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My Checkpoint Cup experience


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#76 Rick

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 11:27 PM

I am afraid that there is truth in that. What "we", retro racers, have been trying to do because of the power issues we had before, not counting the power trip on which the former series tyrant was on, is to insulate ourselves from that very mess. What we have now is what Barney Poynor and Yours Truly engineered and paid for out of our own pockets, a suitable power pack delivering 50 amps at the CORRECT voltage to run our frozen-spec motors. All eight cars on track with full spike (at the start of a race or a segment) have always failed to trip the power supply into fail-safe mode, so please don't come and tell me that there is not enough current.
 

The issues encountered have actually been very minor:

1/ The A-holes that keep screwing with the voltage knob (you know who you are). It is 12.8, no more, no less, LEAVE THE DAMN THING ALONE, thanks.

2/ The location of the pack in a place where it sucks all the raceway's dust, and we learned that the hard way last Saturday.

 

There were issues a year ago when we installed it: in one race the pack went into "safe mode" (heating up too much) from 12.8 to 8 volts. This lasted a few seconds during a race, then it cooled itself and the power went back up. We then put a fan on front of it and did not have another problem in that event. It showed that it needed a better environment.

Then, some guys tried to run G27 cars without switching the power and I heard it described like the entire world had collapsed. After kindly educating the racers that there is a switch under the track to turn on their favored higher voltage and current, that was the end of that ruckus.
 

Later, the pack was mounted on a higher base to provide better ventilation, and for an entire year of SCRRA racing, not a SINGLE incident I am aware of.

 

Then, we had the incident last Saturday, due to the build-up of dust in the venting holes, meaning that the pack did not get its required cooling. It lasted the whole of 15 seconds (and everyone had the same reduction in speed so it is not like it was a catastrophe), and the raceway maintenance gentleman came with an air hose and blew the dust away. There was to my knowledge, no issue after that.

These were the only incidents we had, and it is of course unfortunate that the pack chose that day to act instead of in a monthly race. Please note that this pack has been "on" for over 365 days, day in and day out, without ANY actual failure after it was inspected last year after the first incident when it went in fail-safe mode. I would call that a good proof of reliability.

 

So before everyone bitches and moans about that power pack, think of it this way:

1/ Our little motors have been in use of nearly 7 years now and are closer in performance than the more expensive and more sophisticated ones used by the "other" series. Not my saying but that of many ("other series") racers on my email all the time. We do not have Hershman Specials here.

2/ They LOVE 12.8 volts, they HATE 13.6 volts and AC leakage. It means that at the recommended voltage, they LIVE longer and lose about 1/10th of a second on a 4.2-second lap. Crying babies speed-crazed morons, go race your Flexis and leave us to race our antiquated machinery, thank you.

3/ The VERY few incidents we had with this pack are a learning experience, and we now know what to do time to time: keep the thing clean and for big events, a small fan could be added for extra insurance.

4/ If you have a better solution, pay for it with your own money and I will be pleased to take this thing back home with me.

Got it?

 

Thank you.

P, there's not enough amperage.............:) 


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#77 parko061

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 11:56 PM

Foamy,

I agree with you.

But look at the amount of hours you guys are running with out any power supply behind the batteries.

Non amp suckers or not the power is taking a hit.
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#78 TSR

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 12:07 AM

Robert, the Retro cars (Can Am and F1) are not using the batteries... only the Retro Pro cars do. So the batteries are not "taking a hit" since when the RP power is on, the charger is also on.

 

Rick, if we did not "have enough amps", how is it that we ran 24 monthly races and had not a single issue?

There was NO issue other than a simple clean up from accumulated dust, that took a minute or so. All it tells us is that we have to make sure that the pack is kept clean in the future.
 

We now have the closest racing EVER, regardless of classes entered, in the past 40 years. It is becoming very difficult to even make an "A" race unless you really raise your game.

I can only see a positive in there. Yes, there were a few issues, but only of organization and maintenance. The racing is great, the power is fine.

Hard to comment on stuff if you weren't there anyway, since you really do not know what happened...


Philippe de Lespinay


#79 Rick

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 12:54 AM

I made no comment on what happened, don't know, don't care. I was answering that 50 amp supply is simply not enough to have on tap. Here is an easy check for you put a 60 gram weight on the shaft of one of the motors on your analizer and check the amp draw when you start from zero and up and down on the voltage knob. Just to humor me, try that test, Bryan can make you a 60 gram weight with .078 hole in it....................

 

I have viewed first hand a track drop almost a volt when 8 retro cars were running on a 75 amp supply.

 

Rule for power on slot track: Better to have and not need then to need and not have.

 

PS: I was not dissing your event or any of the races, sorry you took it so personally.


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#80 JerseyJohn

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 08:27 AM

I'm here to say that Jersey John has got the SO-Cal love. Talk about a guy who really knows how to take in an event, thats JJ.

It was great meeting ya John, and ALL the East coast guys. JJ, you know you have a permanent pit place at BPR. Me, Oscar and Greg will see to that. Can't thank you enough for your help and friendship John. We ruled!!

Tom You are my SoCal guru of peace Brother 


 

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#81 TSR

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 10:00 AM

Rick, I do not take anything personally. If I did, I would not race slot cars for some fun, I have plenty of other things to do. :)

 

I was answering that 50 amp supply is simply not enough to have on tap.

 

I am sorry Rick, but your contention does not match reality. We have NO POWER PROBLEM, and did not since we have installed that power pack. If we DID have a problem, it would have been replaced a long time ago.

