61 replies to this topic

[dc-65x]

I Was looking through some car pictures I saved when I came across this ISO scratchbuilt car:

 

It might be one of Edo's but I don't know for sure:

I thought that it looked pretty "old" and I wondered when the Cox La Cucaracha came out?    Then I found this article in Rod & Custom Magazine:

 

 

I also found this in the same November 1966 Issue of R&C Magazine Issue:

 

 

I can't remember a single picture of an ISO inline car in any of the PRO race reports of 1966, 67 or 68. Maybe there were some but there sure weren't many........I wonder why?

 

Time for another one of my R&C "What If 's" builds!

[SlotStox#53]

Onward!

All I know is you're going have a whole track full of R&C what if builds!!

It's going to be one COOL event

[gluebomb]

Huh, I always thought the Cox car was a year or so later - shows what I know...

Look forward to to your build !

[dc-65x]

Hi Paul,

 

This will make number 11 (if I can get the 36D car painted in time!).

 

 

..........I always thought the Cox car was a year or so later - shows what I know...

 

Me too Simon!

[Bill from NH]

Rick, you build, we'll watch!

[Samiam]

  Always thought the "Cuc" was a good design. It was just too light and fragile. Been wanting to make a brass version. Looks like I have been beat out by 45 years.

[Pablo]

My experience is, any design that keeps the front wheels from upsetting the apple cart, all work great. My hinged front wheel Batmobile handles like it's on rails. 

[Jairus]

So Rick... are the "What If" cars legal for the Proxy too then?
Because if so.... I can make a nice little shaker car that will totally out handle everyone else's.

[dc-65x]

Hi Jairus,

 

Hmmmmmmmmmmm................

 

This "Event" is really about the conventional style R&C cars as pictured in the race reports. By conventional style R&C cars, I mean Mabuchi or Hemi powered, multi-brass rod or tube inline chassis with a drop arm. There were also a couple of Dynamic chassis cars and a couple of Tyco-Pittman sidewinders. I'll be bringing 4 conventional cars to the event.

 

I became curious how other types of PERIOD (that means 1966) style cars might have performed. So as an excuse to build more cars, I came up with the idea for my "What If" cars. These cars use PERIOD parts and PERIOD designs. I'll be bringing 7 of these too.

 

The Proxy Event will include running all the cars in a series of timed laps (like the qualifying for the R&C races in 1966) and a subjective handling evaluation by someone I consider to be an "expert". The final published tech chart will (I believe) list the cars in the order of their "qualifying times", fastest time first and so on.

 

I can see how having one's car listed at the "top of the chart" can have a certain "bragging rights" factor.

 

SO......I propose that the "conventional" R&C cars be listed at the top of the chart. They are what this event is really all about, having fun building and sharing the cars of the R&C Road Race Series.

 

My "what if" cars, or anybody else who builds a "what if" PERIOD style car will have their results listed separately at the bottom of the Tech Chart.

 

I can also simply not publish the results of how the "what if" cars performed. At least I'll know the answer to, "What if?"

 

 

 

[Jairus]

Thank you for answering.

Please excuse my impertinence as the question of "What If" has nagged me as well.
I appreciate the clarity of your answer.

 

I might just see if I can come up with a "What if" entry myself.
With-in the ground rules of course. 

[dc-65x]

I think is was a good question and it showed the need to keep the purity of the R&C cars as they raced.

 

Separating out the "what if" cars will be a good thing.

[Steve Okeefe]

I agree completely...  because I've got more than a few "what if" chassis design ideas floating around in my head, and I've been pondering this very same question.

 

This R&C event is about revisiting (which to me says re-creating, or even replicating) what happened in the six R&C races.  While it would easy to argue that an ISO-fulcrum chassis like the Cox Cucaracha could have been built and entered, there is as Rick has pointed out, no published evidence that it ever happened.

 

Further, given the comprehensiveness of the six R&C articles (written by Gene Husting), in which numerous evolving motor and chassis "speed secrets" were documented, I feel confident that something like an ISO-fulcrum car would have been at least mentioned - but it wasn't.

 

So, having a distinct "what-if" category and listing the results separately is a neat solution - build on!

[don.siegel]

Actually, Steve, I'm not sure the published accounts really give us the whole picture. While they cover the top cars very completeley, and do talk about general trends, they don't address any of the 50 or so non-contenders... (don't remember offhand how many entries, but I would guess 60 or so). 

 

So there could well have been some kids and/or less skilled racers entering iso-fulcrum, 36D, Pittcan, S/W and other types of cars without it ever being mentioned in the reports - because they were nowhere near qualifying. 

 

In one of his articles, Mike Morrissey does say that the winning cars may all seem similar, but they did in fact try many other configurations, including sidewinders, and the inline rod chassis proved to be the best. 

 

In any case, very good question and definitely worth bringing up. 

