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Late '60s Porsche 908 Chicago style basement racer


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#1 MSwiss

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 01:45 PM

Chuck Gambo showed me this little gem that was gifted to him from long time basement racer, Bob Von Stover, before he moved.

Bob raced in the highly competitive Chicago area basement circuit that the famous Roy Moody was part of.

Chuck theorized that the milled pans on this were more likely than not made by Roy.

 

What I never realized, when I saw this type of car before, was that the acrylic, guide pin, pickup braid, front wheel, holder, pivoted a bit to give the car a bit of steering action.

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Mike Swiss
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Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
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#2 Dave Crevie

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 03:56 PM

Nice example of another variant of the "pan car" of the time.

 

It's weird how long the 1/32 guys used guide pins after guide flags had come out. I have a 1/32 Maserati Birdcage I built on a Gar-Vic chassis which used threaded rod to connect the front and rear haves of the frame. I had the acrylic block with guide pin set-up on it, and when other slot racers see this, they tell me the car had to be earlier than 1960. I built the car, and I know when I built it. It runs a Bonner motor and a homemade fiberglass body. I need to get wheels on this thing and see if I can get it running again. 



#3 Cheater

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 04:00 PM

And you need to post some pics of it, too, Dave!


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#4 don.siegel

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 05:32 PM

Nice car, Mike!

 

That thing must be scary fast... are you sure that's a steering effect, and not just a loose screw? I've seen something like this on some of my Midwest pan, guide pin cars, and asked myself the same question. Some had loose pivoting independent front wheels, which I guess is a form of steering as well, and I think Roy Moody was one of the guys who did that... 

 

Don 


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#5 MSwiss

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 05:39 PM

Chuck just recapped both the front and rears.

 

 I'm pretty sure he is going to bring it by Sunday, for our monthly "fun" races, to shake it on the Fiedler Flat..


Mike Swiss
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)

Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL)
 
Chicagoland Raceway
17B West Ogden Ave
Westmont, IL 60559
(708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516. Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#6 MSwiss

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 06:34 PM

are you sure that's a steering effect, and not just a loose screw? I've seen something like this on some of my Midwest pan, guide pin cars, and asked myself the same question. Some had loose pivoting independent front wheels, which I guess is a form of steering as well, and I think Roy Moody was one of the guys who did that... 

I questioned that, also.

 

Chuck insisted that was the way it was supposed to be.

 

I question if it was a good idea with the pin concept.

 

Speaking of which, as you probably know, calling it a pin is a bit of a misnomer.

 

It's more of a "mini-blade".

 

Unless Chuck replaces it, I expect it will probably break during it's run on Sunday.

 

It's got a big wear notch on one side.


Mike Swiss
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)

Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL)
 
Chicagoland Raceway
17B West Ogden Ave
Westmont, IL 60559
(708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516. Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#7 dc-65x

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 08:10 PM

I love the early 1/32 cars. Thanks for sharing this beauty Mike.


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#8 NY Nick

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 08:18 PM

Thanks for posting, You learn something every day.

A real gem.


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#9 MSwiss

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 08:20 PM

A question for anyone;

Chuck identified the motor as a B Production, but I only remember them as with 2 small round homes and a rectangular notch by the endbell, or just a retangular hole.

Were there any versions with 2 "normal" sized holes?

Mike Swiss
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)

Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL)
 
Chicagoland Raceway
17B West Ogden Ave
Westmont, IL 60559
(708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516. Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#10 Ramcatlarry

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Posted 11 May 2016 - 10:49 PM

The Mura can -to me- looks like a standard 1980's era wasp.  The 908 spyder first raced at Sebring in 1969. 

 

This car could have raced into the 1990's  when I raced with Bob at several of the club tracks in the area. In the '90's, many of the club cars used axle tubes soldered right to the back of the motor as many of the British club cars did before the spring steel frame innovations.

 

I will bring my 4 -wheel steering pitman Chapparel with the pin guide, sunday.  I still have a length of 1/8" nylon rod to make guide pins.


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Larry D. Kelley, MA
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#11 rodslot53

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Posted 12 May 2016 - 06:17 AM

Don,

You mention your Midwest pan cars, are these the same type of car that was featured in a copy of the British "Model Cars" magazine. Have you any photos of your cars. Was this type of chassis ever used in the 1/24th ranks?

Rod.


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#12 don.siegel

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Posted 12 May 2016 - 06:37 AM

Hi Rod, 

 

Any reference on which issue of Model Cars? Don't remember that offhand... 

 

The 1/24 AMT chassis was a copy of these pan chassis, and I believe it was designed by a Midwest racer, Dick Dobson... 

 

Don 

 

PS: here's one I just restored for a possible race: 

McLaren-3_zpscngqb6fz.jpg

 

McLaren%20%20midwest%20pan%20bottom_zpsz

 

And a much earlier version: 

ListerMaseratichassis.jpg

 

From the same builder as the first one: 

FordMkIV132SWchassisbottom.jpg

 

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The LASCM has some stunning cars from Gene Wallingford as well. 


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#13 Bill from NH

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Posted 12 May 2016 - 07:09 AM

An interesting way how they "tuned" the handling weights. I hadn't seen that used before.  Car Model magazine had a chassis "how-to"  article in a couple issues on building chassis in the style of the second car you show. I have the first one, but not the others.


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#14 don.siegel

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Posted 12 May 2016 - 07:46 AM

Right Bill, by Pete Hagenbuch, who did most of the chassis articles. In fact, he called this type by another name, but can't remember what offhand, and it still looks like a pan chassis to me! 

