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Will it make a difference?


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#1 SlowBeas

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 03:27 PM

I'm mapping out my next build -- another tuning fork. I've always soldered the fork at the motor bracket and allowed the other ends to float in tubing that's attached up front.

 

I'm wondering what difference it would make if I solder the front-ends of the fork while having them float in tubing attached to the motor bracket. How would that affect the chassis' response -- if at all? Would doing so eliminate some of the positives of using the tuning fork setup?


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#2 Jay Guard

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 08:12 PM

Hey Jim:

It's a great question but one that's a bit difficult to answer for certain.  For one thing it would depend on the the length/position of the "pivot" tubes at the rear.  Differing their lengths or positions would change the flex point of the tuning fork, not to mention the tuning fork would now have a different "flex" geometry since it is now soldered solid at the front.  I would say that it would make a difference, but exactly what I think only experimentation will tell for sure.  It might also depend on whether you are on a high speed or low speed track.


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#3 MSwiss

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 08:20 PM

No book exists in slot racing, on definitive chassis theory.
 
You have to try it to find out.
 
Your idea is one of the many things, I would try, if I was racer, instead of a raceway owner, who has a landlord who likes to get her rent on time.
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#4 tonyp

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 08:31 AM

Everyone has their own theories. Real world tech usually doesn’t apply to slot cars. The best thing to do is try out ideas and if they work for you keep them in your list of what works. Don’t try to figure out why you will drive yourself crazy. As long as you know soldering this to that makes the car work better you are ahead of the game.


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#5 bbr

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 10:32 AM

One thing I have experienced is that different racers like their cars a certain way. So if you can adjust/tune your chassis to maximize what you do best and minimize what you do badly you be way ahead of the game
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#6 Eddie Fleming

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 12:09 PM

Jim the layout you are talking about seems to me to be similar to the Dominator Jackal Pro layout that is currently enjoying success.

 

Not the same but sharing some points. It is well worth a try.

 

Let us know how it works out.


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#7 Ramcatlarry

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 12:28 PM

I agree with Eddie,  I have used a similar combination and 'feel' it allows a secondary spring rate on hard load corners when the car leans over more.

 

Not that I have beat anyone lately....


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#8 SlowBeas

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 01:09 PM

This project could be fun -- and the results could be interesting. Looks like I've got a task ahead of me.

 

If only I could document my work as well as Jim Fowler...


Jim Beasley
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#9 Don Weaver

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 02:09 PM

Jim Fowler does a great job of documenting what, why and how changes work out on the track with his builds as does Rick Moore (CMF3) on his one-off builds.

 

Don


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#10 crazyphysicsteacher

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 05:13 AM

You will have a different feel. The running fork chassis with the fronts loose gives you the flexi for the side bit you want while allowing for the stiffness you need to get off the corner. Having the rear loose moves that flex point to the rear. Built one this way but I used a brass main rail and I think it is holding up the motion. The car tracks into and in the corner like a scale car but is just a tad loose out of the corner. It allowed a very light car to run like a heavier car.

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#11 Greg VanPeenen

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 08:05 PM

Jim, 

 

You can try it if you like. But it will make the chassis very unpredictable. It is something that I tried years ago. I even tried letting the entire fork float front and rear. I ended soldering them all solid at the rear and didn't tell anybody. On very fast king tracks sometimes soldering the front solid also can help as it will stiffen the chassis a bit, but it will not help much.

 

Regards,

Greg VanPeenen   


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#12 CDavis7

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 09:19 PM

GVP- I was hoping youd add your experience.

For something completely different, build it like a jackal pro and now you have a true twisting movement instead of relying on 2 legs.

The chassis behavior is very different.
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#13 Greg VanPeenen

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Posted 22 February 2019 - 12:45 PM

Chris,

 

I have 3 Jackal Pro kits I am going to build one my way and one his way and test . The original Razzo chassis were built like Dom does the Jackal when I changed them to a true tuning fork they worked much better. Ricky B holds the overall lap record of 305 laps for Can-Am for the R4 with one.

 

I really like they way Doms chassis parts are made. Two thumbs up on that.

 

By the way. The tuning fork is not there to control twist. It is there to help keep a twisty chassis from bending downward in high g situations like hitting banked turns. It stiffens the up and down movement. That is why it floats at the front. If you also build one that twist too much and feel the need to stiffen the twist you can solder the front of the tuning fork solid. That will stiffen it a bit.     

 

 

Regards,

GVP 


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#14 CDavis7

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Posted 22 February 2019 - 06:19 PM

Greg-

I look forward to hearing/reading how your j-pros turn out.

I realize the role of the tuning fork to limit longitudinal flex. What meant with Doms technique is that the center wire is being twisted so one could conceivably have different diameter wire for different spring rates

Cant wait to see how yours turn out and I too like Doms milled pieces. I think they are stronger and less likely to introduce harmonics in the pans.
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