37 replies to this topic

[philhoward]

I would like to know when these were originally sold in Northern California. I had one as a child but do not remember exactly when I got it, thinking around 1965/66. I sold my set in the late eighties, but just purchased another one on eBay.

I would like to know all I can about this set (History/How to preserve/simple mods/etc). I am really excited to get this set up and start racing again!

Any help/direction would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Phil

[TSR]

Phil, welcome. Strombecker sets were sold from 1959 to 1972 in US, Canada, and built in Mexico, France, Spain under license in the same time.
The set you have was sold in 1965-66 and should have the later and better track with the steel rails. The earlier sets had self-sticking aluminized foil rails and were junk. The cars in your set could be anything from a Porsche RS/Lotus 19 combination with plastic chassis to later models with 2-piece aluminum chassis, all using the same Pittman-lookalike motor.
In any case, the cars may still run but the tires will be junk and are not replaceable because no one makes any to fit the rims. Hence if you wish to run these cars, you will need to change the entire rear axle and spend money to purchase wheels, tires and a new crown gear.
Frankly you would be better off parking the old cars on the display shelf and acquire new cars such as THESE that will work perfectly fine on your track.

[philhoward]

Hi Phil,
Thanks for the response. My original set had a Dino and I believe a Cheetah, both with the brass chassis.I was assuming this set would too. I will consider getting newer cars, especially for drinking beers and racing! I will report back when I recieve the set and let you know what cars are included.

Phil

[TSR]

Cool! Keep us posted.

[slotcrue]

Phil,

This version of the set was only sold in 1966, although leftover ones could have obviously been sold later on. The version of this set that was released in 1967 included 2 Monza wall sets and a Chaparral and Mckee. The list price was $100, quite a bit for 1966 I imagine. It was Strombecker's biggest set that they ever sold, and they don't show up all that often. I saw the auction and it looks to be in good shape, interesting though that the seller didn't show a picture of the cars. They would have probably gotten more for it. I hope it works well for you.

Regards,
Garrett

[don.siegel]

Phil,

I do believe the brass chassis cars were only sold aftermarket - all the Strombecker sets had either the earlier plastic chassis cars, or the later ones with the cheapo aluminum chassis.

I also think there are various repro tires around for these wheels (with the raised central rim?), look at ebay, and the cars can be made to run decently. But Philippe is probably right that any new cars would be a lot easier to race!

That was really a top of the line set! 65 ft and $100, holy cow!

Don

[Pechuga_VLC]

to Phil:

sets are not always wearing the same car, so TSR really has not erred in its response.

If as you say and include Cheetah Dino with brass frame, then we go to the year 1966-67, as Garret says.

[Pechuga_VLC]

to Philippe :

forgive me repeat that, but as I said, according to my research the first factory sets Strombecker was the Strombeck-Becker in Moline, which manufactures slot since 1959, or 1960 if we are talking about 1:32.

Somewhat later (in 1961) to be absorbed by Tootsie Toys, the brothers Dowst manufacturing moves to a much larger factory in Chicago.

In 1963 he also maintains an office in Canada and one in Paris, they serve as a gateway to export out of USA.

In 1964 the brothers Dowst reorganize its business and establishing a Strombecker Corporation.

The tactic of Strombecker president is to sign contracts to 50% partner with other companies from other countries to manufacture Strombecker in this way in 1966-70's and are manufactured in Strombecker Rumilly - France (Mont Blanc) and 1967-1970 in Ibi - Spain (Paya Brothers).

By 1968 Strombecker make stops in the U.S., said in addition to France and Spain all the material is made out of plastic components mainly come from Hong Kong, usually the metal components come from Japan (not all but most of the engines always come from Japan). The seat goes to Montreal, Canada, where he is almost certainly secure the assembly and packaging.

Indeed Phillipe: I have contacted the Spanish person who signed the contract personally with the president of Strombecker in USA.

