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Need advice on Pro style chassis


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#1 Steve M.

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 03:58 PM

Hello to all,

 

I am new here, but am a long time slot car collector - been quite a while since I actually raced anything.  I have a good knowledge of the production cars - Cox, Russkit, etc.  But minimal knowledge when it comes to pro racing type chassis designs.

 

I was referred here by DC-65X, he said this would be the place to get the best information.

 

Back in September a friend of mine acquired a slot car collection from a North Carolina estate auction, I purchased the entire collection from him "as found".  I am just now finding the time to get around to restoring some of these.  I have way more chassis than bodies, and most of the bodies that I do have are well beaten.

 

Here are photos of the chassis top & bottom.  I don't think there is anything here of any significance, but I want to be absolutely certain before I go working on them.  The only ones that look to be reasonably professional are the 2 on the top left, maybe someone can identify the design or style of the build?  The others as far as I know are just projects that will need some serious work - a couple Champion angle winders, a Champion Stock Car Chassis, some modified Dynamic Chassis, Cobras, Ferrets.  Also not shown, this guy loved Cox IFC chassis, there are about a dozen of them.

 

chassis1.jpgchassis2.jpg

 

 

And here are the bodies.  The blue Mirage is the only body that is still fully intact, I think it is a Dynamic possibly factory painted, wish it had the interior.  Some of the others I would love to find replacements for, but that may be difficult or costly.  I think I have them ID'd correctly, please correct me if wrong.  The Lotus & Elfin I think are Russkit.  The Ford GT & Mclaren I believe are Dynamic handling bodies.  The Lancer Honker I already have an NOS replacement for that one.  The red one I think is just an old Revell Lola(not concerned with replacing that one).  And I am not sure about the Indy F1 style car.

 

chassis3.jpg

 

Any information/input on these would be greatly appreciated.

 

Steve


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#2 Pablo

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 04:31 PM

All nice chassis, good historical pieces. But at the risk of seeming a party-pooper, I have 2 comments:

 

-The upper left two may qualify as "Pro Racing" replica types. Other than that, I see mostly productions and scratchbuilds.

Not saying that's bad, just pointing out the difference. The golden era of professional racers in slot cars only lasted a very short few years.

 

-If you plan to unsolder/resolder things as part of your restorations, be mentally prepared for 45 + year old metals to go "sproing".

Especially the ones that were origianlly stressed to force them to fit when built, and stressed in crashes.

Before you know what happened, you'll have a pile of pieces that don't fit together any more.

 

There are many others here better qualified to help than me - I was just first on the scene :)

Whatever you decide to do, I guarantee you came to the right place for help. :good:


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#3 Tim Wilkins

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 07:07 PM

Top two bodies on the upper left appear to be Mirage Dynamic handling bodies.


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#4 Steve M.

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 07:24 PM

Just realized that I probably should have put this in the amateur car forum - if this is the wrong forum for this, my apologies about that.

 

No party-pooper at all.  I was not expecting them to be anything, actually I was hoping they weren't.  With very limited of knowledge of this type chassis from a collectible standpoint I just wanted to be absolutely certain before changing anything.  The two on the top left I will probably just clean up, re-solder a couple of loose pieces and go from there, I don't think they will need a full rebuild.  I have rebuilt some old chassis in the past, I can remember a few things almost flying apart when the solder was heated - I am 40 now, and that was back when I was in college, so its been about 20 years since I last raced or built anything.  As a collector of production cars I am well experienced in things like Cox Mag Chassis, Dynamic Chassis, Monogram Brass Chassis, Russkit Pans, etc, but this is a whole other world and I know that.

 

 

Steve 


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#5 Pablo

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 09:51 PM

I could have moved it to "Amateur Vintage Cars" but I think it's fine staying here, Steve.

It was "6 or one half dozen" - either way was OK.

 

Sounds like you know what you've got and I'm glad you understood my point about unsoldering old chassis.