The ONLY problem is that of maintenance of the raceway's flooring, that can get quite dirty. Simply the accumulation of thousands of tires flying rubber as it wears caused the tiny issue we had ONCE in an entire year.

This 50-Amp power pack is totally adequate for our needs, and unlike the previously used batteries + charger/pack, keeps the motors cool enough for them to be able to see another day or days.

But, thank you for your concern.


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#82 redbackspyder

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 04:00 PM

I have been told that everything that I posted was wrong. Therefore, everything was okay at the track, I apologise for saying what I said. 

 

Everyone had a great time at the Parma Checkpoint Cup.

 

I will be looking forward to all the future races.  Mill


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#83 Jason Holmes

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 04:25 PM

Mill

You didn't say what everyone has been thinking ;). keep it all or buy 1 150amp A/C filtered 13v power so we all can be Very Happy


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#84 Dennis David

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 05:56 PM

150amp A/C filtered 13v power supply 

 

Got a URL for something appropriate?


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#85 TSR

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 06:03 PM

HERE YOU GO.


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#86 Dennis David

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 06:06 PM

Yes and the local townsfolk would complain of dimming lights every time Tesla ran it.


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#87 DCR

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 06:44 PM

Wow TSR, a Testla Tower,now that would be better then Solar Panels on the roof to charge the track!......Someone call Obama!
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#88 TSR

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 07:00 PM

This reminds me of an experience we had a few years back in Phoenix, racing 1/32 scale cars with Slot.It V12 motors on a 90' 8-lane wooden track. The "V12" motors draw exactly the same amount of current as do the TSR "D3" motors, a shade over 1 amp at 12 volts. The races went fine with absolutely no surge and no power issues of any kind.
The power? A 20-amp Pyramid DC job set at 13 volts. 

Now we have a much better quality, 50-Amp supply and that's not enough? Would a 150-amp supply have stopped the dust from accumulating in its vents?


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#89 DCR

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 10:39 PM

....Maybe they need self-cleaning reversible fans?..
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#90 redbackspyder

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 02:32 AM

Philippe, Greg has told me that fans were blowing on the power supply the entire time.  He should know.  Therefore, dust could not have blocked the vents.   At this point, it does not matter. 

 

The Track says everything is fine, therefore, everyone come out next Saturday for the King Track Race @ BPR.   Another chance on the BPR King, and come join the second week of February for the next Flat Track Race.   


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#91 JerseyJohn

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 09:07 AM

Give them hell Mill..looking for you in the podium ...........JJ


 

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#92 TSR

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 09:30 AM

Philippe, Greg has told me that fans were blowing on the power supply the entire time.  He should know.  Therefore, dust could not have blocked the vents.

 

Mill,

Of course the twin fans were blowing all the time. Their function is to suck air inside the pack. But the vents in which they were supposed to suck cool air were clogged. Once Craig used the pressured air to unblock them (which took all of what, 2 minutes?), the pack immediately cooled off, normal breathing was restored and there were no more problems. for the rest of the day and the day after, as there had been no such problem in one year, since the first incident took place.

It does not matter if the pack had 1-amp or 3000, the same would have happened when the accumulated dirt blocked the venting holes...


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#93 redbackspyder

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 01:32 PM

John, I apologised to the track, to the SCRRA, I obviously know NOTHING about which I comment. 

 

I am going to just race, keep my opinions to myself, and let the others that are much brighter and smarter than I am run things. 

 

Philippe and Cukras have it all in hand, I am just a troublemaker, as I have been told......  

 

Time to go to Facebook, where all comments are welcome....


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Mill Conroy
 

AKA : TWO LAP CONROY, Anointed Trigger Monkey by Mike Swiss

 

Deal me life's toughest cards, without chance for hope nor fame, just let me play this one last hand, and I'll win this whole damn game.

Second Most Interesting Man in the World.


#94 HarV Wallbanger III

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 03:15 PM

I wish we could just run RP power (75 amp power supply across the batteries) for the "toothbrush" motors as they do it back east but .....It seems that racers out here want the motors to last a little longer.

 

It would have been nice to buy a larger power supply but that was more $$ then I or Dokk could spend and the track could not afford to buy anything bigger. If I could have found a 100+ amp supply for close to the same $$ I would have bought it.


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#95 Jason Holmes

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 04:06 PM

to all

still think it would be the smart thing to have a back-up at the track if 1 goes down and not just hope we don't have a problem even if we by a 2nd power supply of the same kind it's there no worries

Mill keep on speaking some needs to

Jason

#96 Jason Holmes

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 04:10 PM

Dok

that means in all most 100yrs it should cost 250$$$ and be about 14"x18" perfect size


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#97 S.O. Watt

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:14 PM

My Race Engineer has been put on notice for failures in all the races I competed in. The wrong weight balance on the new Coupe car in its 1st race, the wrong tyre selection in 1/32 and Can-Am. But he really blew it when I raced the F1 with the bent axle.......

Still had a great time and learned a lot yet again. Who says ya can't teach an old dog.

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#98 bbr

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 10:01 PM

Philippe and Cukras have it all in hand

i thought PDL was not on the BOA, and just a peasant like the rest of us?


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#99 Dennis David

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 11:26 PM

More of a serf ...

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#100 TSR

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 11:27 PM

i thought PDL was not on the BOA, and just a peasant like the rest of us?

 

I am not on the BoA and am just a racer like everyone else. I volunteered to do tech, but that is all.


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