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#1 havlicek

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 07:53 AM

     These things are used for all sorts of stuff, not just slot cars...and they can be had for a buck or two. 

IMG_3369.JPG

 

This one had a freakish wind using wire that measured slightly thicker than #27, undoubtedly a metric, and only 32 turns.  Maybe for some really fast car mirrors or something.  :D

IMG_3370.JPG

While the magnets are very strong, they're also long and there's no reason to go through all the pain of cutting them down when there are plenty around the right length.  With some cutting and nibbling, flattening and sanding (*all five sides), and finish milling to length...oh and a little paint and a couple of bearings, things are looking a lot more slot-car-motor-y.  Being actual "fk" size, the end bell needed a bit of turning-down to fit, so I dug out the fixture I made to do that.

Here's some recent holiday family photos taken just this past Christmas, when "Uncle Green" was over for dinner.

IMG_3372.JPG IMG_3373.JPG


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John Havlicek




#2 slotcarone

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 09:09 AM

John you do simply amazing work!! :)
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Mike Katz

Scratchbuilts forever!!


#3 Jairus

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 09:16 AM

Cool! :good:


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Jairus H Watson - Artist
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#4 havlicek

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 09:35 AM

Thanks guys.  I left out the axle-clearance notches here because the vast majority of these things will wind up going inline.  In any case, the fk can is narrow enough that it can easily go anglewinder as-is.  While "Uncle Green" goes to the spa for rehabilitation ;) , his nephew is ready for an armature of some sort!

*Interestingly enough, these magnets read stronger in this can with the two holes than they do in either the ProSlot or the JK cans.  I left the metal between the two holes wide and tried to position it directly in the center of the magnets' length...so *maybe* those are good things to do or something.  Maybe it's just because the one-piece can is more closed overall than the other two designs.  Beats me, but I've always like the one-piece designs for their lightweight and strong characteristics.


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John Havlicek

#5 havlicek

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 11:16 AM

Now, for the more mundane stuff.  It occurred to me that I may not have posted the arm-building part of all this stuff...at least certainly not recently.

***It all starts with some loose lams.

IMG_3374.JPG

***Then you pick a number of them away for how long the stack will be (*my go-to length for the minicans is around .350")

IMG_3375.JPG

***I then transfer those to an intermediate shaft that I've polished to a slight taper.  There, they can be aligned (*if necessary) and pushed towards the tighter end using finger pressure to keep them in alignment.

IMG_3377.JPG

***Then the loose lams and intermediate shaft can be inverted and placed on a small piece of tool (saw blade) steel I use for several different things.  That all gets stood on the arbor press where the temp shaft gets slightly pressed further onto the tapered shaft...just so the lams aren't jiggling around.  After that, the lams and intermediate shaft get flipped and the tapered shaft pressed-out, so the real shaft (*with a taper ground onto the end to make it easier to press it into the center hole of the lams) can be pressed-in to place.

IMG_3378.JPG

***Once I'm satisfied with the position of the stack and have straightened the lams if necessary, the future armature can be centered in the can's field by cutting tail and com spacers.  Since I do all this stuff one-arm-at-a-time, you'd think it would be a tedious thing, but I've gotten used to it.  I can pretty reliably cut the spacers just a bit long and then finish them to the correct length without much bother.

-The arm is ready for powder coating.

IMG_3380.JPG


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John Havlicek

#6 Geary Carrier

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 11:26 AM

Boy oh boy, makes you want to build motors from the ground up... :good:

 

Most Excellent way to end and start the year.


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Yes, to be sure, this is it...


#7 brucefl

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 11:59 AM

These things are used for all sorts of stuff, not just slot cars...and they can be had for a buck or two. 
attachicon.gifIMG_3369.JPG
 
This one had a freakish wind using wire that measured slightly thicker than #27, undoubtedly a metric, and only 32 turns.  Maybe for some really fast car mirrors or something.  :D
attachicon.gifIMG_3370.JPG
While the magnets are very strong, they're also long and there's no reason to go through all the pain of cutting them down when there are plenty around the right length.  With some cutting and nibbling, flattening and sanding (*all five sides), and finish milling to length...oh and a little paint and a couple of bearings, things are looking a lot more slot-car-motor-y.  Being actual "fk" size, the end bell needed a bit of turning-down to fit, so I dug out the fixture I made to do that.
Here's some recent holiday family photos taken just this past Christmas, when "Uncle Green" was over for dinner.
attachicon.gifIMG_3372.JPGattachicon.gifIMG_3373.JPG

you didn't just turn that Chinese silver thing into that work of art ,did you,if you did I'm changing your name to Houdini,cause you got the magic,jack, now start engraving your masterpieces with your artists signature,cause John when the future comes and they're digging up these relics,they will need to put them in right section of the museum.
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Bruce Schwartz

#8 Dave Crevie

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 12:57 PM

Don't know if you've tried this, and I am not sure that the "toothbrush" FK cans are the same size, but we found that the aluminum

end bell JK sells for the Hawk 6 will, with a small amount of filing, fit in a Falcon or Hawk 7 can. We cut a few cans to about 3/32nds 

longer than the magnets, and were able to finagle the aluminum end bell in. Not sure what we thought the advantage would be, but

we were curious. 

