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My first resin kit bodied slot car... HOLY SMOKES!


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#1 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 04:46 PM

I've never been much of a "hardbody" builder and I've never scratchbuilt a slot car with a resin car body kit. That's about to change as I've taken the plunge on this:

 

c4r_2b.jpg

 

It's a 1953 Cunningham C4R from (link below):

 

Fisher Model & Pattern

 

Here's what it looks like when an expert modeler builds it... what it will look like when I attempt it, well, we'll see.  :shok: :laugh2:

 

IMG_4021.jpg

 

This kit is a bit pricey to use as a body but hey, it's almost Father's Day and I couldn't help myself. I've wanted this thing for a long time now. Hmmm... I hope I feel the same way once I start trying to build the thing! Anywho, it's ordered from Fisher.

 

I have no idea what to use as a motor or anything else for that matter. Anyone have any ideas?


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#2 Matt Sheldon

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 05:25 PM

Very cool! You are a research guy so i am sure you know and understand the process, but just in case always ask what they recommend to neutralize the mold release on the body. For decades it was Wesley's whitewall cleaner, but the formula is different in today's age.

 

I have 3-4 Kemtron/KTMs if needed, but I am not sure on what would be a "proper" powerplant for this.


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#3 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 05:45 PM

You are a research guy so i am sure you know and understand the process...

 
Uh... Oh... Ah... I think I'm already in trouble and the kit isn't even here yet! :dash2: :laugh2:

 

Remove the release agent, right. Thank you. Maybe the kit's instructions will recommend what to use... if the kit has instructions. :wacko2:


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#4 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 05:55 PM

I just found and printed out this:

 

How to Build a Resin Kit

 

I hope it's appropriate. Time to start some "book learn'n"...


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#5 slotbaker

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 06:00 PM

Hope the C4R doesn't end up looking like a rail carriage.

 

:huh:


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#6 Gator Bob

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 06:09 PM

Considering the original was Powered by Chrysler with a 330" Firepower-plant... a Hemi wound motor could be in order. :clapping:


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#7 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 06:37 PM

Hope the C4R doesn't end up looking like a rail carriage.

 
Here's hoping the techniques will apply to a car, too. :unknw: If anyone finds a good how-to article, please let me know.


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#8 Lone Wolf

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 06:49 PM

Looking forward to this one.

 

My very good friend Ed owns Island Collectibles here on Long Island and deals with high-end resin kits including Fisher. He has someone who does build-ups for him that are incredible.

 

If you have any questions at all I'd be happy to ask him for you.

 

Joe


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#9 MSwiss

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 06:50 PM

Super-cool car to choose.

Good luck with the build.

Mike Swiss
 
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#10 SlotStox#53

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 06:52 PM

Nice model kit.  :good:

The motor would probably depend on what type of chassis you're wanting to build/able to fit underneath, Rick.

If brass rod and tube maybe a dc65x or something similar? Or if leaning to more flat brass plate type thing you could use a tasty can motor? Would a hot 36D squeeze in the body?! :laugh2:



#11 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 07:12 PM

Thanks for the offer of a lifeline, Joe.

 

Good luck on this one would be most welcome, Mike; thanks.

 

I'm pretty sure I want to use some type of tube "space frame" for the chassis, Paul. I have fun building them. You're right, I really need the body to see what motors will fit. It looks pretty skinny so an inline might offer more motor options.


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#12 Gator Bob

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 07:38 PM

Ummm it's a 1953... I know I missed that race, but... I'm seeing a green wire motor and I don't know why... ^_^  :sarcastic_hand:

 

Atlas AT-206 factory BB motor with neo.  

Stock Tyco in-line... 901 or 902... I forget.  :)

 

Or... how about a red wire 36D arm in a black can with red endbell   :crazy:  :laugh2:

 

This is 'fun'.  :clapping:Stick around, pull up a chair cause y'all ya'll know it's going to be a great show.

 

Onward, Captain.   :good:


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#13 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 08:06 PM

One thought that keeps popping up in my head is to treat this build as if it was a fiberglass Auto Hobbies or Braverman body from back in the day. :)


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#14 SlotStox#53

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 08:49 PM

How about a Kemtron/KTM inline motor, they look skinny &]and low enough profile :good:

Resin is definitely interesting stuff to mess around with, doesn't take much to sand or Dremel too much away!



#15 boxerdog

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 08:52 PM

Rick,

 

In deference to your display name... put a 65X in it!!! Either inline or sidewinder would do nicely. JMO.

 

dc


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#16 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 08:59 PM

Yup, the Kemtron 503 and Pittman 65 (inlines) are definitely on my radar.