Is a old man but in good health with a memory ... you could even it up to the mark of the cigar is smoked As president she visited Spain in 1968 with his family in order to collect royalties from Strombecker ... if you have any questions you can ask anything you want, then I speak with this person.


Respect the 2 Lionel, 3 Estrela and 5 mexicans ... theu are copys that not used any license Strombecker.

It is true that I do not have the 3 Estrella by hand ... but yes the others ... and clearly ... no doubt, come from another mold, and do not use any form of the word Strombecker, it is clear that they could never leave.

Maybe someone says that they are not mirror Lionel 2 ... advancement and I wonder ... because being played by Lionel had the same defects that Strombecker? ... (Obviously because when Lionel made the Ferrari Testa Rossa and the Jaguar D was not fixed in 1:1 but 1:32 of the Strombecker).

PS: I have ample material for what I mean, if someone wants to scan photo or can order it by private message or post here.

[Pechuga_VLC]

to Don :

you are right ... if the cars come from that circuit, then the chassis are either metallic or plastic, or mixed, but not brass.

Brass chassis exclusively from the motorkits.

[slotcrue]

Don and Jose,

This set did come with the brass chassis's. The cars that were included were in competition kit form with the brightly colored boxes. They had the same box covers as the ones you could buy separately. They just stuck the kits in there as it probably wasn't worth making new packaging. As this was the top of the line set, it did include the better cars. This is the only set that I have ever seen that had the 3 post brass chassis's in it. I have a picture of a near new set but I don't have access to it at this point. I'll try to get the info from the store catalog up later this week.

Garrett

[don.siegel]

Thanks for that info Garrett - I definitely didn't know about that one!

I did kind of wonder about the boxtop art, which looked different from what I remembered, but I thought it was just a slightly later release. Guess it was a whole different animal!

So, yes, pictures would be very welcome.

Funny too, this brings Strombecker full circle back to their original 1/24 sets (in 1959 I believe), when they just included a couple boxes with the 1/24 cars - haven't seen one of these sets first hand either, just heard about them (and won one on ebay, but the guy never sent it!) - so if anybody has any pictures of these...

Don

[TSR]

This set did come with the brass chassis.

That's correct and I am going through the catalogs right now. There were TWO kinds of racing sets that came with brass chassis, the first with the single-magnet motors (# 9091), the later with the 2-piece brass pan and TC32 motors. Last of course was the Indy set with the Lotus 38 and Hawk with the aluminum chassis and TC32 motors.

Somewhat later (in 1961) to be absorbed by Tootsie Toys, the brothers Dowst manufacturing moves to a much larger factory in Chicago.

Actually it was sometimes in early1960, when the Shure brothers, now owners of the Dowst Manufacturing Co on North Pulaski Road in Chicago, incidentally the Tootsietoy brand owner since it was founded in the 1880's, acquired the assets of Strombeck-Becker company. I got paperwork on this, a newspaper ad dated May 1960, showing the Strombecker racing set (Jag & Testa Rossa) as the "first in American Road racing" (obviously competing with Gilbert and others...) The ad says that Strombecker introduced their sets in 1959 and claimed to be the first to do so in the USA which is not correct but never mind. The set, # 9940, sold then for $29.95, quite an expensive proposition then.
The book chapter is getting longer every minute...

[Pechuga_VLC]

to Garrett :

Wow, I was not aware of it, being well we should all be more attentive to these circuits include high line cars.

[Pechuga_VLC]

Thanks for that info Garrett - I definitely didn't know about that one!

I did kind of wonder about the boxtop art, which looked different from what I remembered, but I thought it was just a slightly later release. Guess it was a whole different animal!

So, yes, pictures would be very welcome.

Funny too, this brings Strombecker full circle back to their original 1/24 sets (in 1959 I believe), when they just included a couple boxes with the 1/24 cars - haven't seen one of these sets first hand either, just heard about them (and won one on ebay, but the guy never sent it!) - so if anybody has any pictures of these...

