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Ram XL500... going... going... man, it's GONE!


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#1 dc-65x

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 07:20 PM

The title of this post came straight from this ad:

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150,000 RPM, eh? Maybe on 150,000 volts :shok: :laugh2: . But, I decided to Ram it home anyway. Here's what came new in the package from Bob's Hobbies (of eBay fame) for $7:

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Looks pretty good from this angle. Let's turn it around:

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YIKES!

What a mess! No fault of Bob's. Looks like the boys at Ram soldered the spur gear on and didn't clean up the flux. I guess they didn't expect their 150,000 RPM motor to still be unsold 40 years later:

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Here it is in pieces. I had to cut grooves on each side of the pinion for the gear puller to bite into:

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My plans called for all ball bearings, 64 pitch gears, and an epoxied and static-balanced armature:

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I changed my mind on the Ram optional gear set and decided to go with a Weldun spur and modern Sonic pinion. I ended up using a 42t spur and a 12t pinion. Since the pinion is for 2 mm armatures I opened it up to 3/32" with a taper pin reamer. A lathe would be best but I don't have one:

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The set screw boss on the Weldun spur was coming really close to the armature windings so I cut it down a bit with my hand drill and a Dremel tool. Again, a lathe would be nice:

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A file and some sandpaper finished it off:

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Next it will be time to static balance this puppy.

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#2 TSR

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 07:48 PM

Man, removing rust is my mission in life! :)

#3 Bill from NH

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 07:55 PM

Do you use something other than Coke? :lol:

#4 dc-65x

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 07:57 PM

Here's the unbalanced armature:

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First I added some more epoxy to the light factory job. I used 2-Ton epoxy and a heat gun to get it to flow:

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Here the armature is coated with epoxy. It's just sitting on top of the windings. I hit it with the heat gun a little to get it thinned out and flowing. The down side to this is it also caused the epoxy to start setting up quickly . . . so you have to work fast:

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Here it is after the heat gun. All the epoxy is suck down into the windings . . . at least a little. :D :

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The finished armature:

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It was way out of balance on the old razor blades so I started drilling holes in the heavy pole:

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Here's my setup. I do have a small secondhand milling machine. It's quite handy for this. I made a stop so the armature could be returned to the same position after checking for balance:

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I decided to use the pole pieces from an old Ram 426 I had (I don't know why really, but it seemed like a good idea at the time!). I wanted to modify them like Bob Braverman did in his Pittman 705 hop-up article. He drilled out the holes as shown in the bottom piece in the picture. This was supposed to concentrate the massive iron magnet magnetism over the armature and reduce weight. I just think it looks cool:

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I couldn't figure out an easy to hold the pole pieces in my mill without making some sort of fixture so out came the taper pin reamers again. You just use one size after the next until you're close. Then I finished the holes off with a 3/16" reamer and countersink for neatness. It only took about 5 minutes per hole:

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The reworked end plate on the left and stock on the right. The axle bearing hole was opened up to 1/4":

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The last thing to do before reassembly is change out the round head screw for a countersunk type. That way I can mount the motor lower to the track:

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I decided to solder the motor back together instead of trying to re-stake the end plates or using epoxy or Loctite. At the same time I added 3/32" tubes to both reinforce the solder joints and to serve as mounting points for my 1/16" pin tube frame:

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The finished motor:

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Now, what in the heck am I going to put it in? :D

Onward!
  • slotbaker and Gator Bob like this

Rick Thigpen
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#5 Bill from NH

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 08:09 PM

That'd look nice pushing a vintage stock car. :)

#6 BWA

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 08:21 PM

How 'bout something like this??? 8)

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Al Penrose BWA (Batchelor Without Arts, Eh!)

#7 Horsepower

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 08:52 PM

Man, the ol' Ram XL NEVER looked so good! Maybe NOW it will do 150,000 RPM! ;) :mrgreen: I worked on one of these too, but it sure doesn't look like THAT! More, please, PLEASE! :shock: :love: :up:
Don't forget to remagnetize. :think:
Gary Stelter

#8 Jairus

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 08:54 PM

Is this too new?

Posted Image

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#9 dc-65x

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 09:26 PM

Hmmmmmmmm, two lovely Lolas. :) . I've got a Mecom Lola coupe with a Tyco/Pittman sidewinder motor. The Ram ad I show is from late 1966. The #145 Lancer Lola T70 is not shown in the 1966-1/2 Auto World catalog but it would be close. The earlier Lancer Lola T70 Chevy would work. Hmmmmmmmm . . . :)

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#10 Horsepower

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 10:11 PM

Hmmmmmmmm

I think I hear the sound of 150,000 RPMs! :)
Gary Stelter

#11 Jairus

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Posted 17 December 2006 - 11:49 PM

OK, how about this 1964 Genie Ford MKX?