 

I can't wait to get the body here. I want to see how much vintage horsepower I can cram into it as in Gator Bob's reminder that, hey, that thing had a Hemi!!!!


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#17 Jairus

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 09:04 PM

Whatever you do, don't overbuild the motor. I would go simple.

 

Plate chassis, Russkit 23 or the like with Russkit wheels and inserts for maximum detail.
Model car front tires and Ortmann rears with a Cox guide.
Save your efforts for the paint and details.

What are you going to do for the driver?


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#18 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 09:45 PM

Save your efforts for the paint and details.

 
Aye-yai-yai... ain't that the truth! :laugh2:
 

What are you going to do for the driver?

 
Maybe an early '60s Strombecker or Ulrich Mini Man with an open cockpit exposing the running gear as was done in the day.


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#19 Jairus

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 09:50 PM

Consider one of these DRIVERS before you start anything. The details nearly paint themselves.
 

I've been a big fan for a while.


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#20 Régis4446

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 12:22 AM

:good: Very interesting, I'll watch this new project.

Because I also have a C4R to do in my projects.

It was made by PSK to be mounted on a slot car.

Ghostmodels - Cunningham C4R
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#21 Kehlo

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 04:23 AM

You could always ask Dieter Jens, I bet he has a chassis and a motor for it.
 
Cunningham C4R LeMans 1954
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#22 Mattb

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 07:35 AM

Soak that body in a bottle or tub of rubbing alcohol. Keep that alcohol and re-use it for every car right before you paint. Keep those greasy fingers off the car, too. Use the alcohol to clean your hands.
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#23 don.siegel

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 09:30 AM

I have an interesting chassis idea for you, Rick: you know those Kemtron SR-20 "pancake" motors? How about one of those in a sidewinder frame? Magnesium ideally (I'm always thinking of a custom mag frame Ben Millspaugh made for an early sports car in a Car Model article...), but I know you like brass and it's easier to work with... 
 
In any case good luck; I've picked up about 10 resin kits over the years and have yet to build up a single one! (Fortunately I have friends who have assembled a few for me in trades...). That's not meant to discourage you by the way, I know you're a guy who finishes his projects! 
 
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#24 dc-65x

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 11:42 AM

Consider one of these DRIVERS before you start anything. The details nearly paint themselves.

 
Nice looking drivers, Jairus, thanks for the link. I wish there were more in 1/24 scale. The F004 "'50s Driver Figure" would have been perfect. The F001 '60s driver is the closest thing I see...
 

:good: Very interesting, I'll watch this new project.

Because I also have a C4R to do in my projects.

It was made by PSK to be mounted on a slot car.

Ghostmodels - Cunningham C4R

 
Hi Regis. My attempt at detailing this body will be nothing compared to the masterful workmanship in your project cars. I did see the pre-painted Proto Slot Kits on the Electric Dreams sight. I've wanted to give the Fisher brand a try for a while now. They claim the body is a very thin (lightweight) casting. We'll see...
 

You could always ask Dieter Jens, I bet he has a chassis and a motor for it.
 
Cunningham C4R LeMans 1954

 
You're right, Christian. Dieter was kind enough to PM me.
 

Soak that body in a bottle or tub of rubbing alcohol. Keep that alcohol and re-use it for every car right before you paint. Keep those greasy fingers off the car, too. Use the alcohol to clean your hands.

 
Thanks, Matt. I'm going to be extra careful to clean my hands and keep the body clean.
 

I have an interesting chassis idea for you, Rick: you know those Kemtron SR-20 "pancake" motors? How about one of those in a sidewinder frame? Magnesium ideally (I'm always thinking of a custom mag frame Ben Millspaugh made for an early sports car in a Car Model article...), but I know you like brass and it's easier to work with...

 
A skinny sidewinder is a real possibility. But I am really looking forward to soldering up a brass tube space frame of some sort, sidewinder or inline. I just gotta do some soldering, Don!  :crazy:
 
I'm going to contact Fisher and ask about a delivery date...


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#25 Tex

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 12:54 PM

Whoa! I've now copied that link for the driver figures! Thanks, Jairus!

 

If I'd seen it a few days earlier, I'd have saved myself some $ (bought some Cox Ford GT40 drivers on eBay).


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#26 Neckcheese

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 01:01 PM

Rick,
 
Most resin bodies like the Fisher are very heavy and not att all suited for (racing) slot cars. You can mill them out to get them lighter, but then they become very fragile.  :-(  But Fisher makes some very nice kits and they deserves to be raced. :-)
 
I am currently building a similar project, a Lotus 11 based on the Profil 24 kit
 
1/24 Scuderia Long 1958/59 Lotus 11
 
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#27 Mattb

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 02:21 PM

Those are great-looking drivers; I saved that site.
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#28 dc-65x

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 02:46 PM

Most resin bodies like the Fisher are very heavy and not at all suited for (racing) slot cars. You can mill them out to get them lighter, but then they become very fragile...