Don

The first material slot car by Strombeck-Becker of Moline (USA) dates from 1959 and it is "H references.

for example H1, H2, H3 H4 ...

The first 3 circuits include motorkits Car 1:24 more static motor and guides, depending on the circuit and the transformer etc.

For anyone who wants to can send their mail to the triptych - 1959 catalog scan, and if they can hang in the post.

I note that there is no date on the leaflet - catalog, but I have been consulting all sorts of magazines, catalogs and other advertisements and I have concluded that 1959 is the date.

Unfortunately I have no photos of these circuits, since I am a collector of 1:32 and I do not usually capture such information.But if I have caught the Internet photos of all models and nearly all the boxes of 1:24 cars.

The odd thing is that in fact these were not conceived as a 1:24 slot since its inception ... if it were to this effect the following year (1960), the Maserati 250F red and white both Jaguar D at 1:32 engined 6V red form motorkit, bodykit (no motor and I believe that without a guide) circuit and, somewhat later, in October 1960 appeared the second circuit called 312, with Jag D 2 (red and white) with a 3.5 V motor Kako low benefits, not when I assume that appeared shortly after the 313 with 4 Jag D (2 reds, 2 whites).

To whoever can pass pictures of almost everything (I think everything except the bit circuit 313 and more).

If you want I can also make a list of references ...

[Pechuga_VLC]

You are quite right ... was not the first ... first to do so if the mass in USA, but not the first.

I do not doubt your word, but your date does not fit me ... sure that it is May 61 and not May 60? .


If you mail me your pass I can scanned the brochure catalog 1959 where are all the first "H references, from H1 to H18.

H1, H2, H3 circuits are the first 1:24, the first car-free and without a transformer, the second with 1:24 cars and Mercedes Benz F.1 but Jag D processor, the third reference to the same circuit with transformer).


You can also pass scan of the brochure catalog 1960 with the first circuitry 1:32 ... H30 and H31 (are the same circuit, both with and Maserati 250F Jag D 6V but two of the second circuit with transformer).


But later in the year 1960, due to the high price of the circuits, 312 circuits are created with low D 2 Jag benefits ... I have the flyer and notice of such a circuit in October 1960. Subsequently, the 313 (but not exactly when).

In May of 1961 when I start to see the first circuit in my opinion Ferrari Testa Rossa third car, although I can not find in my bibliography circuit USA 9940, but yes the 9950.

(Apparently, with the sale of the Tootsie ... exactly is signed March 17, 1961 ... a change from the reference point - 2 digits or 3 digits for the case of economic cycles, a 4 references digits)

I can spend a lot of information by letter, photos or scans, but not always mine.

[TSR]

sure that it is May 61 and not May 60? .

This is the date on the magazine...

[Pechuga_VLC]

ummmm, this is really very strange !

This publication is for me a great surprise, though I do not detect data material I do think that the car hit the market in 1960, but what I have dated in mid-1961, perhaps in late spring or early summer.

It is my opinion, but I believe that the advance publication is not something that finally hit the market until a year later, at such times and in the hands of Dowst.

I say this because all the information in catalogs, etc. I have, the reference numbers of Ferrari TR no suggests that it is the 3rd car in a 1:32 slot car and did not arrive until 1961.

I´ve scanned the catalog of 1960 ... and is not still Ferrrari TR.

Curiosity Ferrari TR is prepared to take the motor Kako 3.5 V, but the truth is that it not arrived at the factory ride, but started riding the long axis of 15R Mabuchi.

[TSR]

Hi Jose,
Every day, I find something new and different from what I THOUGHT were the facts sealed in concrete. In the past 3 years, I have already added something like 10 pages of info on the original Strombecker chapter, trying to decipher the unbelievable array of products issued from 1959 to 1972 when it appears that it was the end of the road. I have a kit and RTR listing that now covers 54 pages, I am going to have to cut somewhere... When I THINK that the LASCM has everything ever produced, we run into something else we did not know. We of course only collect the American and Canadian versions of the cars, voluntarily ignoring Euro production since it is not the focus of the museum.

