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Proxy idea - low cost, scratchbuilt Kurtis Indy cars


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#1 MSwiss

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:21 PM

When guys see these go around my flat track, they can't help but smile.

 

Sano Dave Fiedler commented that after being a bit tired of building, these cars would inspire him to scratchbuild a new chassis.

 

My idea is for a proxy event, at least held at my raceway, where the cars would be run on both the flat track and the King, with

the combined lap total for both tracks, would determine the winner.

 

To be fair, local racers would not be permitted to enter a tested car.

 

Major car components and gear ratio would be speced out, with parts shown in my $53.95 kit required.

Kurtis kit

 

Cars would require a 3 7/8" WB and max., 1/4" guide lead, a mandatory .050" F & R clearance, with all other chassis design , wide open.

 

Races, of course, would be broadcast on U-stream, as the other Proxy events I've held.

 

Other parts of the event would be a Concours, and possibly a "heads up" race for the top finishers against the local racer's "tested" cars.

 

Entry fee would be free,  with purchase of the $59.95 kit.

 

Only other parts required would be chassis materials other than the supplied JK bracket and C/R guide tongue, and incidentals such as lead wire,

guide clips, washers and nut, braid, axle spacers, pins and detail parts.

 

The only other cost would be my  shipping cost back to the owner (approx. $5-$10) or another raceway, if any is interested in hosting a race.

 

I have no idea if these cars have the same appeal to others, as they do with my locals.

 

I'd like to see a minimum of 8 entries to proceed and hold the race.

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Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.





#2 Tim Neja

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:37 PM

Those look very cool!! When I have time--I'd like to build a couple for my home track!! :)


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She's real fine, my 409!!!

#3 boxerdog

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:46 PM

I like that idea if the allowable tires had a max width and a min height spec....I'd almost plop one on my existing retro F-1 to see how it looks...what great looking cars!


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#4 Duffy

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:51 PM

YESS! Mike mentioned these the other day and I demurred - it's a lot tougher when you're lookin' right at 'em, though. Real tempting.

Duf
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#5 MSwiss

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 11:02 PM

I like that idea if the allowable tires had a max width and a min height spec....I'd almost plop one on my existing retro F-1 to see how it looks...what great looking cars!

Tires come in at about 1.080".

 

I was kicking around a 1.000" minimum, to allow truing, and or testing.

 

Rear tires are NOT .800". They already look pretty good at the stock width of a little less than .700".

 

That said, at rim width, approx. .540" wide, they probably look better.

 

The short guide lead is where these really deviate vs. a Retro car.

 

With a , IMO, an over powering  F7 in one of the pictured cars, I ran a 5.9 on my flat track.

 

A real top Retro F1 will run about a 5.1.


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#6 MG Brown

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 11:07 PM

No offense intended to Mr Swiss, but I don't get proxy racing.

It seems to me somewhat like sending your wife / GF on a trip alone, having a minimum of 8 other guys wine and dine her, and then they evaluate the experience for you after they have sent her back home.

I admit that I am not the best slot car driver but I get a certain amount of pleasure in driving my creations.

Just me I guess. I don't get anime either.
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#7 MSwiss

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 11:13 PM

M.G.,

Easy to for you say, being in the Chicago area, with 2 raceways within a mile or so of each other.

 

For those without a local raceway, it's a way to see how their cars stack up against others.


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Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#8 Duffy

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 11:22 PM

Yah - well, to me, it's even less about racing as about sharing the cars with guys who don't normally see each others' work; and, remember, Retro's about the Scratchbuilding, right?

I'm currently embroiled in a proxy, a co-op job where I'm designated painter; now, given that I'm in no way a REAL painter (I just play one on Slotblog), I'm mostly doing this to say too my buddies elsewhere "THIS is what I do, just for fun."

Proxies might just give some of us a chance to connect. In that, it's not real different from why we post on the Blog. How 'bout that?

Duf

ps: much as I should resist, I'm reeel tempted to do one of these roadsters. In "period" spirit. How cool is that. -df
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#9 MSwiss

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 11:26 PM

Something about that scalloped paint on the nose, puts me in a better mood.


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Mike Swiss
 
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Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#10 JohnnySlotcar

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 04:16 AM

Johnny Slotcar is in on this one! Send me out a kit please, I am ready to build one myself [ yes, pigs can fly]!!


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#11 Paul Jurczyszyn

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 08:09 AM

I have built this using a cheep Parma sprint pan cut and extended to wb. This make it easy an cheep.
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#12 Milkman

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 08:19 AM

I'd definitely participate.  These cars look very cool and would love to see all the entries.  When's it going to happen? 


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#13 Steve Deiters

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:14 AM

Mike Swiss:  Any pictures of any completed chassis so we have an idea of a starting point for these monsters?



#14 gotboostedvr6

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:26 AM

Can we see the chassis?

