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Braid wear


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#1 Wizard16

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 12:44 PM

At the Zimmerman my RetroPro car was pretty fast and handled well. Under the SCRRA rules we use a PS set-up with ceramics and a PS X-2 arm.

But during the race I had to change the same side braid twice due to it burning away. Is this a track type issue issue or a set-up issue? After each time I replaced the braid the speed came back.

There doesn't appear to have been uneven wear on the brushes from an external view but I haven't torn it down yet. I built the motor so perhaps I didn't do something I should have.
Diana Dyckman




#2 Racer36

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 02:04 PM

Not unusual to see the negative braid burned on 12s or up. Good idea to change it after every heat to be safe. Braid juice helps a wee bit but you will not prevent it.


Dennis Dominey

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#3 swodem

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 02:08 PM

Positive braid is the one that normally burns!? Too much is indicative of incorrect guide flag height I always thought...

#4 Racer36

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 03:25 PM

I haven't run any 12s in some time but I thought it was the negative braid that scorched. I may stand corrected.


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#5 Benno - SAC

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 03:39 PM

It is always the negative side on the northern hemisphere... but maybe down under... :D
 
Thicker braids like Parma Big Mama last longer than thinner ones.
 
I frazzle (hope this is the right word, had to Google it :) ) the braids a bit at their ends with a steel brush and  afterwards cut them to the desired length before mounting them.
 
PS: It doesn't have to do anything with your motor (assumed it was fast).

Schöne Grüße (Kind regards)

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#6 Wizard16

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 08:07 PM

Yes, the motor was fast. And thank you for pointing out the type of braid. I used way too soft - JK stiffer. I have Prime so I'll use that next time. Thanks.


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Diana Dyckman

#7 Ramcatlarry

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 11:41 PM

Fundamental electrophysics with DC current  - electrons flow - literally off of the braid and brush in the plasma arc in air.


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#8 old & gray

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 08:46 AM

Diana,

 

It has been a few years since I ran Group 12 wings but I do remember some braid burning issues. Things to consider:

  • Are the other racers (particularly the leaders) changing braids? If everyone is changing it’s probably the track conditions; if you’re the only one then it’s your car. Some people are just overly cautious and will change braid every heat; I saw one racer send his kids to pick up braid discarded by group racers to use in his weekly flexi cars.
  • Check the angle of the guide, not just front to rear but left to right. Friction is probably not wearing away the braid but arcing surely will be.
  • Find a type of braid which works for you and stick with it. Soft braid conforms better; stiffer braid doesn’t twist as badly in accidents.

Good luck and keep it in the slot.


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#9 MSwiss

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 09:20 AM

Yes,it's usually the negative (driver side in a US passenger car) braid, just as it's usually the positive brush that wears more, especially in higher amp-drawing motors.

While I agree, proper guide height will have a bearing on it, IMO, a lot of the problem is being over tired and/or not driving aggressive enough.

If you haven't been driving off the track, I suggest, if you are running brakes, dial some off, and turn your sensitivity up, for quicker response.

IOW, do whatever you have to do, to not "park" in the turns.

If that doesn't work, and you are convinced your car is over-tired, you can try a technique, I came up with, in the mid-'90s, for wing car qualifying.

With a sharp pair if scissors, nip a little rubber off of the inside of tires.

Make a cut, and then rotate your axle approx. 180 degrees, and make a matching cut.

I pulled out this technique at our big Hardbody race this past weekend, and the driver moved up from seventh to fourth in the A Main, realistically, about the best he could hope to finish.


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#10 gotboostedvr6

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 10:13 AM

Mike,

Can you post a pic of the tire cuts?
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#11 MSwiss

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 10:28 AM

I might be able to get at the exact car later, but it's just a nip, at about a 45 degree angle, to reduce the contact patch.

It's not as neat as narrowing them with an X-Acto on a power supply, but very quick, and less of a chance of having the X-Acto grabbing, and do something bad to the tires or your hands.

The most dramatic improvement I remember was in Semi-Pro qualifying, at the '95 Lugnut Nats.

Kevin Osmen couldn't make a complete lap.

After I snipped his tires, he got a Semi sit-out, when being a top eight qualifier,still gave you one.


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
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Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#12 gotboostedvr6

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 12:43 PM

I seem to remember a Retro East racer doing this after he realized the tracks bite had increased dramatically since qualifying.

Those who work for a living are being quickly overwhelmed by those who vote for a living.

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#13 Wizard16

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 02:38 PM

Mike, probably over tired. I was pushing it pretty hard.


Diana Dyckman

#14 swodem

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Posted 28 April 2017 - 02:46 AM

Sorry yes, it's negative that burns...my bad


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#15 Tim Wilkins

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Posted 29 April 2017 - 12:31 PM

Diana,

 

I think most of the field was running narrowed Alpha medium Wonder tires.  I had no braid issues.  In fact, they look almost brand new.  After 312 laps, it was the bent hub and axle that took me out of the race.


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