And you know what? It is so complicated and so full of turnouts in every which way that I have decided that only about 12 people on the whole planet really care, and I need to sell 20000 books. So back to generalities before the book puts the readers asleep, an analysis of the product and as little as possible about the racing sets because the collectors don't give a rat's a$ about those, they only want the kits, RTR cars, rare parts, historical tidbits for our modern 2-minute attention span and that's it.
Much more interesting to the readers are detailed pictures of the rare kits that hardly ever come onto the market, of the unique 1/24 scale McKee Can-Am that was never issued other than in the smaller scale. Also only 10% of the books buyers actually READ the text...

All I can say is that indeed, the set shown in the first post, the European Rally, stock # 9810, was issued in 1965 with the earlier-style brass-chassis cars (Lotus 19 & Porsche RS60 were the cars according to my catalogs, but the gentleman tells us about a Dino and Cheetah, so here we go again...), and in 1966 (with a different box top) that changed to brass-pan chassis with TC32 motors, the Chaparral 2 "American Roadster" (Strombecker no longer paying licensing fees to Chaparral) and the McKee Can-Am. Both had 65' of track that included TWO "Monza walls" banking. Price was a cool $100.00, a small fortune in 1965-66.

[slotcrue]

All I can say is that indeed, the set shown in the first post, the European Rally, stock # 9810, was issued in 1965 with the earlier-style brass-chassis cars (Lotus 19 & Porsche RS60 were the cars according to my catalogs, but the gentleman tells us about a Dino and Cheetah, so here we go again...), and in 1966 (with a different box top) that changed to brass-pan chassis with TC32 motors, the Chaparral 2 "American Roadster" (Strombecker no longer paying licensing fees to Chaparral) and the McKee Can-Am. Both had 65' of track that included TWO "Monza walls" banking.

Philippe,

Are you sure that this set was released in 1965? From looking in the catalogs, set #9810 was released in 1967. Was there a set in 1965 with the same number, but I've never seen such a large set from that year. Heres the 1966 info from the catalog.





Here's the info from 1967.





As you can see, the 1966 version is set #9896 and the 1967 version is #9810. They are quite different in layout and only the 1967 version had the Monza walls, as they came out that year. The 1967 version actually includes more track. I should note that the 1966 version wasn't listed in the Canadian Strombecker catalog. In Canada they had a set called the British American Road Racing set, which was of a similar size and is pictured below. It only has a 55 foot circuit and includes the Cheetah and Dino Ferrari. While I don't own this set, I assume it includes the competition cars as well. The picture is from ebay from 2003, is it alright to post it on here?



At any rate, there are so many set variations that it is hard to know of them all. I never knew about the 1/24 McKee. Was it just a factory prototype? I hope the picture will be in the upcoming book.

Garrett

[TSR]

Hi Garrett,
The Strombecker catalogs often announced products that already had been on the market several months before so there is a definite crossover of printed matter VS product. And it is hard to figure out if the chicken or the egg came first.
The first such set (Euro Rally) with the Lotus and Porsche came in 1964 and I do not have a stock number for it but I know it exists because I sold one years ago when I owned Electric Dreams. The cars had a plastic chassis and the single-pole motor. It is not impossible that the same set later came with the two-piece aluminum chassis and the same motor... but I have not seen an actual set.
The 1965 set is apparently the one you have and had a 1964 Dino and a 1964 Cheetah with the brass chassis and single-magnet motors (please confirm that this is the one you had). Then there was another set (shown in the 1966 catalog) with the same Dino and Cheetah but with the 1966 brass-pan/TC32 chassis. The last Euro rally set with the Chaparral and the McKee (both with the TC32 and brass-pan chassis) came up in 1966 and shows in the 1967 catalog. I am absolutely certain that it came in 1966 because it is illustrated in one of the old magazines. In 1968, Strombecker cut costs dramatically and introduced much cheaper plastic/aluminum chassis with a much-less expensive motor.

