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Good Wood Revival Proxy


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#1 Jairus

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 10:17 AM

The Scratch builders guild presents:

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Premise: A scratch builders proxy race for “pretty” rather than “fast”.
Build a Sports or Grand Prix slot car using nothing more than what was available in the local hobby shop about January 1965. Hand-carved wood bodies were very popular up to 1964, as model car companies had not yet ventured far into the sports car field. If you wanted to build a racer of a 1955 Allard, you had to carve the body yourself and mount it on a scratch built chassis.
So that is what we are doing here. And while there ultimately will be a “race”, the emphasis is on scale looks and period authenticity. A points system will determine the eventual winner.

Proposed race date sometime in March and April.

Two races to be held in the U.S. and two in the U.K. (TBA and looking for picturesque looking tracks.) Update: First race to be held at Pelican Park Raceway! (confirmed)

Official Rules
1. Hand carved original wood bodies only. Any type of wood allowed, example: Balsa, Pine and Basswood/Lime.

2. Details can be either hand made from brass, aluminum, resin, plastic or sourced from static model or slot car kits. (Steering wheels, windshield, head and taillights, gas cap, wheel inserts.)

3. Subject matter is: open-top sports cars/GT cars and G.P. cars 1949 to 1960. Race markings are required with minimum of two numbers on the sides. Please register your numbers beforehand so we won’t have multiples, as that is how the cars will be called out in the race report. We will split the cars into classes depending on how many entries are received. But I do not see a problem racing GP cars with Sports cars.

4. Motors are limited to open frame Pittman/Kemtron style with two exceptions made for Bonner and K&B Challenger. A complete motor list is attached below. If your motor is not listed, then please ask the committee before entering. No can-motors allowed in this proxy! There are plenty of races for can motors and sealed Chinese motors.
Motor modifications are limited to what was modified during the period, ie: bearings, balancing, rewinding, magnet zapping, removing the rear axle support arms, etc. But no Neo magnets allowed! Let’s all keep that same old block of crap in there and have fun.
Not listed but also allowed are: Atlas AT206/208 and the Pittman DC-196B.

5. Chassis are pretty much open to anything that was built back in 1964 and lots of ideas were tried. Brass rod and brass tube space frames were pretty much the standard. However, full belly pans were starting to become popular as well, so either or a combination of both are good for this race. Factory produced chassis parts are also acceptable as long as they are period correct, example: Kemtron, K&B, Echo.
Drop arms legal but no body movement allowed! This is not a D3 retro race. It is a throw back to a hobby of an era gone by. So please stay in the spirit of the era and that eliminates any “Jail-door” or “floppy plate” chassis design.
That said… working steering, suspension; a differential, 4-wheel drive, two motors, sidewinder, and in-line are all deemed fair game.
One has only to open the pages of any Model Car Science from 1963-64 and you will see articles on building features such as these. So innovation and engineering encouraged, as long as it is in the spirit of the era.
Acceptable chassis examples:
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6. Wheels should be vintage threaded, taper-lock or set screw. Repops are allowed if they are close replicas. (Example: the Russkit reproductions currently available @ Professor Motor and Electric Dreams.) Vintage Dynamic, Buzco and Riggen cast wheels are also legal provided the casting matches the car. Inserts required on plain disc wheels and they should match the style and era of the car.

7. Tires to be vintage rubber or reproduction rubber scaled correctly to the car on which to be mounted. (Example Lotus 19 will have much smaller tires than will a Maserati 300S). Ortmann is an excellent source, and No foam or silicone tires allowed.

8. Driver figure required.

9. Guides are to be 1/8” post or 3/16” post “screw braid guides” only. No clip-in-braids! Please keep the lead wires to only one positive and one negative lead wire. Electric Dreams has vintage Champion “superflex” wire so keep it as vintage looking as possible.

10. Gears as vintage as possible. The most popularly used of the era were the bronze bevel gears made by MRRC, K&B, Atlas, Tradeship. No Pink Parma gears allowed or you will be mocked mercilessly I assure you!

11. Classes for 1/24th and 1/32nd scale racing. But all will compete together in concours d'elegance phase.

12. Concours d’elegance will be broken down into “best paint”, “most realistic/authentic”, and “best chassis”.

13. Entry fee: $75.00 u.s. (Estimate) to cover postage between the tracks and postage for the return trip home. T-shirts will be available for all entrants, design to be announced soon as I come up with one.

14. The committee reserves the right to add updates to this post as they happen. But, it won't hurt much.




Period motors example are shown in this MC&T magazine article.
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Jairus H Watson - Artist
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#2 Howmet TX

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 11:53 AM

I started building today!

