111 replies to this topic

[Tim Neja]

I know we all love to blame these terrible little motors for not being able to get into the A main!  But I watched a couple of racers --one going 4.3's--and the other going 4.6's--SWAP their motors in the cars for an experiment-- and guess what??  The cars went the SAME times--4.3--and 4.6--with the OTHER cars's motor in it!!! So the car and chassis MUST have a LOT to do with how well that little junk motor can pull your car around the track!!   I was racing my "no flex" car--and it LOOKED good--and was EASY to drive---but I could NOT find where it was losing speed.  It went nearly identical times with 3 different motors!! Duran drove it--his comment was--"very smooth and easy to drive"!! But it just was lacking speed somewhere!! I ran the same gearing as Duran--same tires--car was EZ to drive--but the best I could do with it was 4.5's!! I won the "G" main and moved to the F-- but that was all this car was capable of this weekend.  I STILL had a great time racing and BSing with all the people.  Sometimes your the nail--sometimes the hammer!! BUT--these little junk motors keep our racing INEXPENSIVE!! Because actually --ALL our little slot car motors are JUNK!!! I don't want a box of 25 or 30 pro slot motors--or 25 arms to do the same thing with!! It's not perfect---the hand out TSR's--but it is what it is.> If you really hate it---run OTHER class's that you can build motors for.  This is the ONLY chassis building series in slot cars!! Race something else--- GT12's-- Euro-- etc-- and build all the motors you like!    This series is for chassis builders.  And one of the reason's I like racing it--even if my chassis didn't work as well as I liked--I learned what I'll build next!!

Thanks SCRRA for holding a very FUN race and I believe MOST racers had a fun time!!! It's like Bryan said--"ya can't please everyone all the time"!  Nice seeing all the racers that were there. HOpe to see you again soon!!
T

[Duffy]

I was racing my "no flex" car--and it LOOKED good--and was EASY to drive---but I could NOT find where it was losing speed.  It went nearly identical times with 3 different motors!! Duran drove it--his comment was--"very smooth and easy to drive"!! But it just was lacking speed somewhere!! I ran the same gearing as Duran--same tires--car was EZ to drive--but the best I could do with it was 4.5's!!

Glad to see this posted. To me, it states a disconnect that a whole lot of us have about our cars - we don't see them as extensions of US, sharing in our responsibility for our performance but not totally at fault.

Rocky Russo used to hammer away at this point: "Drive the car YOU are comfortable with driving, even when it isn't the fastest car you can drive; you'll do more laps when you're comfortable than you will if you wear yourself out over-driving a jackrabbit."

I wonder, Tim, what you'd do driving Duran's car on that same session. Any one driver will find a car and set-up that he's comfortable with, and a large part of the comfort is in the driver. We've said this a lot: copying what The Hot Guy has won't necessarily get you into The Hot Guy's podium.

I regularly hand my cars to guys better than me, just to make sure I'm doing it right. If they're happy with the car & tell me it's .4 sec. faster than I am, fine; and finer still if I am in tune with it and don't have to hang on the edge of my consciousness to keep it in the slot.

Maybe that's a point that bears repeating now & again, just to keep it in mind.

Duf

[Tom Eatherly]

Hmmm, words to ponder. Comfortable car. OSCAR!! Where's that VanPeenan car!

[The Bugman]

Hmmm, words to ponder. Comfortable car. OSCAR!! Where's that VanPeenan car!

im dusting it and my Hanada off,,gettin em ready,,,,,lol

[bbr]

Duf, good point, drivers are different... one needs to setup a car to their own driving style.

[MrWeiler]

I had a great time! Even though I had a slow motor I was able to win my main at the last second. Very sorry I had to leave early and give up on my move-up and bail on my marshaling task but I was having medical problems and feeling real bad. (The Dr. changed my Rx the day before and it was having the opposite effect from intended result.) Thanks to Jeff E for the help for me and Big Chris and the loan of a real nice car! Thanks to the organizers and trackowners for a good show! Mike

[Jason Holmes]

Jonathan,

You are right, John Gorski's motor did go up in SMOKE after running 21-1/2 heats Like he said when it went 3 heats short of a Happy Meal. Oh well and he went away with a smile on his face.

