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Dyna-Rewinds question


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#1 gc4895

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 04:15 PM

OK, truth is I just don't remember so I'm asking the question. Timing is 1968-69. At the track where I raced there was a builder that I believe used all Dyna Rewinds. I clearly remember those bright yellow cans in every car he built. If memory serves, they cost about $9/motor and the trick was to buy as many as you could and sort through them to find the "hot ones" (or so we thought anyway). I do know that I recall seeing boxes and boxes of yellow Dyna Rewinds that he carried around. I know I bought a bunch of yellow Dyna-Rewinds and none of them ever ran like his cars. ( I know, I know. Typical racer "sour grapes." Same stuff I say every time I get Retro cars on the track and my Retro Hawks are so much "slower" than everyone else's. Times may change but some things just stay the same.)
 
There was no "class" or anything else at these races. It was a bring what you have affair and the only rules were clearance and don't hurt the track. 
 
Would those motors have been 26D? I'm getting them mixed up with what are C-can motors today. I feel like I missed racing the Mabuchi or 36D stuff since that was all big and in the Cox and other production kinds of cars. 
 
I recall that along with the Dyna Rewinds were also chrome Champion cans and a lot of my cars had those. There was an armature rewinder that financed his racing by building and selling motors. His were all sold in chrome Champion cans.  These motors were for real. You could specify your wind and be as bad as you wanted to be. However, there no guarantees were either given or implied. At times, super fast followed by smoke was what you got. 
 
The motor I remember we all dreamed of getting our hand on were Kean Cans from the east coast. However these cost $60 a copy if I remember correctly. They may have as well cost $1,000 they were so far out of reach for my racing program. 
 
Sorry if these are ignorant questions. I've only recently got this whole mini motor thing figured out sorting Hawks from Hawk 7s vs Retro Hawks vs FK 2002s.
Mark Bauer




#2 tonyp

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 06:30 PM

Dyna did both 26D and 16D sized motors.


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#3 gc4895

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 08:22 PM

Clearly. So 26D = C-can. Got it! Thanks!!!


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#4 Ramcatlarry

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 11:26 PM

NOT really. Dyna/MPC is a brand and the 'rewind' initially was a replacement armature for their second motor design - a can similar to the 26D or longer 36D. Have not found one in my parts box yet, but I recall them being used in 36D cans. The OD on the armatures that I have are larger than 16D or C-cans, which use a 13 mm OD armature (0.515"+/-). The 26D can length is close to the C-can, but the armature is larger OD than 13mm.  I am thinking that the Dynacharger and the later motor were 15mm arm OD - or more.

 

Did a 16D armature exist? Maybe...  Chrome cans came in all sizes.


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#5 don.siegel

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Posted 30 July 2016 - 05:07 AM

The yellow cans would have been the old K&B Wildcat cans, which Dyna often used - but that would be more in the '66-67 timeframe when they started out. This was strictly a 16D motor, although a bit different from many because it had the floating can bearing, but was still endbell drive. All the other companies with the floating bearing used can drive. The C-can is an evolution of the 16D which came later and is a bit flatter, has different brush gear, etc. 
 
If you're talking about '68-69, I would think that the current Dyna motors had moved on to a more modern can by then - and they would generally be 16Ds, not 26Ds. However, when Dyna started out they focused more on the 26D models. 
 
I'm not at home, so can't add any photos, but maybe somebody else can... 
 
Don 
 
PS: from the photo library 
 
A K&B can alongside some other 16Ds: 
 
16Dcandrive.jpg
 
Arm from early Dyna 26D; the white epoxy and balancing marks were typical. 
 
Dyna26Darm.jpg
 
A later Dyna-Rewind, '67-68 era I'd guess: 
 
Dyna%20HP%201_zpsqsyd3lkv.jpg
 
Dyna%20HP%202_zpsq2mlyd36.jpg

#6 havlicek

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Posted 30 July 2016 - 08:13 AM

NOT really. Dyna/MPC is a brand and the 'rewind' initially was a replacement armature for their second motor design - a can similar to the 26D or longer 36D. Have not found one in my parts box yet, but I recall them being used in 36D cans. The OD on the armatures that I have are larger than 16D or C-cans, which use a 13 mm OD armature (0.515"+/-). The 26D can length is close to the C-can, but the armature is larger OD than 13mm. I am thinking that the Dynocharger and the later motor were 15mm arm OD - or more.
 
Did a 16D armature exist? Maybe...  Chrome cans came in all sizes.

 
Certainly Dyna-Rewind did both 16D arms and 26D arms, and I've had both the yellow K&B as well as the silvery versions come across my desk. The "MPC Dyn-O-Charger" was a large 36D sized motor (the 26D falls between the 16D and 36D, which the MPC motor most resembled in size) with a silver can, red endbell, round holes, weird brushes, decent magnets that ran OK... nothing special (although maybe better than an typical 36D?... though there were also hotter "3v" 36D arms/motors such as from Classic). The can metal was sort of thin-ish, but the endbell was molded of a durable material. I didn't know that "Dyna-Rewind" even part of or related to "MPC Dyn-O-Charger"... were they?, or is there some confusion here because of the similarity of names?