Oops beat me to the punch.

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#15 MantaRay

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:46 AM

I'm in.........Glad to see Johnny Slotcar is going to build one.....
How wide are the bodies? Or is there a max width?
We will not test at C/R.
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#16 boxerdog

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 10:52 AM

I had never considered a proxy race until I built a car for the  Balls Out race this year, and it was a lot of fun. Now I have a beat  up thingie in my case signed by some of the best drivers in SoCal...how cool is that! They had to drive my ill-handling POS and I didn't! And if this goes, Mike, count me in, please.


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#17 MSwiss

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 12:25 PM

Mike Swiss:  Any pictures of any completed chassis so we have an idea of a starting point for these monsters?

I'll see if I can get one posted this weekend.

 

The car's pictured are not mine.

 

The body  requires an approx. 1.400" wide chassis with a 3 7/8" WB and a short 1/4" guide lead.


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#18 Ramcatlarry

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 04:03 PM

Track width outside max?  3" or less?  Shot pics at the Indy Museum awhile back and narrow tires WILL be more scale - like 1/2 - 3/4" .  Early roadsters used like 7.50 - 8.00 tires on 15" front rims and 16" rear rims. 

 

There are a few other shells other than the Kurtis  available in front motor.


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#19 endbelldrive

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 04:16 PM

No offense intended to Mr Swiss, but I don't get proxy racing.

It seems to me somewhat like sending your wife / GF on a trip alone, having a minimum of 8 other guys wine and dine her, and then they evaluate the experience for you after they have sent her back home...

You're saying that's a bad thing, Mick? :scratch_one-s_head:

 

I'd like to send my wife...I mean I'd like to build a car for this event too. :bye:


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#20 MG Brown

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 04:18 PM

You're saying that's a bad thing, Mick? :scratch_one-s_head:


You're the best Bob. Carry on gentlemen.

 

1M450LLIS-RED-2.jpg


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#21 JohnnySlotcar

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 04:44 PM

I have my center hinge, rear steer on the drawing board! ROFL


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#22 MG Brown

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 08:17 PM

Those looking for inspiration for paint jobs are invited to visit:

 

Harry A. Miller Club / Millers at Milwaukee Information

 

Millers at Milwaukee Gallery 2011

 

Millers at Milwaukee Gallery 2009


"I'm just here for the entertainment." George Carlin


#23 Dave Crevie

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 04:46 PM

You can find hundreds of pictures of the real cars by just searching " Kurtis Kraft indy cars"

 

There is also a decal supplier called Indycals which has most of the sponsor sets available.



#24 slotbaker

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 05:18 PM

If I bought your kit, used the body wheels and motor, would this be eligible to enter?

:huh:
f1-sbakr-kurtis6-14.jpg

f1-sbakr-kurtis6-10.jpg

f1-sbakr-kurtis6-02.jpg

(That's a Patto's body.)


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#25 Pablo

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 05:34 PM

I'm in.    :dance3:   Sounds like a heck of a lot of fun. I don't even have to leave the privacy of my own home to satisfy my cravings. This could be my best and only chance to be in an "A" Main with Sano Dave

Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee :laugh2:  :good:


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#26 MSwiss

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 06:02 PM

If I bought your kit, used the body wheels and motor, would this be eligible to enter?

:huh:
f1-sbakr-kurtis6-14.jpg

f1-sbakr-kurtis6-10.jpg

f1-sbakr-kurtis6-02.jpg

(That's a Patto's body.)

I'd love to say "Yes", but I'll have to say "No".

 

I had no idea that there was existing cars out there.

 

IMO, rather than butcher up an existing car, (which looks great, BTW) to fit the clearance parameters, you'd be much better of just starting fresh,

especially considering the spec fronts are 3/32" axle.


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#27 MSwiss

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 06:13 PM

Mike Swiss:  Any pictures of any completed chassis so we have an idea of a starting point for these monsters?

Steve,

The below are the two existing chassis that are out there, both made by the guy who did the mold, Dave Crevie.

 

This past Saturday, both were raced on my flat track.

 

I ran the simpler car (top one with black body), and IMO, it wasn't as good as the slightly whizzier, Z rail chassis.

(bottom one with red body)

 

I ran a 5.97 in practice with it, even at, IMO, a pretty light 110 G.

 

For being Falcon II powered, that's a pretty impressive time.

Attached Images

  • 100_8414.jpg
  • 100_8411.jpg

Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#28 MantaRay

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 06:30 PM

How wide are they supposed to be?


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#29 MSwiss

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 06:38 PM

1.400" , but if using a commercial jig out there, to make it easy, I would just build to 1.375".