 
I'm looking forward to weighing the Fisher body when it arrives. I'll be comparing it to my period Auto Hobbies fiberglass Ferrari Testarossa. If it's close then it's OK for me. Since the original fiberglass bodies (especially in 1/24) are quite scarce, I'm thinking of this project as if it were a period fiberglass bodied car.
 
As for being suited for racing... I guess I was spoiled by the vintage racing we used to do at Slot Car Junction in South San Francisco. We all wanted to win but everyone treated each others cars with respect. No one would pass a slower car by knocking it out of the way. In fact, the slower car would usually slow down on a straight and allow the faster car to pass. Sure, crashes can happen but they were NOT the norm.
 
Anyway, it really doesn't matter for me here. There is no vintage racing here, just some hot laps on my track when the fun of building is done.
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#29 endbelldrive

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 03:39 PM

One thought that keeps popping up in my head is to treat this build as if it was a fiberglass Auto Hobbies or Braverman body from back in the day. :)


Same here. I've got a 1/24 Lister Jag on the workbench and thinking Revell RP-77 and a nice-looking set of bevel gears along with the late 1963, early 1964 chassis idea.
Bob Suzuki

#30 dc-65x

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 03:57 PM

Nice, Bob! I'd love to see that project. :clapping:

Consider one of these DRIVERS before you start anything. The details nearly paint themselves.
 
I've been a big fan for a while.

 
Okie-dokie, Jairus. I ordered the '60s GP driver, the short sleeve torso, 5'0s drivers heads, and Fangio (late) heads.
 
With all these body parts I feel like Dr. Frankenstein... or is that Frankensteen?
 

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#31 Jairus

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 04:03 PM

"No, it's pronounced "Fronkensteen."
(Remember, you started it.)

You won't be disappointed with the figures.

I found the arms to be cast really too long and took me a while to understand that this was on purpose to allow cutting and re-positioning.

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#32 Neckcheese

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 04:25 PM

Profil24 has a great vintage driver:

Figurine pilote année 50, 1/24

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#33 Jairus

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Posted 05 May 2015 - 11:37 AM

Here's a link to Patto's for the needed decals.

Get two so you can do that hood bulge in multiple pieces. And... get yourself some Walthers Solvaset, too.
 
Patto's Place
 
Cunninghams-LeMans50-55-24.JPG

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#34 beardogracing

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Posted 05 May 2015 - 03:07 PM

I've been building resin cars for years.

Scrub it with bathroom cleanser, rough the surface with fine sandpaper, wash again in soap and water, and prime with Tamiya white primer. Use Tamiya paints. See resin Lotus 24 below.

Rick, for you it should be simple!

And yes that's an Immense Miniatures Jimmy driving.
 
Easy peazy, and use Immense Miniatures drivers. Sorry, Niels, they're better. 
 
025_zpsezbqp4cf.jpg
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Chris Wright

 

 


#35 dc-65x

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Posted 05 May 2015 - 06:29 PM

Thanks, Jairus. I have Micro Set and Micro Sol decal solutions. Do you like to use the Walthers Solvaset better?
 
Nice car, Chris. That's the color I was trying for with my last vac body build. Thanks for the vote of confidence, too.
 
Order update from from Fisher Model & Pattern!
 
Your order number 624 at Fisher Model & Pattern has been updated.
 
Order status: Completed
 
WHEEEE!!!!!! :D


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#36 beardogracing

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Posted 05 May 2015 - 07:47 PM

Hi Rick,

 

I don't know if Tamiya will work on old clear bodies, but Tamiya Racing Green in their TS line of paints was specially formulated from a real Lotus 25 living in Japan, for their 1/20 kit of a Lotus 25.

 

Tamiya TS-43

 

Nice Lotus, by-the-way.

 

Chris


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#37 munter

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Posted 07 May 2015 - 02:15 PM

Good to see you have made a move to resin, Rick. Knowing your standard of work I will not be surprised to see wonderful results.

 

I have been a resin fan for the last two years... in fact I have become obsessed by it... casting in 1/32 that is.


