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What has happened to Parma Retro bodies?


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#1 usadar

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 01:04 AM

Both of the major distributors, ERI and Eagle, havent had such popular Parma retro bodies as Ti22 Narrow Nose(regular and short) and M7C F-1 in stock.
Their Big Mama Braids have been unavailable for long, too.
What has happened to Parma?

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#2 Michael Jr.

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 06:09 AM

Here is the executive summary as told to me after I asked the same queston awhile back.

Parma has changed hands, passed on to family who do not wish to continue. The stock is being sold off the shelves and another commentary was that as soon as they run out of materials to make bodies Parma will be no more. So the out of stock items will remain out of stock. The reason they are still listed is that Parma hasn't publicly announced they are finished as far as I can tell. So everything I just said is a combination of folks closer to the source talking, observation, and speculation,  


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#3 MG Brown

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 07:51 AM

I would strongly suggest trying Mid-America Products braid. I am getting samples in of the new Betta Ti-22 which looks like it might bea good alternative to the Parma square nose Ti-22.
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#4 Racer36

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 08:26 AM

I would strongly suggest trying Mid-America Products braid. I am getting samples in of the new Betta Ti-22 which looks like it might bea good alternative to the Parma square nose Ti-22.

While the new Betta Ti is an awesome looking body, it’s not an IRRA approved body and from what I read the other day it is unlikely to get approval. 


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#5 Eddie Fleming

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 08:30 AM

The Betta looks good.

 

The IRRA should address the body issue if the Parma supply is going away. So far I have been able to get a Parma body any time I wanted one. Possibly not from everyone but always available. 


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#6 Michael Jr.

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 08:38 AM

The Betta looks good.

 

The IRRA should address the body issue if the Parma supply is going away. So far I have been able to get a Parma body any time I wanted one. Possibly not from everyone but always available. 

 

Seems to me, all you need to do is hand an approved Parma body to one of the many guys making bodies now and they can continue that body in production. If I were one of those guys, I would have a mint condition selection of no less than 5 of each of the Parma bodies that I could use for mold making as Parma slips away. But, I'm not a body making guy.


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#7 Eddie Fleming

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 08:56 AM

If it is a re-pop of a Parma is that legal according to the IRRA? 

 

It could be hard to tell but by the book would it be legal?


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#8 YetiSRP

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 08:58 AM

Any advance word on what will happen to all the things that made Parma what it is (was)?

 

They have a vacuum former and about a gazillion molds just setting in a warehouse from what little I know. There's someone's business right there.

 

Will there be an auction to sell off stuff? Can you imagine what that would be like selling off all the molds in all the sizes? I'd be there just to see all that. 


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#9 Danny Zona

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 10:28 AM

The Betta looks good.
 
The IRRA should address the body issue if the Parma supply is going away. So far I have been able to get a Parma body any time I wanted one. Possibly not from everyone but always available. 

I'm stocked myself but a few racers and one of them being a track owner can't get a hold of the T-163 Lola.
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#10 Shiggy

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Posted 20 July 2020 - 09:07 PM

Any advance word on what will happen to all the things that made Parma what it is (was)?
 
They have a vacuum former and about a gazillion molds just setting in a warehouse from what little I know. There's someone's business right there.
 
Will there be an auction to sell off stuff? Can you imagine what that would be like selling off all the molds in all the sizes? I'd be there just to see all that.


I hope someone is able to acquire the molds and continue producing them
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#11 mppicione

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Posted 21 July 2020 - 08:37 AM

I am sorry to hear this. I hope that someone takes over the business and continues to make Parma products.


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#12 stemmy

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Posted 21 July 2020 - 12:32 PM

Has anyone tried the red fox or oleg bodies yet? How do they compare to performance wise to the parma bodies.
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#13 Noose

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Posted 21 July 2020 - 01:20 PM

Has anyone tried the red fox or oleg bodies yet? How do they compare to performance wise to the parma bodies.

The Chevron and Lola GT by RF are good and times were the same to the Parma Lola in testing by me on the Port Jeff King.

 

The RF M9 F1 body is ok and competitive with the Parma M7.

 

Have not tested the OLEG Lotus or BRM yet.


