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Can-Am racing In Europe


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#26 Eddie Fleming

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 10:12 AM

Also, I also believe the European attitude about racing slot cars is a lot different than ours in the US. I am told they drive as if deslotting is the worst sin in the world.
 
One BSCRA racer told me years ago that one deslot would seriously impact one's chances of winning the race and that two would completely eliminate them.


Is that because of the way they drive or is there some kind of system to reward staying on?
Eddie Fleming




#27 MSwiss

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 10:45 AM

They just lose too much time that they can't make up.

Mike Swiss
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#28 Eddie Fleming

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 12:34 PM

Must be very close racing and/or slow corner work. I like the idea of it.

Many times it seems in our racing it is press beyond the limit because there is no penalty for the deslot.
Eddie Fleming

#29 Cheater

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 12:38 PM

Note that these cars us a 25K RPM Fox motor.

I've PM'd Deiter to ask about the general number of deslots the average racer has in races with this class of cars.

Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#30 Dave Crevie

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 01:32 PM

Having tough bodies is only part of the problem. Those fine details are not going to take a hit.

And believe me, a 25,000 RPM motor can get the car going fast enough to do some very serious damage.

Personally, I think the levelof skill of the drivers is the key factor. If you have spent the amount of time to build a car to that level, you are going to drive smart. You don't take chances trying to pass on the outside of a turn. You pick you place to pass. You brake earlier. It becomes more important to get to the end in one piece then to set a track record on every lap.

I would fully support a racing series like this in this country.
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#31 Mattb

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 01:37 PM

Amazing builds, great to run replicas of real race cars in a pretty scale size. I like that they run a scale size tire, that really adds to the appearance. My real question is the source of the UOP Shadow body. Anybody know?

mb
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#32 Cheater

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 01:52 PM

Dieter Jens just replied to my PM. Here's the relevant info he provided.

"If you deslot, you will loose one or two positions. The races are extremely close and the winner mostly does not deslot.

"We run a small 13D type motor, the Fox with about 25,000 RPM; slower than a Falcon. But last week there was a race at the one and only German blue King, where the Wing Car Nats 2017 for Gr. 7 cars will be held next month. The lap time, without glue on the track, was 6.7 seconds. So these cars are not only very nice, but fast as well."

He also indicated that the weight for these cars "is 180 grams minimum."


Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#33 Eddie Fleming

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 02:20 PM

Was it you, Cheater, that said "Faster is always better"?  :D
 
6.7 seconds on a King at 180 grams, and one deslot may well cost you the race. Now that is tight racing,


Eddie Fleming

#34 Cheater

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 02:37 PM

Not a chance that it was me who said that, Eddie! LOL...

Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#35 Dallas Jackson

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 02:46 PM

Can't beat that stable.



#36 Jens Scale Racing

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 03:06 PM

The body and chassis kit of the Shadow was ours - as a celebration of our (Jens-Parke) JP products 10 years existence last year. There was a limited edition series of 20 pieces and sold out very fast.

 

Most of the pics are Fein Design body kits, very detailed and perfect miniature 1/24 replicas. In competition most of the bodies were made out of glassfibre-stiffened kinda plastic. Made by hand in a mold, weight about 10 grams. To reach 50 grams minimum total weight of the body lots of weight (tungsten, lead) is needed at bottom/side of the body. Chassis of these DSC class 2 cars is about 130 grams, with carbon front axle, extreme lightweight rims and fronts, gear ratio about 12/42 with about 26mm rear tires.

 

So the race series has become more professional in the last couple of years, lots of high-tech is used and we are far away from a toy...


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#37 Howie Ursaner

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 03:19 PM

Some racers make their own carbon fiber bodies to race and sell them. They are super light and very tough. Some people design and build chassis and have them approved for racing. They run spec hand-out foam tires and handle extremely well. You drive these cars very, very hard to extract everything out of them but if you go sideways a bit, you scrub off speed and if you deslot you probably will lose the race because some drivers will not come out.

 

I personally love racing these cars. 


Howie Ursaner

#38 Benno - SAC

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 03:57 PM

Dieter, thanks for the explanations!

 

This is a good example, of how fragmented the slot car scene is in Germany. I wasn't realy aware of what they are doing there in the middle of Germany. Though I know that Dieter is very active in this scale racing scene. And just because I read the "wrong" German slot car forum (I know of three, but there are more).

 

We have all scales HO, 1/32, 1/24 (even some crazy guys building slot cars from 1/18 die-cast models). Digital and analog. Hardbody racing and vac shells. Plastic chassis and metal chassis. Chassis like Flexi-kars and chassis with bolts and nuts. On Carrera tracks classes with or without magnets (to hold the car down on the track). You can race everything you want, from "hardcore scale" (where you have to replace every broken antenna or mirror during the race) to G7. This sounds great, and if you live in the right (crowded) corner of Germany, where you have the chance to choose, it is.

 

The disadvantage (in my opinion) is, that the entry lists often are very small thereby, because we have so many classes, and everyone chooses his favorite.

 

When I started slot car racing in the '90s, we had a national slot car association and most people raced Flexi-kars. The association broke in the early 2000s. Along with the (re-)upcoming European manufacturers like Carrera, Ninco, Slot.it, etc. the Flexi-kar scene almost disappeared and we got the actual fragmented situation.

 

Nevertheless, as I learned on Slotblog, we can be glad to have such an active slot racing scene here. :)

 

And by the way, the Can-Am cars realy look awesome and I can imagine, they are a lot fun to race!


Schöne Grüße (Kind regards)

Benno Stolberg

 

www.SAC-Stolberg.de


#39 Cheater

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 04:01 PM

Benno,

 

I know there had to be Slotblog members who groaned when they read your comments about fragmentation of the slot car hobby, as I have been relentlessly banging on that drum for many years.


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Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#40 Benno - SAC

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 04:20 PM

Must be very close racing and/or slow corner work. I like the idea of it.

Many times it seems in our racing it is press beyond the limit because there is no penalty for the deslot.

 
Once a year I particpate in a NASCAR series (we invite them to our track) from Manfred Stork (here is some info, click the links to see some pictures). This series exists since the '90s without major changes of the rules. They race DIY plastic chassis with NASCAR Revell kit bodys, a Carrera 18D motor, and rubber tires.
 
The races are so close, that one or two deslots will cost you the victory. But the cars are not so fast as 16D Flexi-kars and handle very good. So you have time to react to what the car is doing. You have to keep the back of the car on a smooth line in the curves. Every slight drift costs a few car lengths. This behavior automaticaly teaches you to drive without desloting.
 
They often have races, where the first three to four drivers are within one lap. But hell, if two cars deslot in one curve, the race director (that's me on our home track) has to do a track call. At first I thought, they aren't aware that they have hands to marshal :sarcastic_hand: .
But they do it because of the disadvantage the innocent driver would have in those close races. It was a hard for me to learn this :heat: :) .


Schöne Grüße (Kind regards)

Benno Stolberg

 

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#41 Benno - SAC

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 04:35 PM

I know there had to be Slotblog members who groaned when they read your comments about fragmentation of the slot car hobby, as I have been relentlessly banging on that drum for many years.

 

Sorry, Greg, I don't understand this statement. Do you mean, you don't want the fragmentation and other members don't bother about it? :unsure:  Maybe I have to sleep about it.

 

BTW, the fragmentation is one reason I found Slotblog: there is no forum in Germany where I can ask the questions I ask here. In the German forums are few to no Flexi-kar or Eurosport racers active.

 

So, everything has its good and bad sides (as we say in Germany :) ).

 

Time for bed, good night! :)


Schöne Grüße (Kind regards)

Benno Stolberg

 

www.SAC-Stolberg.de


#42 Cheater

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 04:43 PM

Benno,

I should have said "about the damage that the participants' insistence on fragmenting into various subsets and special interest groups has done to the overall slot car hobby over the years."

And, yes, I am one of the few crazies who believes this factor has been a giant negative for the overall hobby. Actually, few seem even to understand the concept of an "overall slot car hobby."


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Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#43 bbr

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 05:47 PM

Some racers prefer to be a king in Hell rather than a servant in Heaven.


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#44 Mattb

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 06:03 PM

I appreciate the responses in this thread and the added info about the German scene. Great to see such positive stuff.

