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MMW Group F gearing, rules, etc.


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#1 MSwiss

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Posted 01 November 2015 - 10:14 PM

[Splitting this discussion out of the MMW race results thread - admin]

Big Bill, knock, knock, knocking on heaven's door/the podium.
 
What are you guys gearing the FKs, again?

Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL) 
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#2 The Number of

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Posted 01 November 2015 - 11:24 PM

14t/37-38 at 64p, 13t/43-44 at 72p  most common up to 15 at 64p has been tried without much luck.
Bill Fulmer

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#3 MSwiss

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Posted 01 November 2015 - 11:34 PM

The 72p guys don't bother with trying a 14?

Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL) 
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#4 The Number of

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Posted 02 November 2015 - 05:52 AM

98% use 64p.
Bill Fulmer

The lack of any credible evidence is proof the conspiracy is working!

#5 Overdrive

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Posted 02 November 2015 - 09:25 AM

@Mike,
 
I and a few others have dabbled with a 72p 15t/41-42 ratio. I personally didn't like the steeper motor angle using a 41t spur even with a angled pinion. The 42t was ok, but seemed to give up some chute speed on red and white. Faster on purple and black, but not as well balanced between the two lane sets as 64p 14t/38. Motor ran cooler though so the jury is not out just yet. If a manufacturer (hint, hint) made a 16t angled 72p pinion, I'd be more apt to try it.
 
But 64p gears are stronger and less prone to munching a gear with our sub-60 gram cars using "to the moon" ratios and the violent tractor pull torque these P/S FK motors have. I have learned to only use a regular standard width plastic gear. The thinner JK Hawk gears, while well suited for Hawk/Falcon like motors, are more prone to damaging a tooth during the rigors of racing with a P/S FK. The JK, Pro Slot, Cahooza, and other manufactures standard width are fine though.
Dave Ronsky

#6 1fastdude

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 06:00 AM

What size rear tire with these gears (14t/37-38 at 64p)?
Eli E. Ezrow

#7 The Number of

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 06:40 AM

Most are using .790" tires cut down to .775" to .770" to get a couple of races and some testing out of a set before they fail the tech gauge.
Bill Fulmer

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#8 1fastdude

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 06:50 AM

What is minimum size for this class please? The reason for these questions are at Tri-State in Cincinnati, we are trying to get this class going and would like to use some common rules. In case a few racers would travel. What would be some of the other rules you guys use?


Eli E. Ezrow

#9 gfox

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 07:12 AM

.750" min
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#10 Samiam

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 07:14 AM

I was trying to find a set of FK Wing Car rules myself. Do any of the established organizations have this class?


Sam Levitch
 
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#11 Half Fast

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 07:52 AM

Didn't USRA just adopt a FK Wing car class (Group F) with rules?
 
Cheers,
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Bill Botjer

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#12 Samiam

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 08:10 AM

No Gp-F in USRA.

 

Most places that run them have "House Rules". FK-Wing or $100 Wing.

 

Key points would be min. weight, yes/no?, Chassis, gear restrictions, hub size, and bodies.


Sam Levitch
 
When the only tool you have is a hammer, everything is a nail.
Support your local raceway, or you won't have one.
Slot cars are quad-pods.
Support your "Local Racer."
:laugh2:

#13 Half Fast

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 08:49 AM

Not true, mon ami.
 
Rule and Class Changes for USRA

Grp F replaces Spec 12

Any current legal USRA Grp 12 chassis
Chassis may not be modified except pans may be removed
No weight min.
Any gearing
Flatted axles allowed
No axle ball bearings
Sealed PSFK motor (may change brushes and springs)
Spray glue
Spec tire $13 Max (raceway chooses the best tire for the track)
All main format
3 on/3 off
1 min Qualifying
Mains seeded:
1st-8th: A Main
9th–16th: B Main
17th-24th: C Main
 
See:Rule and Class changes for USRA
 
Cheers,
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Bill Botjer

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#14 The Number of

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 09:23 AM

At MMW we use the above rules with the exceptions,we run 2 min on and 2 min off, and the Koford M472-615 tires are not allowed at this time.

Thanks for posting the rule set, Bill.
Bill Fulmer

The lack of any credible evidence is proof the conspiracy is working!

#15 Tom Thumb Hobbies

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 10:11 AM

We run similar rules to MMW except we have no tire size minimum. Just a minimum clearance. If your car has minimum clearance then who cares what size are the tires???
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#16 Cheater

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 11:23 AM

Bump... see first post.

Gregory Wells

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#17 The Number of

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 11:23 AM

We will be instituting a tech sheet and picture taking at least once a month at MMW soon to get more info out.

And going with a tire size requirement makes it less confusing if anybody travels to a different race track and most of the Group 12 chassis in RTR form are built to that spec.
Bill Fulmer

The lack of any credible evidence is proof the conspiracy is working!

#18 1fastdude

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 11:59 AM

What's your minimum clearance at Tom Thumb's?


Eli E. Ezrow

#19 Bernard Powell

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Posted 23 November 2015 - 09:51 PM

Setting up the same type of cars at Chicagoland, with Mike Swiss helping us get it right. We hope to be competitive, we are starting off with wire & brass group 12 frame for now. To keep costs down

#20 Ronnie

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Posted 09 February 2016 - 07:07 AM

Steel gp 12 chassis at $55 that will last forever cars dont go fast enuff to bend them even at full speed crash is best choice. wire and brass that will get bent up and be high maintenance may actually be more expensive at $25
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#21 Richard G With

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Posted 09 February 2016 - 11:42 AM

Raytown has a similar class, based around the JK Nighthawk GP12 steel with Hawk 6 motor and spec tires .765, .790 and .820.

However, any legal GP12 perimeter type of frame is legal.

 

These are fast and durable but a bit over the $100 price point.

 

I think the idea of spec tires keeps the variables at bay and emphasizes the basics of setup and driving.


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#22 MSwiss

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Posted 09 February 2016 - 08:39 PM

Steel gp 12 chassis at $55 that will last forever cars dont go fast enuff to bend them even at full speed crash is best choice. wire and brass that will get bent up and be high maintenance may actually be more expensive at $25

Bernard wasn't completely accurate.

 

We aren't just using wire cars.

 

I allow anything that I can determine is less than a C12.

 

So far we have a real mish-mosh of chassis, including some that are probably I15.

 

As far as the $25 wire chassis you quote, the one I have, I sell for $9.99.

 

I also sell them to raceways, 10 for $60 & shipping.

 

When I get done with a few other projects, I plan to make my own, that will probably sell for about $30, as a kit.


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL) 
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#23 Ronnie

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Posted 10 February 2016 - 06:28 AM

Wow !!! That's 1970s pricing ... like the Limpach 8.88 race chassis
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Ron Keener

#24 MSwiss

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Posted 10 February 2016 - 10:03 PM

We're in the midst of a race.

Of amusement, a racer started the race with an old body that had .015" sidedams.

It did not work. Lol

Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL) 
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.






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