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Ti22 at Long Beach GP


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#1 Phil Hackett

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 09:58 AM

A long-time friend, who's been in the racing industry for a long time, came by yesterday and told me that a *new* Ti22  (Mk 2-1970) will be at the Grand Prix for the Can-Am demo/race. This car wasn't rebuilt but was built from the ground up with the materials and methods of the period. The owner/builder bought the rights, designs, and drawings from the designer of the car.

 

Look for more info as the race approaches.


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#2 Tim Neja

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 01:16 PM

Wow that's so cool!! Will look forward to seeing it in Long Beach!!  :D


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#3 Bill from NH

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 01:39 PM

Sounds like a new class of retro cars is coming. :)


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#4 Dave Crevie

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 02:00 PM

Glad somebody is doing this. I also acquired a set of drawings from Peter before he passed, as well as drawings for the Shadow Mk II. I had a wild dream of re-creating the Bryant car, but it got lost in all the other resto projects I was involved in.

I always rooted for the underdog teams, and Autocoast was one I formed an affection for. One of the highlights of the 35th Can-Am reunion dinner was to talk with Peter at length about the inception of the Shadow project, and how some design concepts were carried over from the Ti22.

Of the racing greats I have met in my lifetime, he was one of my favorites.

#5 Phil Hackett

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 08:39 PM

Bob Lee was the owner of the McLaren M20 (Denny Hulme's car). I had the priveledge to work on... It's a little nerve-racking wrenching on something so historic and valuable (God! Please! No stripped threads!!!!!), especially when the truck is arriving in six hours to pick up the car for Road America)
 
Here's more info and a link:
 
Ti22 at LBGP
 
ti22scd.jpg
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#6 Tom Eatherly

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Posted 04 April 2017 - 06:50 PM

Now, that is awesome right there.


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#7 Half Fast

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 08:18 AM

The photo appears to be of the original car not the "new" one.

 

Cheers


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#8 Bob Lee

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Posted 04 August 2017 - 07:17 PM

Here is a great photo taken by Marshall Autry at the LBGP Can-Am race of the recreated Ti22 Mk II.
 
ti22a.jpg
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#9 Dave Crevie

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Posted 05 August 2017 - 02:13 PM

My long time wish has come true. The Ti22 lives again!

Bob, you and/or your team are geniuses if you were able to re-create the formed areas of the titanium. Having worked with Ti for so many years, I know it is not an easy thing to do.

#10 Bob Lee

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Posted 05 August 2017 - 02:35 PM

Dave, we started the Mk II project in 2013. 

We had to learn how to machine, weld, and hot form Titanium. The hot forming was the real challenge. We ended up buying a "Bakers Pride" pizza oven. It was the only oven I could find that would get to 800 degrees F and could accommodate a 50 inch sheet of titanium. We placed the oven next to a six-foot press brake and would heat the Ti sheet up to 750 F or more then put it in the press brake and make one bend, then repeat until done.  

The other challenge was making the buck as the drawings for the buck were different than the final car. Between the drawings and period photos we made the buck.
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#11 tonyp

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Posted 05 August 2017 - 03:20 PM

Side dams look much bigger than the slot versions.

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#12 Bob Lee

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Posted 05 August 2017 - 03:33 PM

Tony,

We did our best to duplicate the original body from the photos and plug drawings. I also purchased the original Mk II door molds and bucks that had survived all these years. We made sure the side fences matched the original Mk II door molds. 

Peter Bryant's Ti22 Mk I was the first Can-Am car to run side fences and later fences on the nose to force the air to stay on the body improving downforce. McLaren copied both innovations with the M8D.
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#13 Dave Crevie

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Posted 06 August 2017 - 02:10 PM

Bob;

 

No warping after cool-down of the formed parts? I did some forming of titanium for aerospace, specifically the flared

perimeters of the lightening holes. Pre-heating was the only way to prevent cracking at the edges, but once the part

had cooled, there was some stress remaining around the formed area that caused the sheet to take a small amount

of warp. We had to have a second tool to flatten the part after the forming operations.



#14 Samiam

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Posted 06 August 2017 - 06:22 PM

Tony,

We did our best to duplicate the original body from the photos and plug drawings. I also purchased the original Mk II door molds and bucks that had survived all these years. We made sure the side fences matched the original Mk II door molds. 

Peter Bryant's Ti22 Mk I was the first Can-Am car to run side fences and later fences on the nose to force the air to stay on the body improving downforce. McLaren copied both innovations with the M8D.

Bob,

 

What you and your crew have done here to recreate this Ti22 is just amazing. Will the car be on the east coast any time soon?

 

Did you know the Ti22 is the most popular body used in Retro Can-Am racing? You can see them race.at Buena Park Raceway. Looks like you are very close to them.


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#15 Bob Lee

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Posted 08 August 2017 - 11:49 AM

Bob;

 

No warping after cool-down of the formed parts? I did some forming of titanium for aerospace, specifically the flared

perimeters of the lightening holes. Pre-heating was the only way to prevent cracking at the edges, but once the part

had cooled, there was some stress remaining around the formed area that caused the sheet to take a small amount

of warp. We had to have a second tool to flatten the part after the forming operations.

Dave we did not have a significant warping problem as long as the whole Ti sheet was heated to 750 degrees F or greater.  We did have significant warping when one welder did not tack a doubler in place and spent too much time heating the part.  It may be possible to save the part if we over heat it and apply pressure.



#16 Bob Lee

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Posted 08 August 2017 - 11:54 AM

Bob,

 

What you and your crew have done here to recreate this Ti22 is just amazing. Will the car be on the east coast any time soon?

 

Did you know the Ti22 is the most popular body used in Retro Can-Am racing? You can see them race.at Buena Park Raceway. Looks like you are very close to them.

 

Thanks for the comment.  We may make a trip to Watkins Glen next year.  I had read that the Ti 22 was a very popular body shape in Retro Can-Am racing.  I even read a thread on a blog where some were trying to ban the shape.  Peter Bryant and his aerodynamic adviser spent some time getting the downforce shape optimized.  In Peter's book "Can-Am Challenger" he was convinced the SCCA was going to outlaw wings so he believed he would have an edge with an optimized body shape. 


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#17 Dave Crevie

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Posted 08 August 2017 - 01:53 PM

The Ti-22 was not always legal in retro. Someone must have heard me making a fuss that it wasn't, and it

got voted in. At the beginning, the Lola T-162 was the hot body. Before that we ran a Can-Am class at

Chicagoland with JK Millenium chassis and the Lotus 30/40 was the one to use. The fastest body will

always be the most popular.







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