Jonathan, you might as well give up for every one person that does not like the way thing are being done with the motors 20 do so thing will stay the same.

Jason

Don't get me wrong, I would love to build some PDs to run in a race in SoCal but right now he it does not look like it will happen any time soon. I do love to build HP as you know and have used for many years that you have raced out of my box.

[Tom Eatherly]

Jonathan, you ran 4.44 and 4.50 in Can-Am qualifying. Its on the sheets to look at. You and a bunch of others had good and CLOSE motors, look at the times. If you had a bad week-end of racing, forget about it and move on.

[Tim Neja]

Hey leave Johathan alone--he's a GREAT racer--and enjoys lot's of slot racing!  He's entitled to his opinion--he doesn't like the cheapo little junk motors--and there's reasons to not like them>  We've just decided that the positive's outweigh the negative's to this kind of racing!  There's a LOT of slot class's to build motors in---this is just not one of them.  Love it or hate it---lot's of people still thinks its FUN!!!

This west retro racing is for chassis building--that's where the emphasis is and should stay--- hand out motors are FAIR--just a crap shoot for every race!  For me--it's part of what I LIKE about it.  For others--it's frustrating.  Enjoy it while we can--it's helping to keep BPR open for slot racing.  Happy New Year

[Tom Eatherly]

Thats pretty much what I said.

[TSR]

The power as measured several times with a meter across the controller leads was 12.5 to 12.8.

The top times were 1/10th slower from the records established a year ago with "retro pro" power, meaning 13.6 to 13.8, that burned some of the motors.

At 12.5 to 12.8, the motors live and go almost as fast.

Most of us are quite happy with that situation.

Jonathan, you are a good racer, we are sorry that you did not do as well as you wished, but hey, join the club. My F1 car was the fastest in the last SCRRA race but was unable to do anything good with the track conditions we had on these unusually cold days. Do you hear me bitching and moaning?

My motors weren't the greatest either, so what? Is there a scale that should apply, and selected racers should get the better ones?

It is the nature of the beast. One day, you win, the next day, you get your behind spanked, by chance.

I still hope that you will be back, we like racing with you.

[Gary Donahoe]

I very much enjoyed my experience at the Checkpoint race. I’m good with the hand out motor program, the track power, and most everything else that a few were publicly critical of. I wanted to race well and produce a good result but more important it was great to get to hang out with so many talented slot racers from around the country.

Special thanks to Haruki and Kamo-san and congratulations to Duran and Alex. It is very admirable that they both race with such dignity, courtesy, intensity, skill, and graciousness. They can be counted on to be fantastic turn marshalls and Alex is a super race director. The world would be a better place if there were more Durans and Alexes.

[Jason Holmes]

I do have one thing that I didn't like for the race... I think I got a cold from shaking so many hands but oh well four days and things will be better
 
Jason
 
See you again on the 26th.

[MrWeiler]

Two words - biohazard suit.

[jimht]

Uh, just a comment... it's been said over and over that Retro is about chassis building with severe motor restrictions.
 
This doesn't mean building for the fastest motor, it means building for the available motor.
 
If the variations in the motors are unavoidable, a chassis builder would approach the race with more than one chassis...
 
And the chassis variations would address the motor issue.

[TSR]

Jim,

USRA Flexi-racing refugees are generally not brass & wire chassis builders... old pharts like us are.

I think that Jonathan is a bit frustrated here, and I am confident that he will get over it.

[jimht]

OK, Phil, I'll rephrase it:

 

If the variations in the motors are unavoidable, a chassis builder/buyer would approach the race with more than one chassis...
 
And the chassis variations would address the motor issue.

 

(Although, given the prices some of this jewelry sells for, I do understand why someone would consider buying motors by the dozen as an alternative.

But really, what's more valuable in a chassis focused program, chassis or motors?).

[Zippity]

There have been no comments yet about the "incorrect" rubber being chosen

[Slotgeezer]

I rarely post here, anymore...

Most everyone knows ' why '...

But, I felt compelled to add a few thoughts...

Zippity is right, in my case... After preparing 5 race cars for team-mates & friends, I tested my car...

Ran okay, but didn't have big enough rear tires...

Okay, change-out the tires, clean 'em, & go test 'em to make sure they work...

Ooops ...   ... "Jeff, we need your car for tech... NOW! " ...

Okay, the tires feel okay, I kept the car in a zip-lock bag, so the tires from the tire tube should be good...

WRONG! ... Anyone who saw my car during qualifying could see how badly it needed clean or better rear tires...

Pretty embarrassing, but rather than pitch a fit about not having one car out of 6 properly prepared, I qualified dead-last, & ran in my " I " race... Yes, I cleaned the tires & the car was better after they warmed-up...

Obviously, I won't try to work on so many cars the next time...

So... I worked for two weeks to be the slowest qualifier... That's the way it goes, huh? ...
Life isn't always fair... I wish I could drive like Mill, Bryan, Alex, & Duran...
Ain't gonna happen... My driving skill on the King...well, ... It's marginal, on a good day... 

So, I take my lumps, just like I always do...

Support the raceway, visit w/ my friends, & have fun... Anything else that proves successful is gravy...

Thanks to the SCRRA board, the racers who attended, & to Jim & Debby for providing us w/ a great venue...

& a HUGE ' Thank You ' to Greg Carter, for his tireless work making sure we had an accurate timing system in-place for the weekend's races...

See everyone at the next big race...

Take care, everyone... & good racing! 

 

 

Jeff Easterly  

Team Zombie West chassis butcher...

 

[NJ SpeedZone]

Sorry to say this [and did not effect my good time at all] But you Have power issues.When the power fluctuates so greatly with such low amp drawing motors THERE is a problem.Address it make it right and I think the motor complaints might go away.The power on Saturday in practice fluctuated from 9.8 to 13.6.This is unacceptable.Even when the power was adjusted to a higher than normal max.With 8 cars on the track it was losing a full volt,This leads to surging and cars coming off for no reason.Like I said I had a great time.Even with Cukras trying to hose me sat.Night I still had a great time.Thanks for all the hospitality and friendship. Jay Kisling

[TSR]

Jay,

There are of course two systems on the King track. One is a power pack delivering 12.8 volts (for F1 and Can Am races), the other a set of batteries and a charger delivering 13.6 volts for the Retro Pro cars.

 

We, the racers, do not own the raceway and this was a question of no maintenance: the power pack's fans became clogged by dirt that had accumulated over one year and it overheated, which reduces its output from the set voltage down to a "fail-safe" 8 volts, until it cools and resets itself.
Once cleaned by BPR's Greg Carter with the air hose, the power was stable for the rest of the event as far as I know. This of course SHOULD have been done on a regular basis but since there were no issues since the first time we HAD such an issue when the pack became too hot due to its original on-ground location, nearly a year ago, and once that was solved by raising it, no one paid any attention to it.
This issue, now caused by an accumulation of sucked-in dirt, HAD to happen during a big event of course... pure bad luck in this case.

 

We ran 11 monthly events since the first time it "failed", with zero issue. This was something new, and obviously the raceway management must keep those fans clean from now on.

[bbr]

the power supply needs a fan on it and vented, where it is located now does not allow good cooling, jmo. 

[Tim Neja]

Oh yeah--fortunately we DID find the problem with the plugged up fans!! And there wasn't the power surges we experienced in the "G" main that I was running when it happened. In the middle of the race we went down to 9.4 volts at the start of one of our heats!! But once they gave the power supply a "blow job"-- it seemed to handle the rest of the races well!!

[Zippity]

Ain't it wonderful what a little blow job can do for yer??    

[redbackspyder]

Not having a fan blowing air on this power supply is just wrong, it can not hurt anything.... We HAVE had issues with the power supply, despite what Philippe may say.   Certain people can not keep their G.Damn hands off the voltage switch, and it keeps changing the power.   A fan should always be on this thing, it should be cleaned and maintained, and smart people have known that this power supply is inadequate for what we need.  This is fact.   But, that said, we have what we have......

 

I have talked to at least 6 people who are expert in the power supply field, and they all told me that what we have is not sufficient for the peak draw that these motors pull as a load.   We have had only a few problems, but we have had them.  It was unfortunate that at the biggest race of the year, no one looked at the power supply to check to see if it was cleaned.   Fault the raceway,  they have to maintain something.  Next time, I am sure a better job will be done.