91 replies to this topic

[rvec]

We have to accept the fact that in this day and age there are people who wouldn't know which end of a soldering iron to grab. I can't tell you how many long time racers I have to solder lead wires and pinions for. If it wasn't for the multitudes of chassis builders out there putting out quality equipment, Retro racing would not be where it is today. So instead of soldering irons and Dremel tools some have taken to nut drivers and Loctite.

Sam,

 

I agree. Different strokes for different folks. I enjoy both type of racing. I even enjoy, heaven forbid, 1/32 plastic chassis cars. In this plug an play world, patience is more than a virtue. It is almost unheard of. I want to do what I can to promote racing in our local area.

[Dennis David]

I like the plastic cars because there are so many beautiful cars available but would I prefer they were made with metal chassis? Of course but that's not always possible. ScaleAuto and now BRM come with metal chassis so that's a good thing.

 

Scratchbuilding is an art and is rightly celebrated but it's just another segment of the same hobby.

[SlotStox#53]

Have you seen those Slotfabrik cars?   Some of the machined BBS and other rims he does are out of this world. 

[Bill from NH]

I'm not familiar with Slotfabrik cars and don't believe they are raced here in the Northeast. Are these cars available in the US? I don't believe the "nut-n-bolt" chassis such as the Plafits and Scholers are being run up here either, but maybe in the NYC area. If they were, I'd have one and a better supply of Loctite.

[n9949y]

Seems the common thread here is 1/24 "hardbody." Appears little by little hardbody racing is increasing - even on commercial tracks. Is it that folk are becoming more attracted to 1/24 slot cars that look more scale model realistic?

[SlotStox#53]

Bill, I don't think the cars are directly sold over here . But they are raced & sold in Europe and I'd imagine you'd be able to buy online & ship .

[Dennis David]

Fola is on Facebook, his cars are out of this world.

https://www.facebook...89300977935745/

I agree with Todd the common denominator is hard plastic or glass fiber body. The type of chassis is really less important. We have the torsion chassis, pro-track, scratch built brass/rod chassis and bolt together chassis which all share a model kit style body. These cars are slower than flexi and retro cars but that also brings its own rewards. Many of us do race these cars on commercial tracks so the health of commercial tracks is very important to us as well though sometimes, support from the raceways is lacking.

[Dennis David]

Loctite and shoe goo, but so what? I race my Scaleauto and won my last weekly race and I still have all my mirrors. ;-)

I was just running my car today and when I switched from my 3rd Eye to my Defalco with retro module I gained .3 seconds, go figure.

Shows you need more than one controller to match them to the car I guess.

[Dennis David]

Fola is out of Germany and they are pretty "speedy" over there. As I said before German engineering applies to everything these people do. I swear it's in their DNA

LOL

[Bill from NH]

The last commercial raceway in this area closed in 2010. The club track I sometimes run at races 1/24 scale hard body cars. These are built from plastic model kits & resin bodies. The most popular classes there are jalopies & late models, but the "nut-n-bolt" cars aren't run there. The jalopy class can use scratchbuilt chassis, the late models use a mix of H&R & FCR chassis.

[Dennis David]

Sure those are the most widely available. Anyway as I said before the facet that they're scale hardbodies is what's most important. We still have four commercial tracks in our area that people race at.

[iceracer]

As someone that has a lot of experience with the "euro mechanno" type chassis, I'd like to offer some feedback.

As it relates to the cost of them, certainly they cost more than a flexi or other type of traditional slot car chassis. But they work very well for hard body slot car racing, almost out of the box. 

 

If you accounted for your time at all to build a scratch built chassis, the cost of items like the brass and piano wire, the solder, the gun, the template, etc. I believe the costs may be about the same. I can put together a euro chassis in under an hour, save for the body mount. 

 

A couple of other items that are a draw for me is that I can change my ride height, and set my gear mesh, make spring adjustments to fine tune the car to changing track conditions or different rule sets much more easily than a soldered chassis. 

 

In addition to all that, I'm just not that interested in sucking up solder fumes and all that goes with it to build a car. A lot of the younger guys, as was mentioned in another thread have no interest or knowledge of soldering a car together. 

 

Having said all that, I really appreciate the finer examples of scratch built cars, some are like jewelry.