* 26D arm is .590" diameter, and the can is NOT even similar to a C-can, being shorter, but taller and wider. Consequently, the 26D armature was quite short by the standards of the day, measuring only .400" long (without the fiber stack-end insulators), compared to the 16D armature's over .470" length.
 
* 16D armature (old style as in Mabuchi) was a nominal .510" diameter (measuring around .509"-ish)
 
* C-can armatures derived from the 16D arms, but stack lengths began to vary in much the same way as early rewinders would often remove some lams. To this day, you will see people stick C motor arms in D motors as there is some interchangeability if the stack and com don't mess things up.  C can arms (*including modern) can have a diameter... stock... from between .510" to .518".   There may be other stock C motor lams out there.

* There are also modern D motor arms with a .560" diameter. The Parma EPX and similar magnets installed in a D motor (either modern or vintage) will make for a larger "hole" that these arms will fit. These lams can also be used in the 26D if you shim the magnets to make up for the much larger hole meant for a .590" diameter 26D armature.
 
Here's a picture of the MPC Dyn-O-Charger mounted in a car that I found online:
 
MPC_zpsdgn7dzyx.jpg
 
-john
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#7 ravajack

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Posted 30 July 2016 - 02:26 PM

I didn't know that "Dyna Rewind" even part of or related to "MPC Dyn-O-Charger"...were they?, or is there some confusion here because of the similarity of names?

 

Certainly it is a severe case of confusion, as ramcatlarry in his posting clearly is mixing up Bud & Ted's "Dyna-Rewind" brand of modified Mabuchi motors with the MPC brand Dyn-O-Charger and Dyn-O-Can motors, which are entirely different creatures.
 
**** obviously happens...


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#8 havlicek

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Posted 30 July 2016 - 04:15 PM

Thanks, Bertil. I figured that, but wasn't sure. Heck, digging around my pile-o'-stuff, I even found one of the Dyn-O-Can motors complete and in a screw cap tube.  The thing even has a price sticker on it of $10 (maybe done later). God, I hate these motors! :)

 

-john


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#9 gc4895

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Posted 31 July 2016 - 12:16 AM

Thanks all for the help!
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#10 Horsepower

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Posted 08 September 2016 - 07:08 PM

Thanks, Bertil. I figured that, but wasn't sure. Heck, digging around my pile-o'-stuff, I even found one of the Dyn-O-Can motors complete and in a screw cap tube.  The thing even has a price sticker on it of $10 (maybe done later). God, I hate these motors! :)

 

-john

John, tell me why you hate those motors. I ask because I had an MPC Ford "J" car with the Dynocan motor and it was a great motor (1967) on the Hill Climb.


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#11 Mattb

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Posted 08 September 2016 - 09:20 PM

Guys I think in some of the old ads, you could buy a new rtr car, but the motor would be a Dyna rewind. Not sure who was offering this service, but I'll look thru some magazines tonite and see what I can find.
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#12 Bill from NH

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Posted 08 September 2016 - 09:32 PM

I seem to recall the Dyna Rewind motors only increased the RTR costs $1. I never got one, nor remember the company that offered them. It might have been Dyna Rewind itself.


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#13 don.siegel

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Posted 09 September 2016 - 04:20 AM

Yes, it was Dyna-Rewind itself that offered these. It was a 99 cent offer, but that was either limited in time or only for certain cars; otherwise it was just $1.99 over the cost of the car and they would send it to you. That's how I got my Cucuracha... 1967 I think. The Dyna screamed, but I had no idea that I should have changed the gear ratio, added weight, etc. It worked ok on our local track, but I seem to remember adding tire traction goop about every 10 laps... 

 

Offhand, I think the ad was in a Model Car & Track, maybe the April 67 issue - I still have the issue I cut out the ad from, will have to check tonight when I get home. 

 

Don 



#14 don.siegel

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Posted 09 September 2016 - 05:07 PM

Here's the first ad I found, from the March 1967 issue of Model Car & Track. 

 

Dyna-Rewind%2099cent%20ad-MCT0367_zpshxt

 

It was 99 cents extra for the cars listed and $1.99 for any other kit with a can motor. A couple months later they ran another add, just giving the total price for four different cars, and with the motor just adding a buck or two. 

 

Don 



#15 tonyp

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Posted 10 September 2016 - 11:30 AM

That's how they started out.

"And if my thought-dreams could be seen they'd probably put my head in a guillotine. But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only." - Dylan

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#16 88honcho

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Posted 12 September 2016 - 11:37 PM

Random point:

Their 26D motors were mostly orange Classic cans with foil sticker.


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#17 88honcho

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Posted 12 September 2016 - 11:42 PM

 Random fact:

The MPC Dyn-O-Can arms are .700" with a .490 stack (includes insulators).


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