 

Before i do a "what if", I better do a "it was there"! I already seem to have missed the proxy drag deadline through inattention (what? it's already mid-May? but I thought we were still back in March!), so will try to get this done on time! 

 

Don 

[dc-65x]

Hi Guys,
 
 

....So there could well have been some kids and/or less skilled racers entering iso-fulcrum, 36D, Pittcan, S/W and other types of cars without it ever being mentioned in the reports - because they were nowhere near qualifying....

 
That's what sparked my interest in the "what if" type of car. How would it compare to a "conventional" type car when both are built and driven by the same person?
 

So, having a distinct "what-if" category and listing the results separately is a neat solution - build on!

 

I think a separate and subordinate sub-category to let the "what if" cars play is a good plan too.

 

But I encourage others to build "real" R&C cars first and foremost.   I've already built a full grid of "conventional" R&C cars and I wanted to build more, yet different R&C cars.

 

Like Steve said, "build on!"

[Steve Okeefe]

Don, you keep me honest!

 

About the published accounts not really giving us the whole picture...  no argument there; the whole picture is way too big to be covered in a three or four page race report.  So it is entirely possible that somewhere in the 50 or 60 entries there could be a couple of "strange birds", including ISO-fulcrum chassis or two.

 

On the other hand, if based on the Cox Cucaracha, it would be chronologically restricted to the fifth or sixth races, which were held in October and December.  The R&C article Rick posted about the Cucaracha was published in the November issue, probably on sale in October.

 

By the way, here's the article you mentioned in which Mike M. describes (paraphrasing) "coming back to the old standby - 16Ds in brass rod chassis":

 

 

I'd be delighted to discuss R&C "what-if" ideas and possibilities in a separate thread, but we should I think let Rick get back to building his car in this one.

[dc-65x]

........we should I think let Rick get back to building his car in this one.

 

Alrighty then......

 

I'm using a Russkit bracket drilled for Hemi style motor mounting screws and fitted with a reducer for the 3/16" motor bearing. The axle holes were opened up for 7/32" tube and fitted with vintage Howard's Hobby House bearing retainers (the original "duffies: ):

 

 

The ISO center section is 2 rails per side of 1/16" brass rod wrapped around the guide mount tube:

 

 

It was super wimpy so I beefed it up with 1/16" brass sheet:

 

 

Time to figure out the ISO hinge which will further tie the Russkit bracket to the frame rails..........

[SlotStox#53]

Excellent start to the center section Rick Love those original duffies , shaping up to be a very cool R&C "What if" 

 

Once the Dragster Proxy car is finished ( ... only a couple of days left before shipment time    )   will finish off the 2 Pittman Team cars & look at possibly either another featured R&C car (that Pittman armed Tyco could be on the cards) or may have a go at a "What if" .....will have to see

[Steve Okeefe]

   Oooo!  Oooo!!!        I think I know how he's gonna do it... 

[Dave Fiedler]

Steve, 

Any chance of seeing the rest of that article by Morrissey here?
 
Rick,

Just love your builds. As usual, I can't wait. Need more now.
 

Sano Dave

[dc-65x]

Making progress.........

 

 

....I love my Rick's jig. A pin for EVERYTHING!

 

 

Still a few more things to add.......

[Bill from NH]

Steve, 

Any chance of seeing the rest of that article by Morrissey here?
 
Dave, here's the complete article from when Rick built one in 2005.

 

http://www.slotcarta...dial-up-beware)

[Pablo]

There are a lot of things there I like, I've been staring at it for a while    Lots of space for lead up front, the bracing on the hinge, the clever use of the holes n pins on the jig, the duffies, I love it !!

[dc-65x]

Thanks Bill, I had forgotten about that post!

 

Hi Pablo, the center section seemed super wimpy. The Micro Mark band saw and disc sander made cutting, fitting and dropping in a piece of brass sheet super easy. I really stiffened things up.

 

Here's the.....what to call it....the iso front-o?

 

 

It seemed wimpy so I added a couple more cross braces:

 

 

Time to put the pieces together.........

[SlotStox#53]

That is gonna be one very nice iso could really picture that being entered & qualifying for one of the R&C races

Are you using one of your R&C motors made easy for this build Rick?

[dc-65x]

The finished chassis. Hand polished in stages as the build went along, no tumbler:
 

 
I find hand polishing to be kind of therapeutic . No really!
 

 

 

   Oooo!  Oooo!!!        I think I know how he's gonna do it... 

 
Steve, I should have pm'd you for your idea as I didn't come up with a clever ISO hinge. I just soldered the 1/16" piano wire pivot rod to each side of the ISO section. This acts like a rearmost cross brace and helped stiffen things up:
 

 
I drilled a "blow hole" to help blow out any flux from the 3/32" pivot tube:
 

 

Are you using one of your R&C motors made easy for this build Rick?

 

I've got something different this time Paul