 

Don 



#15 Dave Crevie

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Posted 12 May 2016 - 03:40 PM

The same "pan car" idea of construction was used in 1/24th. I still have several I built, one which has been restored and that I have run at Mike's back when Dave Feidler, Mark Mattei, and I would drag out some of our old s**t to play with.

 

I'll post some pics if I can get to it, or maybe bring it to Mike's and he can shoot it and post it.



#16 dc-65x

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Posted 12 May 2016 - 04:39 PM

I love the early Midwest style "brass pan and guide pin" cars. Here are my 3 babies (all eBay finds) and a link to their restoration:

 

Midwest 1/32 Racers... brass pans and guide pins!

 

Lotus%2040%20after%2016.jpg

 

Lotus%2040%20after%2015.jpg

 

 


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Rick Thigpen
Check out Steve Okeefe's great web site at its new home here at Slotblog:
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There's much more to come...


#17 MSwiss

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Posted 14 May 2016 - 07:21 PM

The Mura can -to me- looks like a standard 1980's era wasp.  The 908 spyder first raced at Sebring in 1969. 
 
This car could have raced into the 1990's  when I raced with Bob at several of the club tracks in the area. In the '90's, many of the club cars used axle tubes soldered right to the back of the motor as many of the British club cars did before the spring steel frame innovations.
 
I will bring my 4 -wheel steering pitman Chapparel with the pin guide, sunday.  I still have a length of 1/8" nylon rod to make guide pins.

Larry's cool Chapparal 2F with trailing front wheels.

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Mike Swiss
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)

Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder (pointless era - LOL)
 
Chicagoland Raceway
17B West Ogden Ave
Westmont, IL 60559
(708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516. Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#18 don.siegel

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Posted 15 May 2016 - 04:18 AM

That is very cool - how does it go? 

 

I was going to ask about the 4W steering, then I saw the little slot under the pan at the rear, I assume that's where the rear-wheel "steering" comes in... great car in any case. 

 

Don 



#19 Ramcatlarry

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Posted 15 May 2016 - 08:47 AM

Actually, the guide pin pushes one end of the bellcrank in the front of the motor and lets the rear pivot on that rear point to 'steer' a few degrees. I does cut down on the drifting..  Other than replacing the pickup braid, this car is 'as used' in the Glenwood Club 1/32 races of 1968-1969.  I have some reconstruction to do, the old butyrate shell is fragile.  The motor is not just one Pittman, but part of three: 196 brush holder, 65-6V arm and DC-62 motor case and the larger magnets....a big block for that era.  All ceramic cans can outrun it.

 

I sanded the original 1968 Gray foams and did ten laps on the Mid America Monster flat track yesterday in between the first race (EVER) on the new 2016 Worlds Flat track. 


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#20 Ecurie Martini

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 08:20 AM

Where was all this activity hiding when I lived in Winnetka (1970-83)?  I recall visiting a shop in Evanston looking for tires to replace the petrified rubber on my late 50's Merit conversions.  There was a large track occupied by hurtling objects that were supposed to represent cars but, so far as I could tell, all they had to offer was funny green, orange or pale gray things that looked like miniature sanding drums.  I also found a hobby shop in Glenview - on Waukegan Road as I recall - usual hobby stuff but no indication of slot car activity - so I kept on building my ship models.

 

EM


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#21 don.siegel

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 09:57 AM

That was Tom Thumb's in Evanston EM, which finally closed last year, but the last of the slot tracks (they started with 7!) was long gone... and if you had asked they probably still had some old stock, because until a couple years ago I swung by there every year when visiting my brother to stock up on K&S. Glen, the older guy who had been around at the time, would always bring out some old stock from the basement - no cars, but lots of funky parts! 

 

Like the man said, it was basement racing, so underground by definition... I wound up back in Chicago for about a year in 76-77, but never even thought to look for a functioning hobby shop - thought it had all disappeared by then, and besides, I was trying to be a genius... 

 

Don 



#22 Ramcatlarry

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 12:29 PM

Club racing was very under the radar back then. Those that read the magazines would need to read between the lines and do real detective work to get involved in the few clubs and home tracks around.  Back then the Midwest 'circuit' of Rockford, Milwaukee, Detroit, and "Chicago(actually Lombard)" was discussed, but only after the fact of events unless you actually were able to participate...

 

Who ever heard about the Berwyn 1/32 Invitational Race of 1968?   I had some photos and an arm patch......do not think IT ever made the magazines.


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#23 ajd350

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Posted 06 August 2016 - 10:37 PM

Here's an early effort of my dad's from when he was part of the Glenwood club. Bonner motor, cut-down Strombecker flag with a nylon rod as a guide pin.

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#24 ajd350

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Posted 06 August 2016 - 10:43 PM

Moving forward shows the use of the plexi block and nylon stock guide pin which carried through as long as he raced with the group, about 1962-69.

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#25 ajd350

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Posted 06 August 2016 - 10:56 PM

I believe he built the brass chassis himself but he bought the spring steel chassised car with the body from it's builder. I recall our trip to get a new arm, tires and such to get the car up and running, in about 1969. The car remains in the same state today as time constraints ended his racing for a while.

 

As far as Roy Moody having done the pans on Bob's car, Roy jumped ship in favor R/C racing in about 1966 and never looked back right up to the day he died (literally).

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