John Warren
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#38 dc-65x

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Posted 07 May 2015 - 06:53 PM

The resin has arrived. :D

 

Cunningham%20C4R%201.jpg

 

Here are the goodies in "da box":

 

Cunningham%20C4R%202.jpg

 

The first thing I wanted to know is the weight. Would it be comparable to a '60s fiberglass body? It came in at 43 grams:

 

Cunningham%20C4R%204.jpg

 

Next up was an eBay find, an Auto Hobbies Lister Jag:

 

Cunningham%20C4R%203.jpg

 

47 grams! OK, we in the ballpark for weight. I can proceed as if I'm recreating a vintage fiberglass body build. :dance3:


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#39 endbelldrive

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Posted 11 May 2015 - 03:06 PM

Yah! Look at those curves! :heat:


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#40 Neckcheese

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 03:37 PM

Current fibreglass bodies weighs from 9-20 grams.

 

But if it not for a hardcore racer, the weight does not matter that much.

 

Our DSV bodies weighs 15-18 grams before paint, etc.  :-)

 

Niels


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#41 dc-65x

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 03:53 PM

Hi Niels,

 

As usual I'm playing in the past.   :D  I'm trying to do a hardcore racer alright... but a recreation of racer from around 1964. :crazy: The Fisher body seems to be an appropriate weight for that period.


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#42 Neckcheese

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 04:55 PM

Rick, I like that approach, but if you ever want lighter alternatives, give me a call. :-)

 

I don't like the 9-10 gram bodies as they are too fragile, but the 15 - max 20 gram bodies I make to our Danish 1965-1971 touring cars are fine. :-)

With a 130 gram minimum weight you get very good-handling cars that are great fun and very competetive to drive. :-)

 

Niels :-)


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#43 munter

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 03:46 AM

That Fisher kit looks great.

 

Wrong scale for me but I believe I can recognise quality resin bodies when I see them.

 

What is that cylinder that sits/lies on the bonnet... er hood of this model Cunningham?

 

Nice box, too.


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#44 dc-65x

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 05:06 PM

What is that cylinder that sits/lies on the bonnet... er hood of this model Cunningham?

 
C4R%20Images%2012.jpg
 
Hey John.

 

My Fisher instruction sheet calls it an "oil cooler housing".

 

I love all the scoops, louvers, velocity stacks, side pipes, and assorted lumps and bumps on the old race cars. :crazy:


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#45 dc-65x

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Posted 24 May 2015 - 12:46 PM

Parts from not only the USA but Great Britian and France have showed up. It's time to "get her done"... I hope! :crazy:
 
Rather than trying to build an exact scale "motorized model", I'm going to try and build a what I thought of in the day as a "slot racer". I will try to pay homage to the real prototype.
 
 OK, here goes. :D
 
For wheels and tires I dug around and found some that I think will work out. The prototype had 16" wheels and, I believe, the same size skinny tires front and rear. A 1/24 scale 16" wheel  would measure about .729" (16" + 1 1/2" = 17 1/2" X .04167).
 
The front wheels I have that came closest were these K&B's that measure .715". The tires are Russkit Dunlop fronts. They are going to be a bit smaller in diameter than the rears by about 1/16":
 
C4R%20Build%209.jpg
 
For the rears I'm using Russkit drag set screw wheels that will need to modified and Russkit Dunlop rear tires... actually a silicone or urethane version. Here are the original parts:
 
C4R%20Build%2010.jpg
 
The drag wheels need to be machined to match the K&B fronts. Below the stock wheel is in the middle. The K&B is on the right. The modified Russkit is on the left:
 
C4R%20Build%202.jpg
 
I've had good luck with Ortmann's Russkit rears but could not find them in the US. Luckily, Regis came to my rescue:
 

Nice work again.

For the tyres:

Ortmann Tyres

 
Ordering from RS Slot Racing in Great Britian was quick and easy. I'll be using them again. Thanks, Regis! :good:
 
I also tried some urethane tires from France that are listed on eBay. Below the original Russkit tire is on the left. The Ortmann is in the middle and the French tire is on the right:
 
C4R%20Build%2021.jpg
 
The French tire is nicely injection molded rather than cast. It is a bit larger in diameter and lacks the sidewall lettering of the original. It's also super soft and sticky.
 
For power I've decided on an inline open frame motor, a Pittman DC77-6:
 
C4R%20Build%2011.jpg
 
This motor will allow me to fit a dashboard, steering wheel, and an upper torso driver figure. More on that nightmare later. :laugh2:
 
I have two of these motors, both new in the package. Unfortunately, both look like grunt with moisture or humidity damage. Some Pittman's come out of the box and look like the day they were made and some look like this:
 
C4R%20Build%2013.jpg
 
I'll need to use the motor to build the chassis so I'll try and make her "purdy" after the chassis is done:
 
C4R%20Build%2012.jpg
 
Time to start mocking up the car in my second "Rick's" jig:
 
C4R%20Build%2018.jpg
 
The wheels and tires are set at the korrect track width and wheelbase. The motor is centered between jig pins, its front is sitting on a 1/16" spacer and its centered up with the rear axle by my alignment gizmo.
 
