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Zapping radial magnets?


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#1 mreibman

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 03:02 PM

A recent discussion came up about putting radial magnets into a magnet zapper.

For the sake of argument, the zapper was a MagBlaster (not sure which model).

 

If you put radially oriented magnets into a zapper and zap them, will it work, or will it re-orient the magnets to a state that they're no longer radially oriented?

 

I am just not clear on this, and I would like to be, so experts on the subject, please chime in.

 

thanks

 


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#2 MSwiss

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 03:11 PM

What type of radial magnets?


Mike Swiss
 
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
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#3 mreibman

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 04:07 PM

What type of radial magnets?

 

For the sake of argument, Koford M606/M607 ceramic magnets for C-cans.


Mike Reibman
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#4 Jesse Gonzales

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 05:12 PM

I'm no expert but I have read up on magnetic materials quite a bit and it would appear that the orientation is set while the magnet is in a "wet" state. meaning that while the magnet is being exposed to the magnetizing force there is alignment taking place before the arc "cures or hardens" the magnetic charge will have to be radial to produce a radially charged arc.

 

Jess Gonzales



#5 gotboostedvr6

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 06:17 PM

Just zap em.
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David Parrotta

#6 philk

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 09:08 PM

Let me repost an email from Stu Koford.

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Phil Kreuter

#7 philk

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 09:15 PM

For the sake of argument, Koford M606/M607 ceramic magnets for C-cans.


The Koford catalog makes no mention of these magnets being “radial” . Only the cobalt version is advertised as that.
Phil Kreuter

#8 MSwiss

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 09:40 PM

Like Phil said, it doesn't appear the M607 is radially oriented.

 

See below cut-n-paste from their catalog.

 

Jesse explained the radially oriented magnet manufacturing process pretty well, in his post.

 

It was a long time ago, but as it was described to me, the magnetic strands go into the form, partially zapped, so they orient themselves correctly.

 

I'm guessing there is some sort of inner slug that they attract to, so the strands stay where they need to be, as the magnet material cures.

 

Other than those bonded neo mags, it doesn't matter how hard you hit a magnet, with the zapper, they have an orientation that will only take a charge one way.

 

What a radially oriented mag will do, if not zapped with a round slug, to "radiate", the charge, will get weaker instead of stronger.

 

From my experience, the hardest mags to charge properly was a radial oriented C can mag, like a Mura.

 

The only thing harder for me, was a cheap D can mag, which I'm 98% sure, was also radially oriented.

 

And if you hit them with too hard of a charge, they will also get weaker, even with a slug inside of them.

 

A straight oriented cobalt mag, while 500-550V is approx. what was needed for saturation, to full strength, could be also be hit with 700 volts, and it would still be fine, AKA fully saturated.

 

With a C can Mura setup, optimum charge was 150V.
 

If you hit it with 200V, the mags would gauss lower, and you had to hit it again, at the 150 setting.

 

Max charge, with something like a Deathstar, was only about 75V.

 

CERAMIC MAGNETSM607 Matched .450 long x .155 thick C can magnets with new (stronger) orientation. Especially recommended for H12 and OMB wing car racing with the M528 or M727 cans. The choice of top racers everywhere. $13.50 pr.M604 Matched .500 long x .150 thick C can magnets with new (stronger) orientation. $13.50 pr.M605 Matched .450 long x .150 thick C can magnets with original orientation. These magnets are recommended for scale racing. $13.50 pr.M606 Matched 450 long x .150 thick C can magnets with new (stronger) orientation. $13.50 pr.M529 Matched 450 long x .155 thick C can magnets with original orientation. $13.50 pr.M456 Matched .500 long x .150 thick C can magnets with original orientation. These magnets are recommended for scale cars especially with 8t 64p or 9t 72p pinions. $13.50 pr.M592 Ultrastrong radial drag magnets, when used with M593 treated can produces 4% more flux then compet-itors wide can and .170 thick quad magnets without the problems of nonstandard size cans. .165 thick x .520 long $29.95 pr.NEW! M701 480 tall x 470 long x .167 thick high gauss radially oriented G15 magnets. Radial orientation pro-duces a radial field like a 10 mag motor but the magnets are one piece for maximum durability and ease of instal-lation. $35.00 pr. M600 Improved 480 tall x 450 long x .167 thick high gauss radially oriented G15 magnets. Radial orientation produces a radial field like a multi magnet motor but the magnets are one piece for maximum durability and ease of installation. $35.00 pr.


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Mike Swiss
 
Inventor of the Low CG guide flag 4/20/18
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder

17B West Ogden Ave., Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)

Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516


#9 gotboostedvr6

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 10:48 PM

You need about 3 times more power to zap poly neo magnets vs ceramic.

When you zap poly neo in a ceramic machine you only succeed in lowering gauss. This can sometimes be a desired result.
David Parrotta





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