"Just keep this in mind: "character isn't determined by what you do when people are watching you but by what you do when they're not watching you"".
This is at the core of this issue. Everyone is good and kind when the lights are on, it is what we do when no one is watching; and how we treat people who we do not "need"that reveals our true character. Any reasonable human being from any society, anywhere and of any background would find cheating your friends dispicable and worthy of community ridicule.
You don't have to be a local to understand broad human values.
I also consider two of the three my friends and I have no intention of unfriending them on FB. We all have the capacity to forgive, and we should do so without judgement... after punishment has been doled out!
Motor tampering issues at the recent Checkpoint Cup
#26
Posted 17 February 2015 - 02:42 AM
- Cheater, Tim Neja, chaparrAL and 1 other like this
???-2020
Requiescat in Pace
" First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." - Gandhi
Studio link
#27
Posted 17 February 2015 - 08:04 AM
Guys,
I've deleted a couple of recent posts from this thread which came too close to denigrating others who have posted to this thread due to their stated opinions.
Please keep in mind that everyone here has the right to their own opinion, even if it is wrong or idiotic in your view.
And my opinion is that it is getting very close to the time to close down this thread.
Gregory Wells
Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap
#28
Posted 17 February 2015 - 08:36 AM
#29
Posted 17 February 2015 - 08:53 AM
If this thread stays within the bounds of "civil discourse", it will be allowed to boil merrily away.
Gregory Wells
Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap
#30
Posted 17 February 2015 - 09:04 AM
#31
Posted 17 February 2015 - 09:36 AM
- Bernie likes this
The lack of any credible evidence is proof the conspiracy is working!
#32
Posted 17 February 2015 - 12:39 PM
This is an SCRRA issue, and I hope that every SCRRA racer posts how he feels about the situation, because just maybe if the air gets cleared there will be a sufficient way for things to move on... Otherwise, all the ill feelings about all of this will just simmer until it hits the raceway.
Racers may be willing to forgive and move on, but they will never forget.
- MSwiss and Half Fast like this
Mill Conroy
AKA : TWO LAP CONROY, Anointed Trigger Monkey by Mike Swiss
Deal me life's toughest cards, without chance for hope nor fame, just let me play this one last hand, and I'll win this whole damn game.
Second Most Interesting Man in the World.
#33
Posted 17 February 2015 - 12:50 PM
- MSwiss likes this
#34
Posted 17 February 2015 - 12:52 PM
Yes, this particular incident is a SCRRA issue. But the ramifications go beyond BPR and even beyond our shores.
Since the JK Hawk Retro has spread to so many racing series, what happens at BPR doesn't stay at BPR. Everyone who runs these motors are looking at this with great interest.
I'm glad that Bryan has been as transparent as possible with this. Now everyone can go forward and keep the Retro Racing phenom going in a positive direction.
- Joe Mig, Half Fast and John Streisguth like this
"If you have integrity, nothing else matters, and if you do not have integrity, nothing else matters."
Robert Mueller, special counsel (2013)
"... because people have got to know whether or not their president is a crook."
Richard M .Nixon, Nov 17, 1973
"Fool me once, same on... shame on you. Fool me... you can't get fooled again."
George W. Bush
#36
Posted 17 February 2015 - 02:10 PM
I think we should GO BACK to Hand Out Motors....this would have never happened
Maybe, maybe not.
At a previous hand-out race, one of the suspended racers tried to tech with a motor engraved with the same number as Bryan.
Side note, why didn't he engrave that motor with the number of a motor he had purchased? LOL.
Mike Swiss
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden Ave., Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 692 Citadel Drive, Westmont, Illinois 60559
#37
Posted 17 February 2015 - 02:21 PM
At a previous handout race, one of the suspended racers tried to tech with a motor engraved with the same number as Bryan.
Hmmm-
If one of the now suspended racers was a serial cheater, maybe the punishment was far too light and maybe some public shaming is appropriate.
Food for thought!
Bill Botjer
Faster then, wiser now.
The most dangerous form of ignorance is not knowing that you don't know anything!
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity
#38
Posted 17 February 2015 - 02:48 PM
Mike,
Bryan must be talking to you off the record because I have never heard of this happening.
Jason
#39
Posted 17 February 2015 - 02:57 PM
In reality this is not happening.
Also in SCRRA racing, its is design to be all about the chassis... not motors nor aero (at least that's my understanding).
I will say this again,
Do whatever you want to the motor, but when you come to the tech table if your motor do not meet a specified performace spec,
you can't run it. Let's say 8000 rpm at the wheel at 6v for example. Can do it with hand held tach.
Cry like a baby, drive like a girl, walk like a man.
Give me enough rope and I'll build a fast car... or hang myself?
#40
Posted 17 February 2015 - 02:59 PM
Bryan Must be talking to you off the record because I have never heard of this happening
While I don't think he took out an ad in the Buena Park Examiner, advertising it, I've definitely heard other racers refer to the previous incident, since the Checkpoint Cup.
If one of the now suspended racers was a serial cheater, Maybe the punishment was far too light and maybe some public shaming is appropriate.
Probably not necessary.