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#30 MantaRay

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:36 PM

1.375 sounds like a plan................but I'm going to sand off the "Pro Track" on the tires....lol


Ray Price
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#31 MantaRay

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:38 PM

Pablo, My Friend................If you are here in person or proxy...................It's all good...............build on


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Ray Price
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#32 Pablo

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:48 PM

Thanks Ray Ray.

 

Also, any time I can support my favorite raceways, I will. 


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#33 MSwiss

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:55 PM

After running the cars for a whole race on Saturday, my thoughts are rim width, along with looking good, runs fine.

So .575" max width on the rears, .375" minimum width on the fronts, 1.000" minimum dia. on both.

.050" clearance, front and rear.


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#34 Tim Neja

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 11:33 PM

These are VERY cool looking cars--I"m just not interested in .050 clearance front to back.  I'd rather build them for my home track with .020 in the front and .050 in the back to help with handling.  Love the cars and all the old paint schemes!! I'm thinking--"plumber" shaker style --or maybe even a "Z" rail car and Falcon II's for my home track.  Nice!!


She's real fine, my 409!!!

#35 MSwiss

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:18 AM

The thought of the even F-R clearances, was I was just trying to make jigging the axle height  easier, for these large size tires.

 

Guys are welcome to comment if they have a preference.

 

Also note the front could  be lowered at anytime by truing down the tires smaller.


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#36 Paul Jurczyszyn

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:08 PM

Mike,
Is there going to be a package deal we can get with every thing we need for the build? Or can you supply part #s so I can do a one stop shop from who will carry the body's.
Paul,
It will be fun to have a car race along side my mentor Pablo.
Humble student of the master slotters

#37 slotcarone

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:27 PM

:) It is easier to build with even clearance front to back.  The .050 works well on the Retro stock cars.  They handle great even with the big heavy body so these should be no problem at that clearance IMO. Keep it simple!!!


Mike Katz

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#38 Pablo

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:31 PM

Level front to rear eliminates the need for tongue tilt.  I like it.

 

Hi Paul J.  This is gonna be a hoot ! :D


Paul Wolcott

#39 Dave Crevie

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:31 PM

The chassis we raced Saturday have .030 front clearance and .060 rear for the Z-railer. The other has

.023 front clearance and .060 rear. We should think about track width. Mine are at 3,125 wide for appearance

sake. 3 1/4 tends to look too wide. I started at 3 " even, the same as the resin bodied cars I built. I did not see

any great improvement when I widened them out.



#40 Paul Jurczyszyn

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:42 PM

Ha Pablo,
Hows it going. Getting all my things ready for this build. Can't wait to see all the cars.
Hope CLR has all the parts and body. As my building skills are getting better just keep soldering away and learning new tricks as I go.
Paul
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#41 MSwiss

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:04 PM

Paul J,

You must of missed this:

http://slotblog.net/...goland-raceway/

 

It includes all the main parts, but I also can supply the misc. minor parts such as lead wire, braid, guide clips and nut, if necessary.


Mike Swiss
 
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Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
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Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#42 Paul Jurczyszyn

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:54 PM

Mike,
I would like one complete kit please,
Who can I make the payment to? Pp yes. Is it possible to get an extra body?
Paul
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#43 Pablo

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:01 PM

Now waitaminnut.  I ain't even got mine yet !

 

Mike PLEASE take our money !!!  :laugh2:


Paul Wolcott

#44 MSwiss

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 07:44 PM

Pablo,

You (and others) have to decide if you want to wait for the optional resin driver/interior, or get your kit and start building now.


Mike Swiss
 
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Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
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17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
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Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#45 Paul Jurczyszyn

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 08:06 PM

What do ya say Pablo let's go max .
Mike how long till there out with resin extras?
Paul
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#46 MSwiss

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 08:10 PM

The chassis we raced Saturday have .030 front clearance and .060 rear for the Z-railer. The other has

.023 front clearance and .060 rear. We should think about track width. Mine are at 3,125 wide for appearance

sake. 3 1/4 tends to look too wide. I started at 3 " even, the same as the resin bodied cars I built. I did not see

any great improvement when I widened them out.

The Z-railer handled great with .090" total clearance F & R. A tad more in the front shouldn't make a big enough difference to matter,

so I'm going to stick with my original plan of .050" , F & R.

 

3.125" sounds fine for the track width.


Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder
17B West Ogden AveWestmont, IL 60559, ( 708) 203-8003
mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address) 
Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516
Make checks out to Chicagoland Woodworking, Inc.


#47 Pablo

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 08:31 PM

I'll wait for the complete kit.

Also the complete details in one place: Rules, deadlines, details, etc. which I am sure Mike is working on.


Paul Wolcott

#48 Jaak

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 04:28 AM

Me too,

 

Also need to know when they need to be there to see if i can fit it in.


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#49 Jairus

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 10:32 AM

How many proxies are you planning to enter Jaak?  :victory:


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#50 Foamy

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 01:33 PM

How much is the it and when is the proxy event?


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