[Dennis David]

I agree that't why I read Slotblog, to see the latest scratch built chassis.

[MSwiss]

Dennis,
As far as your theoretical Fola chassis vs. scratchbuilt, it's a pointless comparison.

Sidewinders with slow motors vs. inlines with fast ones.

Despite the higher CG you inherently have with a bolt together chassis, I still think there is a slight chance you could get comparable handling.

But as far as strength, forget it.

Rider one of those high buck model chassis into the 90 wall at Tom Thumb, at full retro speed, and I'm 99% sure it will break.

The top ones are nicely engineered, but they go slow enough to be able to use those types of material and construction.

[eshorer]

Since my car was posted in a pic above as an example of a scratchbuilt car (built by Bob Krigbaum), I get to comment! I'm racing three different racing programs: Retro, Hardbody scratchbuilt, and Farrout club 1/32 scale (Slot.it, Fly, Ninco, SCX, Racer). This means I end up carting around three sets of tools (and usually forgetting something), and doing everything sorta 2/3 assed (a bit more than 1/2 assed). Sometimes a scratchbuilt class can keep newbies out of racing, since it does take a wide range of tools in order to get setup and do well. What's important is that you enjoy what you're doing, and have people to race with. I raced in a 24 hour Enduro in Tacoma last year using BRM cars, and was just itching to try em out with better motors and tires. Other than that, I think the bolt-together chassis can run fine. 

Eddie

[MSwiss]

I think there is a U.S market for a bolt together chassis and may do one once I have other projects finished.

But I would shoot for something with more of a vintage feel to it.

The chassis pictured in the first post leave me cold.

[bbr]

do something like this Mike, high tech

 

[Samiam]

Mike,

What is that and how much does it cost as shown?

[Dennis David]

Mike I would only use the chassis and a glass fiber body. The motor and tires would be similar. We're talking hard body D3 not retro and comparing chassis. The motors I would use would be exactly the same.

We're also talking flat track and the chassis above looks like the one I would use $150 and maybe $75 for the body.

The comparison is limited to handling, not the relative merits of each class.

As I have always said I like both classes and hope to be racing retro in the coming months.

[Dennis David]

I have seen the D3 cars up close and compared to our Scaleauto cars I would say they are about 1-1/2 second faster. My slot-it car runs faster than the Scaleauto but the Scaleauto runs like it's on rails, just very heavy and under powered.

Some of it is down to the motor and some of it is down to the heavy hardbody. I would replace both and add a better handling chassis. I suspect they would run close together with the D3

[Dennis David]

My only goal is to disprove the following:

"this chassis will FAR out handle those bolt together monstrosities!!"

I think the above picture puts the latter part of the statement to rest and I just need to disprove the first part.

[MSwiss]

do something like this Mike, high tech

 

 

 

I would do something low tech, for the average, or below average guy.

 

What does the one pictured sell for?

[cdtanner]

That is one of Fola's chassis. He lists it for 120 euro, around $ 132.00 at today's rate. His website is:

http://slotfabrik.com/

[MSwiss]

Less than I would of guessed.

 

But, I guess selling direct makes it easier.

 

Thanks.

[fola]

Wow !

Interesting topic guys.

I would not really compare the two kinds of chassis directly as they are built with totally different goals in mind

and for categories that have almost nothing in common. Our "screwy" bolt on chassis are relatively expensive but taking 

into consideration the fact that all components are cnc machined with very tight tolerances, they are actually "Cheap"

design is very intense and the machining is costly.

I think the wire/scratch/hand built chassis are works of art and they definitely get the job done but as said - totally different in concept. Scale auto chassis are very basic and good for starters but performance wise nothing compared to what we build. A mass produced

commercial product aimed at the masses. To make the run properly, you have to strip them down completely and blueprint. Lots of the

parts are not straight/true and such is the performance out of the box.

Our "screwy" chassis are also fully adjustable to fit a wide range of bodies so you can use the same chassis for more than just 1 car Also the setup can be modified to suit any track/driver style with springs and variable "Play" levels.....

 

Still it would be very interesting to see how the two compare under similar conditions. - weight/dimensions.

 

Here are a few pics of some of the chassis I run

more here....  LINK

 

Enjoy  ,

Fola