I'm guessing the offender already got fined by the S.S.M.C.*, for sloppy cheating.
*Secret Society of Motor Cheats
Mike Swiss
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden Ave., Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 692 Citadel Drive, Westmont, Illinois 60559
#41
Posted 17 February 2015 - 03:20 PM
By the way I witnessed what Mike Swiss described in post #36 with my own two eyes.
- MSwiss and kvanpelt like this
#42
Posted 17 February 2015 - 03:45 PM
Ummm, we have an issue with your moto,r Speedy... we're gonna confiscate it and have it inspected closer. If it's been altered it's being destroyed and your suspension will stand till you post a bond to race again... after your three months. That money is going into a fund for others if you repeat.
Don't look at me funny, Speedy... you brought this on yourself... I like you but that's not making it right now.
- olescratch likes this
#43
Posted 17 February 2015 - 03:46 PM
Jason
- olescratch likes this
#44
Posted 17 February 2015 - 03:47 PM
I am not against hand-out motors but hand-out motors keep honest people honest. A devious cheater can counterfeit their favorite motor to look just like their hand-out. With the help of an accomplice this could be done in a very short period of time.
Let's see... cellphone, picture, text buddy in the parking lot with engraver... probably less time than it would take the rest of us to break-in our motors.
Gary, I'd say you are correct!
- olescratch likes this
?/?/56-6/12/23
Requiescat in Pace
#45
Posted 17 February 2015 - 03:58 PM
There are easy ways to mark hand-out motors that cannot be seen without special equipment.
Only the tech inspector knows where to look and what he is looking for, a number coded from the engraved number.
He takes all tech'd cars and inspects all motors for the mark at the same time (two minutes duration).
Any "swapped ID" motors are found right there, perps are asked to leave and not come back.
No drama, no problem. If you don't know the code, don't even try to swap a hand-out motor.
Keeps honest people honest.
AJ
- Jason Holmes likes this
Sorry about the nerf. "Sorry? Sorry? There's no apologizing in slot car racing!"
Besides, where would I even begin? I should probably start with my wife ...
"I don't often get very many "fast laps" but I very often get many laps quickly." ™
The only thing I know about slot cars is if I had a good time when I leave the building! I can count the times I didn't on one two three hands!
Former Home Track - Slot Car Speedway and Hobbies, Longmont, CO (now at Duffy's Raceway), Noteworthy for the 155' Hillclimb track featuring the THUNDER-DONUT - "Two men enter; one man leaves!"
#46
Posted 17 February 2015 - 04:03 PM
No secret markings needed.
Joe "Noose" Neumeister
Sometimes known as a serial despoiler of the clear purity of virgin Lexan bodies. Lexan is my canvas!
Noose Custom Painting - Since 1967
Chairman - IRRA® Body Committee - Roving IRRA® Tech Dude - "EVIL BUCKS Painter"
"Team Evil Bucks" Racer - 2016 Caribbean Retro Overall Champion
The only thing bad about Retro is admitting that you remember doing it originally.
#47
Posted 17 February 2015 - 04:22 PM
I'm skeptical anyone could duplicate my style of engraving, but just the same, I go ahead and take a series of pictures and leave them on my camera.
If you take a look at engraving, done with a Dremel "vibrator", in the viewfinder at 8X, I think you'll see why I'm 99.7% confident I would catch a racer engraving his own cheater motor.
IOW, it's not the same as forging your parents signature on your 4th grade report card. Lol
PS: A.J., your secret markings would only work if you keep pics of the motor, and then it wouldn't be necessary (to have additional "secret" ones).
Mike Swiss
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden Ave., Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 692 Citadel Drive, Westmont, Illinois 60559
#48
Posted 17 February 2015 - 04:31 PM
I've done the markings too for the R4 and RetroPalooza and they can't be easily replicated.
- Dave Reed likes this
Joe "Noose" Neumeister
Sometimes known as a serial despoiler of the clear purity of virgin Lexan bodies. Lexan is my canvas!
Noose Custom Painting - Since 1967
Chairman - IRRA® Body Committee - Roving IRRA® Tech Dude - "EVIL BUCKS Painter"
"Team Evil Bucks" Racer - 2016 Caribbean Retro Overall Champion
The only thing bad about Retro is admitting that you remember doing it originally.
#49
Posted 17 February 2015 - 04:40 PM
Noose,
All you have to do is paint the motors like you do the bodies. No one can paint like you.
- slotbaker, Dave Reed and usadar like this
Jim "Butch" Dunaway
I don't always go the extra mile, but when I do it's because I missed my exit.
All my life I've strived to keep from becoming a millionaire, so far I've succeeded.
There are three kinds of people in the world, those that are good at math and those that aren't.
No matter how big of a hammer you use, you can't pound common sense into stupid people, believe me, I've tried.
2000 Jackasses
#50
Posted 17 February 2015 - 05:17 PM
You guys are talking about hand-outs which is great but this was not the case here. Shoot, I ran FB4 and FB5 motors here in this one. No special markings are needed just good records on what you did and a watchful eye in tech when they return.
Jason
Hand-outs at major races!
Make mine orange with flames