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Thanks for eliminating the Puppy Dog!


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#51 Noose

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:00 PM

Not so.

Joe "Noose" Neumeister
Sometimes known as a serial despoiler of the clear purity of virgin Lexan bodies. Lexan is my canvas!
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The only thing bad about Retro is admitting that you remember doing it originally.





#52 Phil Hackett

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:15 PM

Because simplification in any endeavor almost always brings benefits.

 
Do you write your representatives in gov'ment and tell them this?   :D
 
I'm sure the lawyer in them gets a big laugh!


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#53 Frankie Schaffier

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:17 PM

Where have you been able to buy yours? Let all know so they can get them.


I was being a smart a$$ with the thrown-out O/S bodies comment due to the constant purse fight between the two parties. I suppose I should have thrown in a smiley face for good measures.

 

Though, Noose, I believe your question to be sincere. I bought mine from my local hobby shop (Cap). Not sure if Cap brought them from the distributor or directly from Ron. I normally buy quite a few at a time, so it was last season the last I bought O/S bodies.


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#54 Noose

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:20 PM

Consider yourself lucky.

Joe "Noose" Neumeister
Sometimes known as a serial despoiler of the clear purity of virgin Lexan bodies. Lexan is my canvas!
Noose Custom Painting - Since 1967
Chairman - IRRA® Body Committee - Roving IRRA® Tech Dude - "EVIL BUCKS Painter"

"Team Evil Bucks" Racer - 2016 Caribbean Retro Overall Champion
The only thing bad about Retro is admitting that you remember doing it originally.


#55 Cheater

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:20 PM

Do you write your representatives in gov'ment and tell them this?


Yes, but oddly enough, I never get a reply.

Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#56 Samiam

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:29 PM

What's next... Outlawing Outisight bodies?


If they don't meet the specs laid out in the rules... yes.
Sam Levitch
 
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#57 Mr. GoFast

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:38 PM

So up to this point in time, Tracy, you can't point to a race or a series where adding complexity has generated closer racing or increased participation?


The biggest R4 entries where when PD, F7, and TSR motors were allowed. The closest races in the history of the R4 in each class were with PD motors. Since the RH motor, attendance has fallen off and the races are not as close.


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#58 willy wonka

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:44 PM

Where the proof of that, Mr. Go Fast?


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#59 elinsley

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:45 PM

The biggest R4 entries where when PD, F7, and TSR motors were allowed. The closest races in the history of the R4 in each class were with PD motors. Since the RH motor, attendance has fallen off and the races are not as close.

 

This year at R4 the races were really close in almost, if not in, every class. 


Eric Linsley

#60 willy wonka

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:45 PM

I personally bet you a thousand dollars your race won't get as much attendance as this year's R4. Wanna take me up on that?

 

I'll be there nonetheless.


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William Custer
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#61 Noose

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:50 PM

The A Mains might have been close for the top three to five but not the other 50.


Joe "Noose" Neumeister
Sometimes known as a serial despoiler of the clear purity of virgin Lexan bodies. Lexan is my canvas!
Noose Custom Painting - Since 1967
Chairman - IRRA® Body Committee - Roving IRRA® Tech Dude - "EVIL BUCKS Painter"

"Team Evil Bucks" Racer - 2016 Caribbean Retro Overall Champion
The only thing bad about Retro is admitting that you remember doing it originally.


#62 olescratch

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:51 PM

This is the kind of "stuff" that results in my doctor's decision to ban/suggest that I stay away from racing entirely!!! Too much drama causes my blood pressure to reach unhealthy limits!!!  Always something going on that causes a big uproar!! 

 

When you ban products that were once legal, you will add an increase in the funds people have to spend to continue to participate! Now is the end result really to get rid of the PD motors or the people that are using them?  


John Stewart

#63 elinsley

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:51 PM

At the R4 The GTC-Pro overall was won by Cap by one lap over Willy. In Can-Am Cap won by two laps over Willy and in F1 Willy won by three laps over Eric G.

 

I think it should be up to each race to decide what motor off the list of approved motors they can run.


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#64 MSwiss

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 02:54 PM

Where the proof of that, Mr. Go Fast?

 

Tracy is obviously just mimicking Ron.

 

Entries peaked at R4/5 with 70 in Can-Am and 62 in F1.

