39 replies to this topic

[MattD]

1/24...1/25. I sent Doug Haynes a rough slush cast Chaparral body many years ago. I explained the process, rough as it was, to him and he started making bodies. He got a lot better than me. He was involved with the guys that revived the old southern Ca club that had the track you could change to different layouts. Name escapses me. I think their whole program was based on 1/25. One of their guys posts here from time to time and I also talked to him years ago and he only wanted 1/25. Those guys are really into the scale of their cars. Mostly we see 1/24 around here as it is more available.

I do appreciate the larger scale and room to work with. The body size makes it much easier for old eyes and hands to work on them!

[n.elmholt]

I admit to not having done the research to confirm this, but I think most accurately-scaled Can-Am bodies would be too small for the chassis 'platform" typically used in 1/24 slot racing.

 

the later cars were wider and more suitable for standard chassis. I make the the Autocoast Ti 22 in grp and it has plenty room for a chassis:

 

 

http://slotblog.net/...autocoast-ti22/

[Bill from NH]

 He got a lot better than me. He was involved with the guys that revived the old southern Ca club that had the track you could change to different layouts. Name escapses me. I think their whole program was based on 1/25. One of their guys posts here from time to time and I also talked to him years ago and he only wanted 1/25.

 

Matt, the southern Cali club with track you could change to different layouts was MESAC. The former club member who occasionally posts here was probably Todd Messinger. Todd now races with the Pelican Park speedway club in Eugene, OR.

[MattD]

Right you are and it was Todd Messinger that I talked to many years ago. As you get older you find those names that you have on the tip of your tongue are now lost somewhere in that immense brain you have developed over your lifetime!

[Mike Patterson]

The track I pictured was an experiment in seeing just how tight you could warp MDF. Mike had problems getting the joints to hold together in a couple places.

[MSwiss]

I did this underneath most sections of my King to get it to bank/twist a little easier.

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[rvec]

STOP - Before opening a slot shop please consider the following. BTW, I think the current crop of large commercial tracks is unsuitable for a slot business. Sure there are exceptions as you mentioned but consider a much smaller 4 lane wood track built by no other than you! Anyway just read on - food for thought. The proposed alternative model has been successfully used at Sidewinder Raceway (located near Sacramento California). I have written several articles on this facility. To read more see the link and click on the appropriate story. http://slotblog.net/...oving-reporter/  I know that the proposed concept will set many to howling but times they are a changing. Below is an image of one of two tracks located in the facility.




As one who spent the better part of my career analyzing the economics of multimillion dollar projects and billion dollar acquisition targets, I understand, from a financial viewpoint, what it takes to make a successful business. I also, had the opportunity to assist a well-known track builder and shop owner in developing a business plan and associated financials to pitch to a potential partner in the business. At the risk of stating the obvious, I will recount some of the issues.

• A multi-track commercial facility that includes a Blue King or similar requires lots of space read high fixed costs for the lease and utilities. In addition, track builders are few and far between and large tracks cost big bucks!

• Inventory of cars, controllers, tools and parts can tie up scores of thousands of dollars

• Large tracks tend to require a focus on powerful and as a consequence expensive motors. I recall purchasing a score of armatures trying to find one that was superior to others. Also, motor building is an art form that requires a great deal of time and effort

• Commercial tracks typically focus on non-scale lexan bodies, some of which resemble flying door stops.

• Entry level classes are typically based upon production, stamped steel chassis which constantly need attention.

• Some classes require scratch built chassis or very expensive production chassis to be competitive. Again, scratch building requires a great deal of time and effort to master.

In summary the problems with typical commercial operations are that fixed costs are relatively high and that potential revenue is based upon selling high margin products to relatively few customers. In addition, the widespread internet sale of high priced slot car components limits the pricing power of the commercial shop. All this is a recipe for disaster.

I believe that Sidewinder Raceway has turned the economics of traditional commercial facilities on its head. Below are my observations.