Next up, I've got to get the dashboard, steering wheel, and driver nightmare solved...  :wacko2:


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#46 don.siegel

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Posted 24 May 2015 - 01:29 PM

Nice, Rick. It's great following your thought process on this, but please let us know that it takes more time to make these decisions on wheels, tires, motor, etc., than seems to be the case when the photos all pop up. 

 

I know that I spend lonely evenings combing through my endless boxes (hey, catchy song title!) looking for the "mot juste" - I mean the "right part". 

 

The Vintage Police approve of your choice of motor and wheels! We have our doubts about the resin body... but it sure is pretty! 

 

I use those K&B wheels for a lot of '50s and early '60s cars, they seem to be about right, although probably a bit smaller and wider than the actual ones. On the rear wheels, aren't the regular Russkit road tires way to small for the dragster wheels? Yes, I know they probably stretch... 

 

Carry on slotting!

 

Don 



#47 dc-65x

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Posted 24 May 2015 - 04:04 PM

The Vintage Police approve of your choice of motor and wheels! We have our doubts about the resin body... but it sure is pretty!

 
I know Don, I'd give plenty to have some of those "Heavenly" fiberglass 1/24 bodies shown below. Thanks to Steve Okeefe for the scans. Below is also a link to his posting of the entire magazine article:
 
Heavenly Bodies 6311
 
Heavenly%20Bodies%201.jpg
 
Heavenly%20Bodies%202.jpg
 
So resin kits and model kits will have to satisfy my vintage building needs...
 

On the rear wheels, aren't the regular Russkit road tires way to small for the dragster wheels? Yes, I know they probably stretch...

 
Now you've got the red flags waving on that one. :o  The vintage rubber Russkit tires stretch over the drag wheels just fine. Here they are along with one of the resin kit wheels and tires:
 
C4R%20Build%208.jpg
 
BUT, will the silicone and urethane tires stretch or... BREAK.  :o  Now that I have them in hand I'd better find out...


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#48 dc-65x

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Posted 27 May 2015 - 09:06 PM

My overstretching the silicone tire and breaking it scare turned out OK. I buttered up the wheel and tire with "flow-able silicone windshield and glass sealer". The tire slipped right on and with the lubricity of the uncured sealer, centered up great.

 

Next up, I wanted to get a driver figure temporarily fitted to make sure it wouldn't interfere with the mechanical components. This is the look I'm after:

 

C4R%20Build%2019.jpg

 

It's a Bill Sippel (Auto Hobbies founder) built car I have that was featured in the 11/63 issue of Model Car Science Magazine. A full driver upper torso with arms flailing and grasping a full steering wheel inseted into a dashboard. This car uses a rather rare Strombecker driver. Rather than use up one of the few originals I have I thought would use a resin replica driver in my resin replica body:

 

C4R%20Build%2015.jpg

 

I decided to use the "Short Sleeve Torso" and the "Fangio (Late) Heads".

 

Here's a link:

 

Immenseminiatures.com

 

Putting all these body parts together so they correctly grabbed a dashboard mounted steering wheel... while placing the driver at a somewhat correct height in the cockpit proved to be, well, a nightmare for this "troubled modeler"!  :shok:  :laugh2:

 

I had to shorten arms and re-angle the arm to torso attachment points and finally (six hours later :wacko2: ) ended up with this little dude:

 

C4R%20Build%2020.jpg

 

Drilling the hole for the dudes neck was also not much fun. The piano wire hoop will be epoxied to the underside of the body leaving an "open cockpit" look like Bill Sippel's car above:

 

C4R%20Build%2017.jpg

 

Here's the mock-up in my Rick's set-up jig:

 

C4R%20Build%2016.jpg

 

Next up is my favorite part... the chassis.  :dance3:


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#49 SlotStox#53

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Posted 27 May 2015 - 09:58 PM

Sweet! Looks like it's sweeping round the corners with the rear sliding, just standing still :D

Those driver figures are neat.  :good:



#50 munter

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Posted 28 May 2015 - 02:54 AM

Thanks for the reply, Rick.The mock-up is looking great.

 

The vents, ducts, louvres, bumps, lumps, and curves sure are one of the main attractions of these older race cars.

 

I hadn't heard of the Fisher brand before reading your thread. Have you looked at the 1/24 Top Slot resin bodies?


John Warren
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