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Square wire anglewinder chassis "Pro style" car


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#1 MSwiss

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Posted 25 January 2016 - 11:59 PM

This past Sunday, along with his 1968 concours-winning Chapparal 2G, Dave Vaccaro brought this serious race car, built a year or two later.

Featuring square wire, which he said was easily obtainable from Hinsdale Raceway, when I tried the car I was surprised how it ran.

Without any air control, along with a Lenz motor,and running on everyday "spray" conditions, I expected it to be fast down straightaway and so-so in the turns, even with the Chuck Gambo-made, modern rear tires.

Just the opposite, it was just OK down the straight, and great in the turns. It went around the donut, on blue, on rails.

I went 5.46 on 12v, which we figured would be the approximate lap times from that era by the top Pros on full glue on the Hinsdale American blue King.

20160124_165022-1.jpg

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Mike Swiss
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)

Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL)
 
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#2 Pablo

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 08:01 AM

Those old style full plumbers (tilt and lift) always handle great.  :good:

 

That's a real nice car.  :)


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#3 boxerdog

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 09:11 AM

That is real Retro!!


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#4 Bill from NH

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 09:35 AM

Another great-looking old chassis. Looks like a hot B-can motor, too.

 

REHco sold flat steel wire, but it wasn't square. von Ahrens often used flat wire for his half rails, but his main rails were round.


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#5 Steve Deiters

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 09:59 AM

There was a square wire that was available at the time. I don't recall who offered it. It was kind of soft and did not bend well beyond 90 degrees.

 

About the same time there were some "pro" racers that had built some chassis with the main rails that had the tops and bottoms that had been ground with parallel flat spots. I seem to remember the theory being having something to do with the torsional rigidity. What's the next best besides ground on the top and bottom?  Square all the way around. The concept never really got any traction.

 

REH did offer wire that was flat on the top and bottom, but this wire was "bumped" in a press and typically was not very straight. My assumption was due deformation stresses on the rod that just were not intrinsically equal resulting in the warped rod all because it was "bumped" instead of ground.

 

This. like most phases in slot racing, slipped to the wayside and people began using combinations of main rail sizes or pairs of .063" wire.



#6 tonyp

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 11:23 AM

REHco made square wire but it was not very flat and was twisted along its length. Most of the pro builders had their own flat wire made at a machine shop on a surface grinder. I know that is what we did at Nutley. We even did a bunch of wire ground on only one side which I used a lot and really liked.  


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#7 Jim Lange

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 11:39 AM

The chassis I built as a kid utilized the square wire.

 

If anyone knows of any, please let me know, I'd love to duplicate one of the cars I raced long ago.



#8 Wizard16

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 11:42 AM

I just found out how far behind the times I am lol! I just built this plumber for the flat track in Dallas under RETRO rules! It handles really well at PA's Hillclimb, the closest thing to a flat track we have in Houston.

 

I have a Tony P King track anglewinder which is a rocket.

 

Plumber.jpg


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#9 John Streisguth

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 12:30 PM

What's old is new.    :)


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#10 Richard G With

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 01:51 PM

I used flat wire in a few chassis, think it came from Nutley or maybe was made by one of our locals as an after-hours project at a machine shop we worked at. It was not really worth the trouble; hard to get consistent complex bends. I started hacking rails from spring steel sheet which became available about the same time. In the end, I went back to soldered round wire because it was easier, cheaper, and produced more consistent results.

 

I think this was one of those things that we saw in a magazine and it became "the thing" for awhile until the publishing time lag brought us the "next thing." In hindsight, as well as today, so long as everyone is following the same fashion it's hard to tell if the current "thing" is really making any real difference.

 

A really interesting chassis, though and certainly worthy of being preserved!

 

Thanks for sharing the photos.


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#11 Hermit #1

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 09:32 PM

CHAMPION used to sell flatwire with several 6" lengths packaged on a card.  The stuff was surface ground top & bottom down to about .047, from .063 round.  It was very flat, seemed tougher than normal K&S piano wire, was harder to bend complex shapes and tended to crack on tight radii.  I found it best to use for main rails, not half-rails.

I used it to build several successful chassis back in the day, but eventually abandoned it due to cost, availability, and the hassles working with it.  Never bothered with square wire - the stuff from REHCO was pretty soft, and tended to bulge at the bends, requiring lots of delicate filing/grinding to square it back up.  Didn't have the same temper as true piano wire - more prone to bending in a crash.


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#12 MSwiss

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Posted 26 January 2016 - 09:37 PM

Dave V. mentioned he loved working with the stuff Hinsdale Raceway sold.
 
I didn't put the chassis under a microscope, but from the pics, it doesn't look like there are any obvious bending issues.

Mike Swiss
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)

Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL)
 
Chicagoland Raceway
17B West Ogden Ave
Westmont, IL 60559
(708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516. Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#13 Mark Johnson

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 01:26 AM

I've used .078 ground to .063 for a few cars lately with decent results .







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