 

Welcome to Slotblog :drinks:


Paul Wolcott

#6 Bill from NH

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 11:38 PM

The second from the left in the top row looks like it was build from a Dynamic kit, but a Cobra drop arm was used instead of the Dynamic pieces.The forth from left in the bottom row with the chrome 26D motor is a chassis that was sold by both Cobra & Phaze III. Other than the three Champions & three Ferrets, you have six of somebody's scratchbuilts. The scratchbuilt designs are nice to look at, but I don't see anything outstanding that's worth a lot of money & shouldn't be played with. Have fun getting these on the track. I wish I had a good source for repopped vintage bodies, but I don't ever since Tom Andersen in Ft Wayne, IN closed shop last year.


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#7 havlicek

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Posted 26 December 2016 - 07:22 AM

I wouldn't know about any significance (but that's not my thing!), but it looks to me like you got a nice collection of cars representing what an avid slotter (*who liked getting his hands dirty and fingertips burned) would have put together.  As such, they represent a good snapshot of the general history of the hobby.  Cleaning them up, getting rid of all that extra solder, making them track-ready and all that involves could be a heckuva lot of time and fun.  Anyway, welcome to SlotBlog!

 

-john


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#8 dc-65x

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Posted 26 December 2016 - 12:16 PM

Hi Steve and welcome to Slotblog,

 

Restoring these chassis can be fun and rewarding. A powerful soldering iron and a supply of "solder sucker upper stuff" is very helpful:

 

wick.jpg

 

We'd love to follow along with your projects with pictures :D

 

Rick


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#9 Steve Okeefe

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Posted 26 December 2016 - 01:50 PM

Hi Steve,

 

Quite a collection you have!

 

For the purposes of ID and providing information, lets give them names (actually numbers).  I see 15 chassis or parts of chassis, arranged in three rows.  First row numbers 1 - 6, second row numbers 7-13 and third row 14 and 15.

 

To begin, all the chassis in the photos *should* date from late (October-ish) 1966 to very early 1970.

 

When I say *should* I mean that they are made of parts and have design features that fit into the late 1966 to early 1970 time frame.  As to when they were *actually* built, it is not possible to say (someone could have cobbled them together a few years before you acquired them).  But for the sake of the argument, let's assume they are all vintage construction.

 

Some guidelines for assigning dates:

 

Pro scratchbuilders built inline chassis until the end of April 1968.  After April 1968 all pro-scratchbuilt sports cars and coupes were anglewinders.  I don't see any chassis in the photos I would characterize as "pro-built", but it's easy to pick out the anglewinders.  All of them (1,2 3,6,8 and 14) date to after April 1968.

 

Chassis 8 and 14 almost certainly date to the end of 1969 or early 1970.  Both are pre-fab stamped chassis - and very early examples!  Chassis 14 is a generic Group 20, possibly made by Dynamic or Champion.  Chassis 8 *might be* a Group 12 (or some variation on a 20) made by Champion (I'm a little fuzzy is this area - maybe someone else could help with ID?)

 

For manufacturers, there was some latency period, so you may still see manufactured inline chassis produced after April 1968 (Example: Dynamic, Cobra and Auto World to name a few), but they were pretty much gone by 1969.

 

Hinged body mounts, which evolved into side pans, were first introduced in October of 1967, so everything with fixed (non-hinged) body mounts likely dates to before October 1967.  Examples: numbers 5, 7 and 9-13 (Hard to tell on a few.)

 

Plumber hinges burst onto the scene in August 1968,  so chassis with plumber hinges definitely date to after August 68 and those without likely before.  The only chassis I see with a plumber hinge is number 1.

 

Chassis 9 and 10 (and possibly 5) are built for and have Mabuchi FT-26 motors (FT-26D motors had double ended shafts).  Mabuchi FT-26 and 26D motors date from October 1966 through about the end of 1967.  They were never generally adopted by the pros, but were popular for local racing throughout 1967.  So, chassis 9, 10 and possibly 5 date to 1967.

 

Brass strip construction (chassis 13) was popular in 1967.  So chassis 13 was most likely built during that year.

 

One last thing - I note that all the anglewinders are right-side drive - usually (but not always) in indication that all the motors were endbell drive.

 

That should be enough to keep you busy for awhile...  :wacko2:

 

Welcome to SlotBlog, and remember, "We're all mad here"  :laugh2:

 


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#10 MSwiss

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Posted 26 December 2016 - 03:12 PM

Cool stuff.

