connect tightly, and the surfaces transition smoothly. The center seam in the big bank will be opened up again and checked for clearance issues as it didn't close completely on one edge (perhaps a 1/16"). We will make it work. Once all the transitions are smooth and the geometry is good, we'll caulk the underside with construction adhesive to lock things in place. That should make it easier to assemble/disassemble the track in the future, as well as provide structural stability while cars are hurtling around at speeds of 25+ mph.

Filling the gains could take a week or so, assuming a few hours/day working on it. After sanding the surface smooth, the track will be reassembled and routed for braid. Disassemble one more time, paint surface and sides, braid, stripe, construct and wire driver station decks, wire the taps, and finish the power supply module. That's a good six weeks work for one to two individuals!

See you soon,
Henry