[philhoward]

The set should be here Tuesday!!!! I am contemplating taking the day off from work! Man, I am SOOOO Excited! I probably shouldn't get my hopes too high for fear of being dissappointed .......... But only two more days, WooHoo!!!!!!!
I would like more suggestions on some cheap cars to run especially for friends and/or thier kids so the original Cheetah and Dino don't get trashed.

philhoward

[TSR]

Phil,
Electric Dreams has some Scalextric and Carrera cars under 25 bucks and they run quite well. Look in the "back lot".

[Gary Bluestone]

The set should be here Tuesday!!!! I am contemplating taking the day off from work! Man, I am SOOOO Excited! I probably shouldn't get my hopes too high for fear of being dissappointed .......... But only two more days, WooHoo!!!!!!!
I would like more suggestions on some cheap cars to run especially for friends and/or thier kids so the original Cheetah and Dino don't get trashed.

philhoward

I have been running Strombecker track for over 20 years and you can race almost any kind of slot car on it 1/32 and 1/24. The slot is not as deep as commercial tracks or Scalextric or Monogram so guide depth has to be considered, but in fact some of my pals with fixed guides run their cars anyway with the front wheels off the track.
Finding a second transformer and wiring the lanes seperately is the best way to ensure cars don't suck each others power. Strombecker also made a 4 lane set and sold the 30 degree outside curves seperately. For this set, I used 4 transformers. I tested a bunch and found the best (usually yellow) put out 4 amps.
If you get the brass chassis , those are one of the best, but the plastic chassis with the green motors run fine and if cars are fairly equal, you'll have good competition and decades of fun will be instore.
I like the old Strombecker cars, and they run best on Strombecker track but today tires are hard to find, but not impossible. Old tires can be sanded if they aren't rotten. Threaded axles with Monogram or Revell wheels can be fitted with new tires like the ones sold by EJ's hobbies(I hope they still have them)
With a track so large, continuity is likely to be a problem. Do not sand the rails or connecting tabs as this will remove the plating and the track will rust. Use a pink pencil eraser or gray ink eraser. For removing the oxidization from the track ends, underneath, I glued a slice of eraser to an exacto blade. This is where the power is transmitted and an ohm meter can be used to determine where the continuity problems exist . I recommend starting with a small figure 8 or oval the make sure you are getting good power and then expand from there.
Don't worry too much about trashing the cars. Most damage comes from dropping the cars off a table or stepping on them. Racing them against each other is safe, but cars with homemade metal bumpers can be a hazard. You can find the more common body's to switch to your brass chassis for loaners. Have fun, there are more cars than ever before in history!

[philhoward]

The set arrived and I took the day off! Looks to be all here, but I would characterize it as "Good" shape as compared to "Excellent" shape as advertised. A few minor cracks on the tracks, mostly the bottom side edge on some straights. Lap counter is missing one actuator(should be easy to replace). I haven't counted all the pylons, etc. yet. Now I need to clean everything and check operation of the cars/controller/transformer. All the track and paperwork are dated 1966. The Dino & Cheetah are the brass chassis. The only track with the nipple/bump on the contacts is the Lap Counter. Tires are HARD as ROCKS. Look like 1/2" x 1/4" rims in back, 1/2" x 3/16 in front. Need to figure out where to set this up. Probably should get some carpet and put it in the garage so as not to cause any domestic squabbles! I will take some pics as I go along and try and post them here. I am going to start cleaning the tracks with warm sudsy water, then hit the rails with an eraser. Is there anything that would condition the track without making it too slick?


philhoward

[philhoward]

more pics: