286 replies to this topic

[Jairus]

I don't think there are rules excluding orange tires from the proxy.... but those didn't come about until the late 60's or early 70's I believe.

Wish Rick and Steve would post more specific rules...

[dc-65x]

We'll be running our 1966 technology cars on a modern high gloss track surface. Pablo and I actually discussed using Riggen vintage orange rubber to try and find a happy medium of traction vs tilting. Grey and black rubber is most period Korrect. But modern black rubber is pretty sticky stuff and fresh vintage grey rubber is not the easiest thing to find.

 

We already have the original R&C rules. What builders may need isn't more "rules" but help with appropriate part and design choices. For example, I don't see any guide stops in use in the race report pictures.

 

Builders need to study the race reports and tech sheets. If you don't see a design element you're thinking of using you should ask about it. Then post pictures or a list of the parts you're thinking of using for a quick review for period Korrectness.

[Pablo]

Jairus, I didn't know what year orange rubber came out until you told us today thanks for the info .  dc-65x suggested orange rubber as a means to make this skinny lightweight M2B car manageable, and even offered to supply me with some.  I had one pair left that has been on my shelf for years. They are very old, dry, and hard.  I assumed they would be kosher for this proxy, but if not, please correct me now.  Plenty of time to make it right; I have a gallon of lacquer thinner and a new bottle of 3M #80 spray adhesive  

Jairus, I respectfully disagree with your opinion that more specific rules are needed.  The way I read Steve's rules, the penalty for "inkorrect" parts is simply negative peer pressure.  I personally consider that plenty specific enough for what we are doing here.  I'm sure he carefully considered how he wanted this venue to play out.  That's just an opinion, and I'm jus' talkin'  

 

Now, where did I put that doggone grey colored Rit dye ?

[Jairus]

Oh please do not mistake me for a rule monger Paul.
I just re-read the rules and they seem to NOT be sticklers for period correct parts if unavailable... just the technology of modern design.
The Orange rubber of those tires is probably close to perfect. As would a set of SBR tires trued up to vintage standards.

I am personally going with a set of vintage grey rubber I managed to score on ebay cheap because they were an off brand (Martex).
But I also have some SBR black that I can use in testing just incase.
And I plan to test test test!

Keep up the great work Paul!

[dc-65x]

......... dc-65x suggested orange rubber as a means to make this skinny lightweight M2B car manageable, and even offered to supply me with some.  I had one pair left that has been on my shelf for years. They are very old, dry, and hard.  I assumed they would be kosher for this proxy, but if not, please correct me now.  Plenty of time to make it right; I have a gallon of lacquer thinner and a new bottle of 3M #80 spray adhesive

 

Pablo, Rodney has suggested entrants supply a couple of different tires with their cars. How about the firm orange rubber and another pair of modern black???

[Pablo]

I'm glad we agree, then, Jairus

Thanks for reminding me, Rick, I should do that.   But I'll bet these orange tires will work fine with the Okeefe arm Mabuchi, now that I'm back on track laying ROD rails on a new chassis.  Sidebar:  en-route to a race, at a Cracker Barrel for breakfast, I mentioned in conversation to a famous scale racer (who goes back to 1966) I had recently built a tube chassis that was an evil handler that I intended to scrap and change to solid rod.  His response, quote, "Yeah, I know, those never worked" end quote. Just the facts, I'm not condemning all tube chassis, just sayin', mine was the worst chassis I've ever built.  I'm going back to what I know for a fact, works. No more playing around.

[SlotStox#53]

Always loved that orange sponge color   Should look good on the car   Hopefully the "tube" chassis ev1L handling doesn't apply to wider sports/GT Coupes with multiple tube rails  

 

*Note to self* must get couple more sets of rear Riggen repops for the extra sets of modern rubber..