 

They went down in R4/6 before Retro Hawks.

 

They continued down at R4/7, with flipping Can-Am and F1 around, along with removing Ron from the IRRA® BOD.

 

That first year the Hawk Retro was allowed in Can-Am, one lap separated the top four in Can-Am.

 

I'm sure Mike MacMasters will have something to add to Tracy Hershman's post.


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Mike Swiss
 
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#65 Noose

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:00 PM

I have been to every Premier race but the the two Southern Ones.

I have raced in 303 of the 305 Retro East races held plus our Enduros.

It's been 2-1/2 years since the HR was made legal.

Since then I have not seen PDs used in abundance at all. More went to the HR for financial reasons. Racers stayed racing and did not quit. More started to race because the motor was not a crapshoot anymore.

The first problem were claims that guys did not get their correct motors back. The next problem became the brushes after the issues at the plant. Then those getting refurbs back found they were nowhere near as good.

Most sold their PDs to drag racers or those wanting set ups for RetroPro motors.

Then of course the perceptions and constant bantering of conflict of interest.

So that's all gone.


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Joe "Noose" Neumeister
Sometimes known as a serial despoiler of the clear purity of virgin Lexan bodies. Lexan is my canvas!
Noose Custom Painting - Since 1967
Chairman - IRRA® Body Committee - Roving IRRA® Tech Dude - "EVIL BUCKS Painter"

"Team Evil Bucks" Racer - 2016 Caribbean Retro Overall Champion
The only thing bad about Retro is admitting that you remember doing it originally.


#66 JHMerriman

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:01 PM

Thank you, Mike, you just answered Greg's question.
 
R4/5 had the most entries with the four choices with motors.


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#67 The Number of

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:02 PM

Because simplification in any endeavor almost always brings benefits.

Can you point to any time in slot racing history where adding complexity, i.e. more options, has increased participation or generated closer racing?

 

Can you give me any hard evidence that it didn't? I am not talking about personal experience here either. I have found there is little documented evidence one way or the other. However conjecture is always plentiful and available. :)  :)


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#68 Cheater

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:04 PM

And of course, James, you will insist that there is a direct correlation between motor choices and attendance.


Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#69 JHMerriman

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:08 PM

No I won't, just tired of you asking the same question.

It's never a good idea to obsolete the investment many racers have made. I was honestly considering returning to the R4 next year after seeing the PDs running well in F1... but the BoD kinda killed that.
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James "Merry Muffin" Merriman

#70 MSwiss

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:08 PM

Thank you, Mike, you just answered Greg's question.
 
R4/5 had the most entries with the most choices with motors.


How did R4/5 have more motor choices than R4/6, R4/7, R4/8, or R4/9?
 
At R4/5, there was only one competitive choice.
 
At R4/7, 8, and 9, there were two competitive choices.

Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#71 Cheater

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:09 PM

Can you give me any hard evidence that it didn't?


Sure. If you can locate the data, take a look at the attendances at the various USRA Nats as more and more classes were added.

Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#72 JHMerriman

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:13 PM

How did R4/5 have more motor choices than R4/6, R4/7,R4/8 or R4/9?
 
At R4/5, there was only one competitive choice.
 
At R4/7,8 & 9, there was 2 competitive choices.


I worded that wrong, Mike. Wasn't saying that the R4/5 had more than R4/6-9. I went back and changed it.


James "Merry Muffin" Merriman

#73 Markg

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:15 PM

Because simplification in any endeavor almost always brings benefits. Can you point to any time in slot racing history where adding complexity, i.e. more options, has increased participation or generated closer racing?


You don't really need me in this one, but it seem's you guys really stepped on your ****'s with this one... LOL.

I don't even own a Puppy Dog... LOL.

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#74 The Number of

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:17 PM

Sure. If you can locate the data, take a look at the attendances at the various USRA Nats as more and more classes were added.


So there were no other factors involved? Like I said, Greg, no hard evidence is available to back your claims or mine if I want to believe racers stayed away for other reasons.
Bill Fulmer

The lack of any credible evidence is proof the conspiracy is working!

#75 Arne Saknussem

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Posted 25 March 2016 - 03:18 PM

Until some of you understand the basics of logic and proper argument/debate, do yourselves and everyone else a favor and put a sock in it.

 

Just a recommendation, of course.


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