John Dilworth


#3 Régis4446

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 01:43 PM

I'll start soon, I find my proxy car :)
Régis Baron

#4 Duffy

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 02:06 PM

I tho't about it, but decided I wouldn't have time nor resources.

BUT I wanted to share my nasty little giggle, because within the letter of the rules it would work, and in 1964 I actually DID it...

At the time, I had some metal model of something I wanted - dunno what, it was green - so I fiddled around with plaster of Paris until I'd learned how to make a mold that came apart intact, and made a mold off the body. I recall something about modeling-clay dams with carpet tack keys...it's fuzzy now.
Then, I couldn't afford glass cloth, but I could hold this big block of balsa lengthwise against my Dad's belt sander 'til I choked & get a 5-gal. pail of long balsa fibers for my trouble. Mix'em to a slurry in thinned Ambroid, daub the mess into the plaster mold (slathered with Vaseline - this was Lesson #3 as I recall) and by the time I'd picked the last crust off my fingers I could pop the mold apart & get a body. Paint & mount.
Made a few for the guys, too, couple bucks each if I recall.

When this event came up, I was thinking about substituting a Howmet repop for the plaster (well, they had vacs in '64, right? And I supplied John the original for backpouring anyway!) but - still, no time.
But it was fun there, for a while.

duf
Michael J. Heinrich
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And I am awaiting
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a renaissance of wonder

#5 dc-65x

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 04:45 PM

Hi Duffy,

If you can find the time I can find the parts for you. I'd love to see the Master of the Lost Causes having some vintage fun again... :)

Lost Causes Link

Rick Thigpen
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#6 Jairus

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 07:11 PM

No one here has registered a racing number yet so I will get it started.

Everyone posting numbers and entries is registered by just posting. I'll make a list later.
Myself, I think I will go with a 1/24th Maserati 250F driven by Juan Manuel Fangio and that gives me number..... #1! (ha)

Jairus H Watson - Artist
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#7 dc-65x

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 07:19 PM

Rodney and I will be number 2 and 3 :). Our cars are "California Specials" so we just need consecutive numbers.

Rick Thigpen
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#8 endbelldrive

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 07:22 PM

1/24 #28 Musitelli 1953 Ferrari 166 Abarth Spyder
1/32 #54 Ferrari Super Monza
Bob Suzuki

#9 Jairus

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 09:34 PM

Rick, very sorry. "Bigtone" on S.F. already got #2 at 1:41 this afternoon. Will #3 and #4 work?

Jairus H Watson - Artist
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#10 dc-65x

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 09:42 PM

You bet :)

Rick Thigpen
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#11 Howmet TX

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Posted 29 October 2012 - 09:11 AM

Ferrari TR250 & Lotus IX for me, old chap. Any number you like. I'll put an appropriate driver in when the time comes !

John Dilworth


#12 Jairus

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 06:47 PM

Watch out guys... the French are coming!
I posted the rules on FOLM and looks like the interest is there for quite a few entries. It's now a three way race SlotBlog vs. SlotForum vs. FOLM!
So far SlotForum has more entries. :)

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#13 endbelldrive

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:36 PM

Paper mache! Can we make out interiors out of that? :)
Bob Suzuki

#14 Jairus

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:37 PM

Yes.
  • endbelldrive likes this

Jairus H Watson - Artist
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#15 Lone Wolf

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 02:59 PM

OK, this was deleted by accident. Was supposed to be 2 posts ago. Hey, nobodys perfect.

Anyway, this cover evoked the hole "wood " theme to me. Back when men were men with no roll bars and paper mache helmets.

http://www.ebay.com/...=item19d438d515

Greg, if you want to correct the post order please do, thanks

Joe Lupo


#16 don.siegel

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 04:43 PM

Happened to run into this while looking for something else - so if you want to see a really authentic balsa racer from the early 60s, here it is - by no less an authority than the late José Rodriguez Jr., a rail and slot pioneer in the USA. In fact, this car looks like it may well have dated to the rail era, which probably ended by 1960 in the States, and was later converted to slot.

As you can see, the early slot cars were still pretty basic! He doesn't specify the motor, but it was probably something like a Pittman DC195, DC60 or similar. The magazine is from Jan-Feb 1963, so the car dates from at least 3 months earlier, and probably more...

Don

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#17 slotbaker

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 08:16 PM

Love the guide in that thing Don.
This is a cool thread.
:)

Steve King


#18 don.siegel

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 05:35 AM

Thanks Steve, glad you're enjoying it.

You're right, that guide is really something - and also a reminder of what it was like when you couldn't just walk over to your local hobby shop (what's that?) and buy the parts you needed.

Let's see, 1961-62 - probably about the only commercial guide available was the Strombecker from their sets, or an MRRC imported from England... and the old "curtain rail" used in all those Model Maker articles...