• Customer service is exemplary. The owner and his family are very knowledgeable and more than willing to spend time with the customer, not only to sell the product but to assist the customer in set-up. I spent more than an hour talking to the owner about the business, the track, the cars etc. He was even kind enough to allow me to try out a few of his cars. This kind of attitude keeps customers coming back.

• The track is a wood, custom build, 84 foot road course characterized by changes in elevation and relatively tight corners. Lane spacing is a tight four inches. In order to keep costs down and to eliminate the variables associated with magnets, traditional wire braid was used. The track was constructed as a family project. A second, smaller track has been built. The goal was to provide for close competition and for an atmosphere of real racing for the participant and spectator as well. The scenery, undulating terrain and custom wall hangings all add to the ambiance of the facility and create excitement and enthusiasm. The nature of the layout with its tight corners emphasizes driving skill. Result realism, atmosphere and close competition achieved with a relatively small capital outlay.

• Smaller tracks allow the footprint of the facility to be relatively small. Although I didnt take measurements, I believe that the facility is in the neighborhood of 2,500 square feet. Result relatively small lease and utility expenses.

• The focus is on scale, ready to run (RTR) 1/32nd scale racing (Although there is a BRM 1/24th scale class). Very few simple modifications are allowed. Races are held on Wednesday evenings after normal store hours. In order to keep it interesting, classes of cars rotate week to week.

The focus on RTR cars allows novice racers to get up to speed in a hurry and eliminates the frustrations, steep learning curves and time involved in scratch chassis and/or motor building.
                      The plastic chassis 1/32nd scale cars are modestly priced. Result cost is not a barrier to entry into the hobby.

• In addition, the scale appearance of the cars appeals to a wider audience and the hobby can become a family oriented activity without breaking the bank. Although not an expert in pricing, it seems that the owner has chosen to price his inventory to be competitive with internet sales. The patron is much more likely to purchase a product he can see and feel from a local vendor than to buy over the internet if prices are competitive.

The shop carries a limited number of brands but a wide variety of cars in each brand. Result This limits the number of spare parts and associated inventory carrying costs
 
                        Manufacturers of 1/32nd scale cars are constantly releasing new models and paint schemes. Result There is an incentive for racers to keep on spending money on new rides. This leads to higher sales volumes and more potential profit for the store owner

                        Several years ago I tried out a passel of RTR 1/32nd scale cars and was frankly disappointed in their performance. Great strides have been made since then. I was impressed with how well these cars handled. The owner allowed me to run a couple of his rides; a Ford Mark IV and a Trans Am Mustang. These were great fun to drive. Result much wider appeal and the potential for higher sales volumes

• Unfortunately, many commercial facilities are frequented by a small core of speed freaks who are not interested in promoting the hobby, helping others or even acting in a civil manner. In my opinion, this alone drives more potential customers away from slot racing than anything else. I would guess that the Sidewinder Raceway format of RTR, scale 1/32nd scale cars would not appeal to the hard core speed freaks. Result we may be entering a new era in slot racing, one that appeals to a much wider, family oriented audience and one that can be sustained by a more economic business model.

[Steve Deiters]

Rich Vecchio,

 

Excellent overview on the business aspect of the needs and feeds of a commercial raceway.  Frankly one of the best overviews with 50+ years (on & off) exposure to it for me.  I worked in the wholesale end of it for almost 10 years when I was in high school and college so many of the points you made sounded very familiar. 

[rvec]

Rich Vecchio,
 
Excellent overview on the business aspect of the needs and feeds of a commercial raceway.  Frankly one of the best overviews with 50+ years (on & off) exposure to it for me.  I worked in the wholesale end of it for almost 10 years when I was in high school and college so many of the points you made sounded very familiar.