 

And yes, those motors were never intended for slot cars. They are supplied by the 'nese by voltage and RPM they are intended to

be used for. 



#9 Jaeger Team

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 01:54 PM

John, I had only imagined this part of arm-building. Thank you very much indeed for sharing !
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#10 havlicek

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 03:46 PM

 

Don't know if you've tried this, and I am not sure that the "toothbrush" FK cans are the same size, but we found that the aluminum

end bell JK sells for the Hawk 6 will, with a small amount of filing, fit in a Falcon or Hawk 7 can. 

 

Hi Dave.  I haven't done that myself, but since the plastic end bells will fit with a bit of trimming, of course the aluminum ones can fit.  If I were to do it now, I'd make a turning fixture for the job, as it would be more accurate and easier...after making the fixture that is.  :)

 

 

John, I had only imagined this part of arm-building. Thank you very much indeed for sharing !

Ciao Maurizio and *felice anno nuovo*.  Always a pleasure Maurizio.

Moving along...

The now pressed and spaced armature needs to get masked before powder coating, so the powder doesn't get on the shaft.  You can use teflon tubing, but that's wasteful, so I use teflon tape.  The stuff is good to over 400F, and sticks well as long as you clean off the shaft ends with alcohol to remove any slight oily residue.  I also put a wire hanger in there so the arm can go from the fluid bed to the oven rack

IMG_3381.JPG

The fluid bed is simply a container that can hold enough powder and has a means for air to flow up through the powder.  With the air flow (coming from a fish tank pump), the powder starts to act very much like a boiling liquid.  Perfect for coating a pre-heated (*around 400F) armature.

IMG_3382.JPG

After a quick "dip and twist", in to the E-Z Bake oven it goes for final fusing and curing.

IMG_3383.JPG

After 20 minutes or so, out it comes.

IMG_3384.JPG

Now, the powder comes off the outside of the stack so it will fit in my winding clamp, as well as so grinding the arm doesn't involve removing the powder.

IMG_3385.JPG

Now the com goes on there for real, and the timing is set.

IMG_3387.JPG

Ready for winding!

IMG_3388.JPG
 


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John Havlicek

#11 Geary Carrier

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 03:52 PM

Thank you one more time for all the groovy details...


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Yes, to be sure, this is it...


#12 nicky 65

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 06:01 PM

John I never knew there was so much involved with building a motor from scratch...…………...you are truly a magician.


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Nicholas Traina
 
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#13 brucefl

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 07:43 PM

That was fun getting to see your finer details,it make you feel like were all working along your side,Havlicek/Houdini magic man miracle worker,transforming relics into jewelry,that performs as good as it looks(not just a wall hanger).go John go John,soon ill have to ask you what your subscription price is,and id pay it and so would many,more projects for me to do once obligations lessen,after i learn how to carve castles on the tip of a pencil,as this guy does on you tube,really,its true,some people have too much time on their hands I guess,Happy new year John and everyone hereat and on slotblog.


Bruce Schwartz

#14 brucefl

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 07:45 PM

That was fun getting to see your finer details,it make you feel like were all working along your side,Havlicek/Houdini magic man miracle worker,transforming relics into jewelry,that performs as good as it looks(not just a wall hanger).go John go John,soon ill have to ask you what your subscription price is,and id pay it and so would many,more projects for me to do once obligations lessen,after i learn how to carve castles on the tip of a pencil,as this guy does on you tube,really,its true,some people have too much time on their hands I guess,Happy new year John and everyone hereat and on slotblog.

 

we re all your apprentices John,thanks Teach.

 


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Bruce Schwartz

#15 havlicek

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 08:09 PM

John I never knew there was so much involved with building a motor from scratch...…………...you are truly a magician.

 

 

Hi Nicky,

     No "magic" involved at all, and believe me when I tell you, I've left a lot of steps out here.  Still, all this is do-able by anyone with a few tools and a little spare space for a bench (*with GOOD lights!).  It's also not particularly efficient to do this stuff "one-at-a-time", and if I were doing this in a production situation, I'd of course have to be changing things.  Still, I'm able to invest a good amount of attention to each one this way, so I guess it's not such a bad thing being inefficient.  :)  

     Most importantly, the above is how I do it...not THE way to do it.  Everyone needs to come to their own best methods.


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#16 havlicek

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 08:33 AM

     With everything involved in building a motor and an armature done, it's now time to get busy with the fun part...winding.  I'm going with a pretty hot #28 wind here, a wind that's probably more like a eurosport wind than your typical minican wind.  This one will get 35 turns of #28awg, and along with the 18 degrees advance and such a relatively short stack, this motor will sing soprano.