 

I especially like the Dynamic/scratchbuilt "hybrids", especially the the one second to the right, middle row.


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#11 Steve M.

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Posted 26 December 2016 - 03:24 PM

Amazing information, tremendously helpful, I cannot even begin to thank you all enough.  I am going to have to print this and read through everything to fully take it all in.  

 

Definitely going to need to find some of the de-solder braid, that would be most helpful on some of these.

 

I will post some pics when the first one is done, I only have 2 nice bodies on hand right now - a Lancer McLaren MK6A( someone painted the details and not the main body color, but never mounted it) and a NOS Lancer Honker that I got on-line from DC-65X  a little while back.  I am only free until Jan. 17th, after that my free time will be less, I will see how much I can get done in that time.

 

Here is a couple photos of the parts box that came with these, much more organized now than it was when I got it.  I think I should have enough parts to be able to rebuild them. 

 

Steve

 

chassis4.jpgchassis5.jpg


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#12 slotbaker

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Posted 26 December 2016 - 03:28 PM

Nice collection of Dynamic bits, and plenty of hardware to complete quite a few.

Looks like a lot of fun to come.

:)


Steve King


#13 NSwanberg

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Posted 27 December 2016 - 04:11 AM

Cool stuff.

 

I especially like the Dynamic/scratchbuilt "hybrids", especially the the one second to the right, middle row.

 

Does anybody else think that Dynamic scratch building with a screw driver might be a way to get young people into slot car racing?

 

Does anybody know if those molds are still around? In our CNC age they would not be hard to recreate. I am not even sure what the metal was. The cheapest aluminum that it was possible to buy?


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#14 boxerdog

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Posted 27 December 2016 - 10:51 AM

That's a pretty good idea. A "no-solder" retro type car with a stronger guide tongue and simple body mounts??? 


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#15 SlotStox#53

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Posted 27 December 2016 - 11:34 AM

That's a pretty good idea. A "no-solder" retro type car with a stronger guide tongue and simple body mounts??? 


Sounds a really simple & cool idea. No solder/just "bolt together" cars for people to make and race :D

I'd of loved to build the Dynamic based cars as a kid.

#16 MSwiss

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Posted 27 December 2016 - 02:00 PM

 

Does anybody else think that Dynamic scratch building with a screw driver might be a way to get young people into slot car racing?

 

Does anybody know if those molds are still around? In our CNC age they would not be hard to recreate. I am not even sure what the metal was. The cheapest aluminum that it was possible to buy?

I doubt the casting molds are around.

If they were, I would think somebody would of made some "new" parts.

 

As far as CNC, there are the Scholer/Scale Auto type chassis.

Not very cheap, and maybe a few too many bolts.

Regardless, something about them leaves me cold.

 

I thought about resurrecting/replicating the Dynamic stuff about 5-6 years ago.

One of my friends/racers has the background.

But the economics just don't make sense.

Not enough people race 1/24 cars.

 

That's a pretty good idea. A "no-solder" retro type car with a stronger guide tongue and simple body mounts??? 

Sounds like an FCR. LOL


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#17 raisin27

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Posted 27 December 2016 - 02:28 PM

Mike, I think they agree with you that not enough people race 1/24 cars. If I am reading this right the idea was to come up with something that would get more people involved.

 

Great intentions, but I doubt it would produce the desired results


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#18 boxerdog

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Posted 27 December 2016 - 07:41 PM

I doubt the casting molds are around.

If they were, I would think somebody would of made some "new" parts.

 

As far as CNC, there are the Scholer/Scale Auto type chassis.

Not very cheap, and maybe a few too many bolts.

Regardless, something about them leaves me cold.

 

I thought about resurrecting/replicating the Dynamic stuff about 5-6 years ago.

One of my friends/racers has the background.

But the economics just don't make sense.

Not enough people race 1/24 cars.

 

Sounds like an FCR. LOL

I guess you are right!!! I was thinking more like the originals with inline and sidewinders and some kinda floaty body mount, but it might not be fast enough to sustain any interest...like an FCR!!


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