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#14 stemmy

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Posted 21 July 2020 - 01:25 PM

Thank you.
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#15 MG Brown

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 11:34 AM

Submitting bodies to the IRRA in my opinion is cost prohibitive for a small importer or manufacturer. Submitting 6 examples to 6 individuals with no assurance that they will be approved... perhaps some businesses can write that off but some certainly cannot.

“A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.” - Douglas Adams


#16 jimht

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 11:52 AM

Approval of products that wind up being unavailable to all the racers that want them has been a problem forever.

 

At least the IRRA is somewhat proactive in this...If they can't be provided for inspection then it's likely that they would be unable to produce enough bodies to meet the demands of the racers


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#17 Half Fast

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 12:33 PM

I have heard that there is a severe shortage of Lexan suitable for molding bodies. This is because the Lexan is being used to make face shields for the Covid crisis.

 

This affects all US manufacturers including O/S.

 

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#18 Racer36

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 01:36 PM

Submitting bodies to the IRRA in my opinion is cost prohibitive for a small importer or manufacturer. Submitting 6 examples to 6 individuals with no assurance that they will be approved... perhaps some businesses can write that off but some certainly cannot.

I would suggest that if 6 bodies, at a cost of about 12 bucks, and postage is an issue then the manufacturer has a lot bigger problems.


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#19 Dave Crevie

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 01:50 PM

The face shields for virus protection don't have to be Lexan. There is no need for impact protection, which is what Lexan was developed for. Personnally, I would use Optix for face shields. Also, when I was working for Vulcan Industries, we made hospital cabinetry that used a special clear plastic developed by Baxter-Travenal which had anti-bacterial properties. That would be the ideal material for face shields. So if there is a shortage of Lexan, it is a manufactured shortage, i.e., caused by using the wrong material for the application. 


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#20 tonyp

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 02:34 PM

Parma I believe has just opened again after COVID shut down.

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#21 old & gray

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 02:58 PM

Submitting bodies to the IRRA in my opinion is cost prohibitive for a small importer or manufacturer. Submitting 6 examples to 6 individuals with no assurance that they will be approved... perhaps some businesses can write that off but some certainly cannot.

 

 

I would suggest that if 6 bodies, at a cost of about 12 bucks, and postage is an issue then the manufacturer has a lot bigger problems.

 

IF the cost for entry into this business were 12 dollars plus postage, I’d set up a corner of my basement as a “cottage industry” shop and have a go. However assuming you already have the vacuum forming equipment (and I knew an industrial arts teacher who was having students pull bodies as part of his class); consider the costs and risks for this endeavor.
 
The IRRA® does not have a published spec for bodies (so wide, this high, that long) but approves them on a “similar to current performance” standard. While this prevents the “body of the week” syndrome, it is not conducive to allowing new manufactures to “elbow in”, and make a spot for themselves. 
 
The cost in time and money at the start of this process is the master on which the bodies are pulled. It is my understanding that some bodies have gone through multiple iterations to reach approval. In order to have an approved body you would need to have an "approved" master to pull from, not a "glue a bit on, file a bit off" prototype.
 
3D printing and CAD may be reducing these costs  In my work I have had occasion to use a “blue light” scanning system which produced a CAD model directly from an object, which would be the ultimate back pour. However the cost of that system was carried on the monthly shipment of jet engines for aircraft.
 
I would agree trying to break into the market is a high cost, high risk, low return endeavor.
 
I think that the current rules system stifles innovation and leads to fields of identical bodies; however I am in agreement with the goal of restricting the increase of speed for speed’s sake and the reduced obsolescence of parts.

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#22 John Streisguth

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 03:09 PM

It didn't stop VFC, which is a very small outfit, from submitting a body which has become the "go to" stock car body.  

 

"Innovation" is what leads to obsolescence.

 

Since the beginning of "PRO" racing, there has always been that "one" body that 99% of people run.  It's just the way it is...


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#23 tonyp

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 05:46 PM

One body always rises to the top.


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"And if my thought-dreams could be seen they'd probably put my head in a guillotine. But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only." - Dylan

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#24 Phil Hackett

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 09:55 PM

One body always rises to the top.


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Unless a racer is a rogue thinker this statement is true.


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#25 MSwiss

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Posted 22 July 2020 - 10:03 PM

I bet at Retropalooza, you will see 2, and maybe 3 different Can Am bodies, in A Main.

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