Thanks Steve

Someone once said the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. Believe me, I love the hobby and have been at it for 50+ years. I see that the economics have changed but also the potential customer base has changed. We live in a plug and play world where instant gratification is demanded. Slots must compete with video games and a very large number of other activities. Old pharts like me love building cars but I think I am the exception and not the rule. The hobby must attract a new crop of participants. So we must evolve or become extinct.

[Steve Deiters]

Rich V.

 

When I read your follow up comment of "We live in a plug an play world...." I had a thought that ran through my head. 

 

Maybe the approach that needs to be taken for "new blood" should follow that line is having  a robust fleet of quality and well maintained rental cars and controllers for the person with a casual interest that one hope would grow with repeated visits for rental.  This "scratchbuilt/maintain your own" mindset may have worked OK back in the day, but we've had several paradigm shifts on how people view things now. The approach to "sink the hook" for newbnies needs to be different. 

 

When I see a casual observer who comes into a track for something other than slot racing, both young and old, they are invariably fascinated by what is happening on the track.  They always stand around and watch for extended periods of time.  I think it speaks volumes.

[Michael Jr.]

I ant argue with the business model presented in the post by Steve. I really like it and would love to see that somewhere nearby. I think this is a both/and instead of an either/or.
There needs to be room for the large (call it industrial compared to smaller) facilities. I will grant, it's a different group of racers but, it's still a group of racers. And, diversity will keep people engaged. So they can race a smaller 1:32nd track and love it. Then come and stand by a huge 155ft or 220ft track and feel they are at the Daytona 500.
I wish there could be a strategy of placement where our tracks could compliment each other. Instead, we have huge regions not services by any track and others with tracks stacked on top of each other.
I vote to count scale cars and wing cars all as slot cars and provide for all in order to move the industry forward.

[eshorer]

As I go over the many responses I received from my surveys to Commercial and Home/Club racers, I see there are far more similarities than differences, especially when it comes to why they are involved and stay with it. However, the problem one might have in trying to have a store that meets the needs of all types of racers would be in stocking the wide range of cars and parts required by racers, without them heading to the online stores and eBay. Getting a facility that could house the tracks would not be the biggest problem (although the size of large tracks will make rent in a desirable area more difficult). Whether it is wiser, from a business perspective, to try to meet the needs of every different type of racer, as opposed to limiting one's racing program to a narrower range of cars, and trying to grow that program....Lots to debate there.

Eddie

[mcrracer]

I appreciate all of the responses and opinions...but let's stay on topic. This thread is about tracks new and used and how to keep them affordable.I have built several tracks and now am not physically able any more. 100% physical disability and being legally blind prevents me from doing it again. I can direct painting ,assembly, braiding and wiring but can not physically do it myself anymore.

Any more suggestions? Are there any "second tier" track builders who could build 4 lane tracks to a "woodwork only assembly required" level?

[Mayberryman]

Marlon, first of all welcome back to Virginia.  Now, as far as your need for a track there are several options, first I would contact John in Boykins, Virginia.  I believe that he still has your old nine lane lazy eight as well as an extra long oval and I do not believe that he has actively used them for a couple of years.  If you are interested in a routed four lane 1/32 track I know of a couple of leads that you could investigate.  Phase II racing in Maryland has two routed tracks in their store, one a six lane and the other a smaller four lane that they use daily and these were both built by the owner's son.  The second group is another group based in Maryland and Pennsylvania called The Interstate Home Slot Racers and they race on several wooden tracks that either the owners built or they might have contacts in the local area where a track can be built.  Since you have left most slot racing in your area has become mostly oval racing with a club track  in about 10 miles from where Bob had Bob's Scale Auto Hobby and a track in Saluda, Virginia that was the oval that Jerry had built as the oval for JK products.  There is also a track in Charles City Virginia called Super Slots and they have a drag track as well as a Windsor.  Which ever way you go, keep us notified as to when and if you open yet another We Race Raceway.

[mcrracer]

Thanks, I'll be in contact with you soon.