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8)

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#12 TSR

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Posted 18 December 2006 - 10:52 AM

Jairus,
Either body would be fine. Both were manufactured by Lancer and Revell in 1966, and so was the RAM motor. :)

#13 Carolina Rod

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 08:02 AM

Hi . . . I really enjoyed this article. I have a question . . . was this motor called the "Destroyer" back in the day?
I have one mounted on a Dynamic chassis that runs rather well at our local track. Not the best handling thing out there . . . LOL . . . but pretty fast.

Thanks,
C/Rod

#14 Bugeye

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 09:56 AM

Ok, dumb question. I have an NOS motor like this, but the axle is mounted inboard
on the motor. Does this mean it is a different motor or did someone just put the side
plates on reversed?
Thanks,
Rob Giorgi

#15 don.siegel

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 10:28 AM

Answers to the last two questions.

The "Destroyer" was the Strombecker version of this type of motor - or maybe it was the Devastator . . . they came out with both at the same time, one a copy of the Pittman or Ram motors with the integral axle and the other a laminated pole drag motor like the Pittman DC85 or Ram 850/857.

The XL-500 only came in this configuration. Ram also did a 426 with the axle through the middle, and a 426a or 222 with the axle behind like this one. Pittman did the DC704 and DC706 with the axle in the middle, but you could switch is around on the 706 to change weight distribution, at least on the 706, which is totally screwed together.

Excellent job as usual, Rick! Really a sexy looking motor. According to their ad, the 150,000 RPM was on about 23 volts - yeah, right!

Unless you want to do a scratchbuilt, these go very well with the Kemtron mono-tubular frame - I'll try to post a photo later of one of my first recreated vintage cars with this set-up. Strangely enough, my first XL500 never rusted up, but most of the later ones I got from Bob's did - maybe they were all stored in a humid basement.

Don

#16 Carolina Rod

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 11:58 AM

Thanks, Don, for that answer.

Merry Christmas!!!!

C/Rod

#17 dc-65x

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 01:14 PM

Thanks, Don. :up:

The Ram 222 you mentioned is a big beast. It uses a larger diameter armature than the 426 or XL500. It also has removable plates for the axle bearings. I should take some pictures of it. :)

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#18 don.siegel

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 05:55 PM

Well, in the meantime, you'll have to settle for these . . . a small family portrait of the sidewinder integral axle motors that gave birth to the XL500. But first, my first NOS vintage car, built about 10 years ago, when I never thought I'd find an XL500 in my lifetime . . . This started out as a simple Kemtron frame with the pivoting front axle, but I braced it more and more as it was raced!

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Now, come back with me to the origins of this whole line, the venerable Pittman DC703, where you can see the choo-choo origins. Plastic gear and a shaft about 6" long, labeled as a belt-drive conversion motor.

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Next, the DC704A, one of the first purpose-built slot car motors, along with the DC196 (and still about 6 years after Scalextric and VIP, in 1963 I believe). The hop-up hint here was of course to take the motor apart and turn the endplates around so the weight was more towards the center of the chassis! Pittman did this on the DC705, but I don't seem to have one of those babies - incroyable!

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Now, the workhorse of the line, which came out in about 1965, just in time to be obsolete! These are very nicely built, with screwed-on endplates so you can decide yourself where you want the axle (the compact version is very good for cars like the Morgan or Allard, allowing you to keep more or less a full cockpit).

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Here's the Ram DC222 that Rick mentioned earlier - yep, Ram copied everything, even the designation! - but their motors may have been a bit faster than the Pittmans. This one came with brass axle brackets to screw on to the motor. And a 7-pole armature, the only one on this type of motor.

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Another Ram, the 426A. The 426 has the axle through the middle but I don't seem to have one of those either - a scandal!

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Ram also did just about the only 1/32 sidewinder motor of the type, the cute little DC283, again with the screw on brass axle brackets.

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And now the Strombecker Devastator, a copy made in Japan, like most of their stuff.

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And one more, another favorite of Rick's I believe, since it was the basis for another 65X conversion that enjoyed a brief vogue in So-Cal pro racing, the Tyco 951 - that's the 6 volt version, the 952 was the 12 volt version - also known as the Mila Miglia Capalupo sidewinder motor!

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All for now, still working on my lighting, but have I got motors for you!

Don

#19 Pete L.

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 06:47 PM

Don,

Could you tell us what body the red car is ?

Thank you,
Pete
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#20 don.siegel

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 07:08 PM

Sure, Pete! It's a Ferrari Dino by Pactra.

