The biggest surprise to me (and Steve Koepp) was that the lead-on is not off-camber as it appears; it is slightly banked.
Tom Thumb Hobbies King track secrets revealed!
Started by
Mike Patterson
, Aug 24 2017 09:10 PM
12 replies to this topic
#1
Mike Patterson
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Posted 24 August 2017 - 09:10 PM
At the recent endurance race at Tom Thumb, I took my trusty angle finder with me, and measured the banking (or lack thereof) at every track joint, as well as in the approximate middle of each turn. The track drawing used is for a King-style track that I designed to fit in my basement. However, I have rearranged the track joints to correspond to Mike's King:
The biggest surprise to me (and Steve Koepp) was that the lead-on is not off-camber as it appears; it is slightly banked.
The biggest surprise to me (and Steve Koepp) was that the lead-on is not off-camber as it appears; it is slightly banked.
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I am not a doctor, but I played one as a child with the girl next door.
#2
NSwanberg
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 12:13 AM
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#3
MSwiss
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 12:42 AM
The biggest surprise to me (and Steve Koepp) was that the lead-on is not off-camber as it appears; it is slightly banked.
When I helped move, and reset-up, the original Koford factory track, and jacked up the previously flat deadman, my old boss Stu Koford pointed out there's a difference between being banked X amount of degrees, and being tipped or lifted, X amount of degrees.
IOW, if the surface isn't dished, or cupped, it's really not banked.
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Mike Swiss
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden Ave., Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 692 Citadel Drive, Westmont, Illinois 60559
#4
Racer36
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 06:47 AM
Good point, Mike.
I will take a few degrees of tipped over flat any day.
Dennis Dominey
#5
Brinkley47
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 08:08 AM
Great info, Mike. Has anyone ever done this to a Gerding? I am curious to see the difference.
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Will Brinkley
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willbrinkley@gmail.com
#6
Justin A. Porter
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 08:32 AM
I think it would be really fun for someone who was better at math than me to work out the grade per lane on a King as well. I'd imagine that combining the grades, radii, and banking reports would give us quite a picture of the work our little cars do lap after lap.
#7
MSwiss
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 09:09 AM
I will take a few degrees of tipped over flat any day.
Of course, a little tipping will make it easier.
I think the Tom Thumb deadman and lead-on are what makes it such a great Retro track.
With chassis design as the the focus in Retro, I like that there is a challenge.
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Mike Swiss
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden Ave., Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 692 Citadel Drive, Westmont, Illinois 60559
#8
JimF
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 10:40 AM
I think that point by Mike is why I like the King at Frank Sarkela's Slot Car Raceway. If I were to guess, I'd say that Frank's track is similar in the deadman, much flatter in the finger, more banked in the 90 and donut (definitely dished), and possibly dead flat in the lead-on. I believe it is our best track for Retro cars.
Jim Fowler
#9
Mike Patterson
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 10:47 AM
Mike Swiss is correct. The deadman and the lead-on at TT are both tipped, not banked. I apologize for any confusion this may have caused.
I am not a doctor, but I played one as a child with the girl next door.
#10
MSwiss
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 11:34 AM
Certainly no need to apologize.
I think it's awesome you're documenting the info on such an iconic track.
I think it's awesome you're documenting the info on such an iconic track.
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Mike Swiss
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden Ave., Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 692 Citadel Drive, Westmont, Illinois 60559
#11
MSwiss
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 08:15 PM
Great info, Mike. Has anyone ever done this to a Gerding? I am curious to see the difference.
They are all going to vary.
Gary might have the info.
If not, invest about $7.74 at Home Depot, and you can check any track you want.
Note; the one shown in the bottom pic is a special C/R, pinned angle locator. LOL.
Pitch and Angle Locator
Mike Swiss
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden Ave., Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 692 Citadel Drive, Westmont, Illinois 60559
#12
Half Fast
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 08:37 PM
Pinned yes, but was it boiled?
Cheers,
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Bill Botjer
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#13
Mike Patterson
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Posted 25 August 2017 - 09:58 PM
If not, invest about $7.74 at Home Depot, and you can check any track you want.
Mine came from Harbor Freight:
It's useful for other things, as well, besides measuring slot car tracks.
I plan to measure the turn radii sometime in the future, as soon as I figure out how.
I am not a doctor, but I played one as a child with the girl next door.