Don

#19 boxerdog

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:30 PM

While groping around for pieces, I uncovered a box that says it all!!!

Attached Images

  • 005b.jpg

David Cummerow

#20 Jairus

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 12:20 AM

Seems like weeks since I have made any progress on my entry. Been planning the chassis since I started and thanks to Mike Z. I got a good Pittman 196B. The first motor I managed to acquire had a bad brush and the fact that the motor was the last of it's breed meant that finding a replacement was near impossible. Anyway, for this project I found the bearings less than satisfactory. The biggest problem was the narrowness of the rear axle bearings on the Pittman 196B compared to the width of the car.
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Found another vintage endbell that might work and it also spreads the bearings out wider. I think it's a Champion item for a can drive Mabuchi.
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Next the forks were cut off the spare endbell and filed it smooth.
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Gears don't connect so the bracket needs cutting and trimming.
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Here is the rough cut bracket. I first added a stiffener rod to ensure the bracket remained at a 90 degree angle.
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The motor endbell now nests with-in the axle bracket ensuring good gear mesh. Motor mounts will now be adjustable front to rear and the crown gear allows adjustment to the left and right. Between the two I believe good gear mesh is possible.
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:)

Jairus H Watson - Artist
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#21 Bruce Wayne

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 10:57 AM

Gentlemen,

Being a Newbie to the Proxy racing format, are there any written rules or guidelines to follow?
I ask because the basic SOP and rules for this series are somewhat vague in the technical aspect.

If someone could just answer some basic questions to start off with it would help and I would appreciate it very much.

1. Was the standard track clearance of 1/16" established by this time, and is that what will be adhered to?

2.
a. Regarding car maintenance/set-up, will there be a designated "pit crew" to make regular inspection and and adjustments to the cars? I ask because not knowing the tracks/conditions they will race under, curious if each track has a different braid depth and if any adjustments to the guide at each track are allowed.
b. Who does the oiling of motor/braid prior to racing, and are the cars/motors cleaned after each race?

3. If maintenance/adjustments are allowed, should entrants be prepared to send along any special tools or instructions for their cars?

4. As for the cars themselves, will they be individually scrutinized for accuracy of scale, such as wheelbase, track, tire diameter etc? Will infringement result in a DQ, or a loss of points?

Thanks for any tips or help you can offer
Bruce W. Frye

#22 Jairus

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 03:38 PM

Bruce,

 

The rules are what they are.  If you plan to force the rules for handling purposes beyond what was done back in 1964 then the car will be graded on concourse accordingly.
1. There were no standard clearances back in 1964 in the scale classes.  A car was suppose to be built with a scale under body clearance and that would end up being much higher than 1/16".

 

2. There should not be any maintenance needed for only 4 races unless the cars break.  And I would be willing to bet you that none do!

 

3. Of course special tools such as a Knockoff wrench or muffler bearing adjuster   All tools will be returned to the builder, and before the deadline I will specify the shape and size of shipping box allowed.

 

4. Short answer: YES.  

Half the  cars credit will be given to concourse and that requires a realistic appearance and scale tire diameter. Haven't figured out a points structure yet. But thinking about asking a couple scale model car forums to do the judging.


Jairus H Watson - Artist
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#23 gascarnut

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 04:30 PM

Jairus:
 
2. There should not be any maintenance needed for only 4 races unless the cars break.  

This was an issue with the Balls Out Thingie Proxy and it was only two rounds. The braids on some (most) cars burned badly because they were not treated, and that affected performance very noticeably.

Dennis Samson
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Scratchbuilding is life
Life is scratchbuilt

Samson Classics


#24 Jairus

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 07:40 PM

These are completely different cars drawing much less current and traveling at way lower speeds Dennis. But... I am will instruct all the track directors to keep on the look out for wear and tear regardless.


Jairus H Watson - Artist
Need something painted, soldered, carved, or killed? - jairuswtsn@aol.com

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Check out some of the cool stuff on my Fotki!


#25 Bruce Wayne

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 08:58 PM

I'm still in the early stage of chassis design and development, and was curious if a chassis with a drop arm might be more suitable for the varying track conditions and braid depth. This is what question 2.a. mainly stems from.

What I really lack are good references and pictures of pre-'65 chassis designs using Pittman 196 style motors. I don't have any books or magazines older than '67, and am finding it hard to imagineer a design that is both period and in the "spirit" of the Proxy. If someone could post more photos or links to pics, that would be of great help.

Also, with my choice of a MB W196 prototype to model, the 10 cars built had several wheelbase variants, so I am taking the best measurements from all of them to suit my own needs. Hope that fits within the scheme of things too.
Bruce W. Frye





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