Now, according to my Ferrari Fan Friends, it's not the usual Dino, of course, but a prototype made for the Geneva auto show; don't think it ever raced or went into production. It's a very wide body, and once again I'm not sure if this was per the original, or if Pactra kind of widened it - in any case it's an ideal slot car body! I mostly chose it at the time because it was one of the few vintage items I had, and I just wanted to build a car. Since then it's raced enough to go through at least one set of motor brushes, several sets of rear tires (no, they didn't wear out, I just kept trying new ones!), and a couple sets of pickup brushes.

It's easy to drive, hard to deslot and has decent speed - of course with those 150,000 RPM I had to gear it down a bit . . .

Don

#21 TSR

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 07:30 PM

Don is absolutely correct as usual, except that the car was not called "Dino". It has three seats side-by-side and is a really pretty car. Pactra did not have to widen it, it was REALLY wide. The basic shape was later used by Sergio Pinin Farina to create the famous Dino. The engine came from the Dino 246SP, a sports racer built before the road-going Dinos were devised.

1966 Pininfarina Ferrari 365 P
This wide-body prototype show car featured three-abreast seating, with the driver positioned in the center, slightly ahead of the outboard passengers. (You thought, maybe, that the McLaren F1 invented that idea?) Power came from the aluminum 2.0-liter three-carb Dino V-6.

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#22 Allan Feldman

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Posted 22 December 2006 - 02:42 PM

I agree with Don. I have the Patra Dino prototype slotcar with this body. It is not the 365P but the early 206 Dino prototype which was produced as a 1/43rd scale diecast model by Politoys. Although the front is painted the real car had a set of 6 headlights under a clear fairing (plexiglass) The car I think was a Pinninfarina design. I saw and have a 1/20th Bandai static kit of the Ferrari 365P three seater designed by Bertone. I had the privilege some years ago to see this one-off for real at Goodwood (I think the Festival of Speed or the Revival).
Regards, Allan

#23 sportblazer350

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Posted 24 December 2006 - 10:54 AM

Fantastic work on the motor rebuild!!! :shock: If I only had the talent in one of your pinkies . . . 8)

Glenn Orban
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#24 edworth

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Posted 08 January 2007 - 11:49 PM

Nice work! Is it a good idea to remagnetize that thing after pulling the plates apart?
I vote for old stocker . . .
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#25 Pete L.

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Posted 11 January 2007 - 02:30 PM

Thanks for the info, fellas !
Peter J. Linszky

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#26 Gator Bob

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Posted 13 February 2015 - 07:14 PM

You have great tools and skills Rick. Super nice motor build !

 

Help: What is the dia. and length of the XL-500 arm? 


Posted Image
                            Bob Israelite

#27 dc-65x

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Posted 13 February 2015 - 09:22 PM

Hi Bob,

 

I don't have an XL-500 apart to measure but I would think it is close to the Pittman 705/706 which is:

 

.625" diameter

1.205" long including the pinion gear or about 1.045" with out gear.

 

Interesting you should bring up this thread........I have what might be an interesting project for a RAM I've been ruminating on. :D


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#28 Gator Bob

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Posted 13 February 2015 - 10:53 PM

Thanks Rick, that is very helpful.

 

I'm thinking it would be cool under a 1964 A/Stock Automatic Galaxie XL-500 w/ Teardrop scoop of course... :D  

 

1964 Galaxie factory ASA.JPG

 


Posted Image
                            Bob Israelite

#29 hiline2

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 03:34 PM

So, was this the XL 500 kit version ?

 

http://www.ebay.com/...=item4ae79feb8f


Paul Bass

#30 dc-65x

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 04:41 PM

The RAM 222 (compared to the XL500) has a taller magnet, larger diameter armature and adjustable axle brackets. The RAM426/500XL are essentially RAM made versions of the Pittman DC705 size motor.

 

What the seller is showing in the eBay instruction sheet is the super small 1/32 scale version RAM DC-283 motor is some sort of kit form.


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#31 mdiv

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Posted 09 April 2015 - 07:14 PM

RAM K283....was available at EJ's Hobbies, not sure how many he has left.

 

This is one that I have left:

 

HPIM1045.JPG

 

Never got around to messing with them...have to wind the armature....then build a car around it...

 

possibly for trade...

 

;)

 

Mikey

 

 

PS working on this right now:

 

HPIM1026.JPG


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#32 SlotStox#53

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Posted 09 April 2015 - 07:55 PM

Cool! A build/wind it yourself kit by RAM :D

Is that a Tamiya R/C car?

#33 mdiv

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Posted 13 April 2015 - 08:44 PM

Hi Paul.

 

Don't want to drift too far from Rick's thread but yes, that is a Lunchbox chassis.

 

Might do an article in the non-slot section.

 

Mikey


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