[Pablo]

On the subject of evil handling F1 chassis, this story may interest you, Paul E.
Last weekend at an IRRA race, my F1 car was hopping like a bunny rabbit upon acceleration.  Race time was coming up and I needed to fix this car quick.. ....I started replacing parts in a frenzy...parts I knew darn well were perfect because I always check and double check my stuff before I leave home .......wheels were trued, axle was checked on my dial indicator, gears were good, but I replaced them one by one, and tested.  Nothing helped.  Eventually it became obvious the chassis was simply too flexible and the rails were acting like a leafspring....I soldered in a new pair of main rail wires and instantly the car handled perfect !  Smooth acceleration, no more hop.  Jay Guard's F1 had exactly the same issue.  He stiffened his chassis up a little and it smoothed right out.  Lesson learned, and, note to self:  Hillclimb track at Speed Zone does not like a flexible F1 chassis !  
Back to the task at hand, my little 1966 GP car.  I'm going to stiffen the rails right in front of the motor bracket.

Further forward, the rails can flex all they want for all I care.....I think Mike Steube would approve.....

[SlotStox#53]

Very interesting info & advice especially as both you and Jay were having the same issue!! amazing how different tracks require flex or not ... Lesson learned both with this GP car and your Retro F1... build on Sir

 

Definitely transfer that knowledge to the tube chassis Porsche, no easy flex there ! Or the GP car (which is all solid rod, tried bending tubing and it didn't go well this time ) Plus with the heavy Pittcan motors... all good.

[Pablo]

Stronger, heavier, wider, more redundant, and more bracing than the tubing chassis.  Hopefully it won't be too stiff for a flat track    Probably the strongest Russkit motor box I've ever built.  It's going to be a workhorse R & C race car, so don't look for prettiness here because you won't find much.

[SlotStox#53]

Looks strong & tough Pablo   Russkit bracket most definitely well braced!!!!

[n.elmholt]

 

Paul, you could also make a brace like this

 

Niels, DK

[Pablo]

I see that, Niels   That is exactly the type of brace that would correct a chassis that was too flexible near the bracket.  Where were you when I needed you last Saturday in Peachtree City, Georgia, USA ??

[Hworth08]

Niels's brace is exactly what we sometimes did in the old days. A frame triangulated in such a manner CAN NOT flex inside the triangle. It may break a solder joint but till then it won't flex!

[Pablo]

Hopefully this one works better than the first   Track test 7 June.

Middle drop arm piece is wire which goes into the Classic weight hole, and the outer pieces are rods.

Hinge is .065 OD stainless steel hypodermic needle tube.

The ends of the rods where they attach to the flag weight are the flag stops.

WB 4" GL 27/32

 

[SlotStox#53]

Oh that came out superb Pablo

Looks really sweet, the drop arm construction is a nice touch

[Bill from NH]

Pablo, that chassis came out looking very nice! I like you flags stops. They give me something to think about, should I ever build another brass rod chassis. Are you using jail-door sized tires on this car?

[Jairus]

Mmmmmm... I like that one very much!      
Bet it handles 100% better. 

[Pablo]

Bill, the fronts are 7/8, rears are 15/16.  Thanks Jairus

I almost forgot the finishing touch.....after a couple Long Island Iced Teas, my engraving skills really improved

 

[Bill from NH]

Maybe next time you'll do the engraving on one of the rods.  

[SlotStox#53]

Maybe next time you'll do the engraving on one of the rods.  

think that will take 3 drinks to pull that one off !

The plaque looks great Pablo

[Bill from NH]

He said his engraving skills had really improved!

 

I still use an old Dremel variable-speed  engraver. When I want to write small & neat, I turn the speed control down to the slowest setting & hold the engraver by its engraving point, rather than by the plastic case.

[Pablo]

I like my iced tea idea much better   

[Pablo]

Heavier, stronger, stiffer chassis, Okeefe arm, and less grippy donuts.

Ready for track test #2:

[Jairus]

Very nice and period Paul!  Looks like it'll run well, so keep us apprised.