I understand the comment about the splintered slot car hobby. It is a real fact that it has helped the demise of the slot car racing hobby in America. Some guys can't accept the reality of this situation, but it is the way things are.
Matt Bishop

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#45 MSwiss

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 06:34 PM

I should have said "about the damage that the participants' insistence on fragmenting into various subsets and special interest groups has done to the overall slot car hobby over the years."

And, yes, I am one of the few crazies who believes this factor has been a giant negative for the overall hobby. Actually, few seem even to understand the concept of an "overall slot car hobby."

 

And your solution again is to make racers run the type of car they don't want to? :) :)


Mike Swiss
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder

17B West Ogden Ave Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)

Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516


#46 Cheater

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 06:46 PM

Nothing of the kind, Mike.

 

It's all about respect and tolerance for others' interests, and how the people who are involved in the hobby "grasp' what the overall hobby really is.

 

Is 'slot cars' just the 'subset' or genre a racer prefers and practices, be it HO, Flexi, Wing, Retro, 1/32, collecting, vintage, etc., etc.?

 

Or is it an extremely diverse model car racing/slot car hobby which has a place in it for everyone and every interest?

 

For the vast majority of participants in slots, it is the former, without question.

 

Numerous other hobbies and leisure-time activities have benefited from being more inclusive, more tolerant, and less judgmental. You may not agree and in fact may entirely dismiss my claims, but I do believe there is sufficient historical evidence to support my viewpoint.


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Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap


#47 MSwiss

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 06:58 PM

Sorry, but I don't see how anyone's opinion on other types of racing, no matter how over the top, negative, they might be, can dissuade anyone from participating in the form of racing they wish to.

 

IOW, if guys like Mike Fleming had any influence in slot racing, R4/10 would of been a ghost town. :laugh2: :laugh2:


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Mike Swiss
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
Five-time USRA National Champion (two G7, one G27, two G7 Senior)
Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990), eight G7 main appearances
Eight-time G7 King track single lap world record holder

17B West Ogden Ave Westmont, IL 60559, (708) 203-8003, mikeswiss86@hotmail.com (also my PayPal address)

Note: Send all USPS packages and mail to: 5858 Chase Ave., Downers Grove, IL 60516


#48 Dennis David

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 07:03 PM

Maybe it's more of a understanding/tolerance of other types of racing and the lack of a national body that is more of an issue than fragmentation. I would stop playing with slot cars if all I had was flexi cars available even though they offer more speed and bang for the buck than most others slot types. Just not my cup of tea.

Just my own personal tastes. I wish we had THIS "kind of fragmentation" then I could race with people that like the same types of cars as I do.

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#49 gc4895

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 07:39 PM

Might be the great thing about slot racing are all the flavors available. For me, all you need for a body is a single spray bomb. Bodies are there to protect the mechanicals and track while providing, in some classes, some much appreciated downforce. Others like to mess with "interiors" and stuff I don't understand. Racing is racing. All this other stuff is for those that enjoy it. Party on!
Mark Bauer

#50 Cheater

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Posted 05 April 2017 - 07:51 PM

Sorry, but I don't see how anyone's opinion on other types of racing, no matter how over the top, negative, they might be, can dissuade anyone from participating in the form of racing they wish to.


Mike,

I am really not referencing individual racers, but rather considering how slot racing is 'perceived' by the non-participating general public.

Does 'slot racing' appear on the average person's personal 'radar screen' of potential leisure-time activities (if it appears at all... which it almost never does) as one big hobby with many diverse and fascinating elements?

Or does it appear as a number of tiny unrelated hobbies involving model cars that run in slotted tracks, hobbies that are so small as to not be worth their consideration, time, or money?

You can decide which you feel it is.

I've said it before and I'll say it again (and you will probably pooh-pooh my postion again... LOL), all you have to do is to compare the history of the slot racing hobby, in all its diversity, to other silly, frivolous leisure time activities (which are generally termed hobbies). Look at which hobbies have grown and prospered and look that those which haven't. And then try to ascertain why the successful ones prospered and why the unsuccessful ones didn't.

One further point... unlike so many other hobbies and LTAs, slot racing has almost never had any entity or organization with a goal of promoting and advancing the activity itself without having as a central ulterior motive the desire to sell product. The same sitaution almost never appears in the other hobbies and LTAs that are stable, visible, and respected by the public at large.

Gregory Wells

Never forget that first place goes to the racer with the MOST laps, not the racer with the FASTEST lap






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