Here it is after winding (*this one is a single piece of wire wind, with the first/last com tab pictured):

IMG_3390.JPG

After checking the arm on the meter, and for shorts, time to make the com connections (*welding/brazing with 1200F jeweler's silver).  When done and cleaned-up some, the joints should look nice and smooth, a lot like a solder joint.  Unlike solder, this material is good to temps way past whatever would have already vaporized the rest of the motor:

IMG_3392.JPG

After all the connections are done and cleaned-up enough to get a good reading on the meter, the arm gets checked again.  The arm meters perfectly, and it's way down there resistance-wise at .138 ohms.  Even so, these things will often drop a point or two after cutting the com...but I'm getting ahead of myself.

IMG_3394.JPG

With everything checking out, the com and wires get tied with some kevlar thread.  The stuff I have is a little thicker than necessary, so I cut it to length and then untwist it to get two pieces out of each length...setting aside the second piece for the next armature.  The arm is ready for high temperature/low viscosity epoxy.

IMG_3395.JPG


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John Havlicek

#17 slotcarone

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 09:00 AM

Every one is a Masterpiece John!!


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Mike Katz

Scratchbuilts forever!!


#18 havlicek

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 10:36 AM

THANKS Mike!

On to finishing.

First thing is to mix up a batch of Cotronics' "Duralco 4461"...imported directly from good ol' Brooklyn, New York.  :)

IMG_3396.JPG

After pre-warming the armature to make the already very thin-bodied 4461 even more so, so it can better penetrate tight coils, the arm gets coated and goes into the "EZ Bake Oven" for speed-curing.  When done, the coils and kevlar thread are fully potted and protected...AND...I've made sure that none of the epoxy cured in the com slots because that is mucho no bueno!  Then the com can get a cut to true it up and clean off any gunk left from everything done up to now.  Last, these motors are short, so extra shaft is cut from the com end of the arm.  All that shaft isn't going to do anything good for balancing.

IMG_3397.JPG

***On these end bells (seemingly a bit more so on the short tower ProSlot), I always do a little extra clearancing inside to make sure the com is clear of the hardware.

IMG_3400.JPG

After cleaning-up any burrs and metal dust from inside the end bell, the arm gets inserted in the setup and spun by hand to make sure nothing is hitting something it shouldn't be.

IMG_3399.JPG

Now the arm can go out for OD grinding and balancing.  If everything is as it seems, final assembly should be drama-free...BUT...nothing is anything until it's something.  The motor doesn't get a sticker until it's been spun-up for real.



 

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John Havlicek

#19 Geary Carrier

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 11:16 AM

Excellent stuff John... :good:


Yes, to be sure, this is it...


#20 brucefl

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 11:19 AM

A real Gem John,youre way too humble,but that's what makes everything so above the ordinary. There are way too many arogant surgeons in the world,so you're here to balance the scales.

 

I've gotta start a grass roots movement to create a subscription channel for guys like you John, to allow them and you to continue to grace the virtual pages of slotblog with youre G d given gifts of the art of your passion and ours.There's a list of others here too big to mention so ill leave that till later,but John concider yourself one of them,and like the departed Bob Emott,just a real nice guy.Amen.


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#21 olescratch

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 04:54 PM

  One more fine example of the willingness of the people here to share what they know with the rest.  Thanks!


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#22 havlicek

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 07:18 PM

     Sharing whatever I figured out has been a big priority for me in all this John.  Even for those who aren't interested in actually doing any of this themselves, I would think/hope it can at least give them a better appreciation for what goes into arms and motors.  It may not be rocket science, but there is some work, craft and learning involved.


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John Havlicek

#23 Jaeger Team

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Posted 31 December 2018 - 03:01 AM

THANKS Mike!

On to finishing.

First thing is to mix up a batch of Cotronics' "Duralco 4461"...imported directly from good ol' Brooklyn, New York.  :)

attachicon.gifIMG_3396.JPG
 

Seems to me you got the resin in the syringe and the hardener in the bottle. Am I right?  I purchased, from a distributor in Italy, a EE4461 10 Gms single dose (price like gold !), the resin is in a little jar and the hardener is in the syringe.  


Maurizio Salerno

#24 havlicek

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Posted 31 December 2018 - 06:03 AM

 

 

Seems to me you got the resin in the syringe and the hardener in the bottle. Am I right?  I purchased, from a distributor in Italy, a EE4461 10 Gms single dose (price like gold !), the resin is in a little jar and the hardener is in the syringe.  

 

Ciao Maurizio.  Yes, I keep the main containers of resin and hardener in a cool dark place, and fill the syringe with resin and the bottle with the hardener.  This makes dispensing the right proportions much easier, and keeps the bulk of the materials from ageing too fast.  I also keep my epoxy powders in a little refrigerator, only bringing them out when I need them.


John Havlicek

#25 Jaeger Team

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Posted 31 December 2018 - 07:02 AM

:good:


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