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R&C 36D Sports - GT Car


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#51 dc-65x

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 06:40 PM

Looking forward to more from Team Pittman Paul. :good:

 

I decided to go with the 5th GT race for this car. I can make a heavier chassis to try and handle the 36D torque monster motor. Here's the rest of the chassis setup in my Rick's Jig:

 

36DSportsCar43.jpg

 

This fantastic jig's pins are aligning:

 

Chassis center section

Outer piano wire rails

Forward piano wire cross brace/drop arm up stop

Forward body mount pin tube

Drop arm pivot tube

Rear body mount pin tube

 

I'm going to have to build a chassis in a Russkit Adjust-O-Jig just to realize how lucky we are to have the R-Geo jig.

 

Anywho, I decided to use piano wire on the outer rails after SteveO vetted it for his R&C build. I'm worried about the big motor's torque:

 

36DSportsCar44.jpg

 

The outriggers for the body mounts will go on after I trim the mount tubes to fit the curved sides of the body:

 

36DSportsCar42.jpg

 

Drop arm time........


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#52 Pablo

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 08:16 PM

The Perfect Battlewagon. Nobody will dare get within 5 feet of this car out on the track

Paul Wolcott


#53 SlotStox#53

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 08:45 PM

The Perfect Battlewagon. Nobody will dare get within 5 feet of this car out on the track

Certainly looks intimidating/strong enough! :shok: :good:

 

Should be able to handle the big block torque & size! Definitely an interesting race/test report round your hillclimb track ahead Rick , look forward with interest to hear how this puppy runs .



#54 dc-65x

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 08:45 PM

Yeah, can you imagine this thing coming at you on the inside as you enter the bank. :o

 

Hmmmm......I should fill all the surface of the rails with solder. :crazy:


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#55 dc-65x

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 05:40 PM

I used my Rick's jig to put the drop arm together:

 

36DSportsCar46.jpg

 

The 10-32 stud up front locates the guide tube..........

 

36DSportsCar48.jpg

 

......and with the drop arm rails left long, 2 pins in the rear align it with the frame:

 

36DSportsCar47.jpg

 

The finished arm:

 

36DSportsCar45-1.jpg

 

And the finished chassis with the body mount's trimmed to length and the outriggers added:

 

36DSportsCar49.jpg

 

36DSportsCar51.jpg

 

 


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#56 Mark H

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 06:04 PM

Cool chassis Rick! i sure need me one of them Ricks jigs!


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#57 SlotStox#53

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 06:17 PM

Yep... that should be able to handle the 36D ! Came out pretty darn well Rick :good:



#58 dc-65x

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 07:27 PM

Yup, the Rick's jig is great piece for sure. I have a lot of fun using it.


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#59 Bill from NH

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 08:17 PM

Beautiful chassis Rick! I see several design elements I may borrow for some future builds.


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#60 Pablo

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 08:22 PM

Simply amazing.
(Emoticons don't work from my work computer <G>)

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#61 Hworth08

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 08:26 PM

To be honest I didn't think much of the frame while it was coming together. After it's finished I like it quite a bit! The frame seemed too heavy for the period but a progressive racer could well have thought mass was necessary for the 36er.

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#62 dc-65x

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 09:27 PM

I'm liking the frame now too but I also was a bit underwhelmed at first. When it was just 3 brass rails per side it was WAY weak. I thought the 36D might twist it into a pretzel.

 

I decided to beef it up using Mike Morrissey's heavy weight cars from the 5th R&C race as my guide to "Korrectness". Then I remember SteveO's vetted use of piano wire. Now the thing is nice and strong. I even decided it was stiff enough to cut out the center of the front body mount pin tube above the drop arm....that will allow more room on the drop arm for weights. :laugh2:


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#63 Steve Okeefe

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Posted 19 November 2013 - 01:54 PM

Rick,

 

I think you are very much on the right track but you still have, incredible as it might seem, period-korrekt precedent to increase the weight even further!  Check out this Mike Morrissey column from the January, 1967 issue of Car Model (which actually went on-sale around the middle of December, 1966):

 

6701 CM Morrissey Column.jpg

 

An eighteen (1/16" tube) main rail (what we would now call a "9 rail") chassis, plus eight 1/16" brass rods in the drop arm!  And this for a car with a 16D motor!  Yikes!  :shok:

 

Based on the simple engineering study I did, brass tube weighs about 2/3 (actually 66%) of brass rod.  So, 9 rails of 1/16" brass tube weighs about the same as 6 rails of 1/16" brass rod.

 

Discounting the small weight difference between brass rod and piano wire, you have the equivalent (by weight) of a four brass rod main rail chassis there.

 

From an appearance standpoint, you could add another five (!!) main rails on each side, or from a weight standpoint, you could add another two (brass rod) rails on each side and still be historically accurate!  :good:

 

This reminds me of Carroll Shelby stuffing a Twin Paxton Supercharger Ford 427 V-8 into a 2,000 pound AC Ace and then saying "Do you think this weighs enough to be controllable?"  Ask Bill Cosby...

 

Just a little something to consider...  :popcorm1:  :D


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#64 dc-65x

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Posted 19 November 2013 - 05:15 PM

Thanks for the Morrissey column Steve, neat stuff.

 

I hate cars that tilt.......we'll see how this one behaves and I'll pile on the weight if needed.

 

Tomorrow it's supposed to stop raining and I can paint the motor can. I don't have good luck painting when it's cold and damp even if I heat the paint can and part to be painted...........


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#65 dc-65x

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 01:28 PM

Here's where I left off with the "might 36D motor":
 

Here's the motor bits I'm going to put together........unless I change my mind  :crazy:  :
 
36DSportsCar25.jpg
 
I'm going with the French armature kit with brushes and springs. The wire in the springs is .002" thicker than some Simco "hop up" springs I was going to use. The setup is a Cox 250. The brush holders and pent roof hoods are Champion 707 as are the ARCO magnets.
 
If I don't get lazy, I'll paint the can white and add the French stickers :) .

 

Now that the chassis is built, I finished the motor. Painting the can was painful. I washed the paint off 3 times before I got it just "OK". It hasn't gotten out of the 30's here in a week. :shok:

 

I wasn't happy with the way the Champion magnets and shim fit in the can. I've heard PdL talk about this before. There was too much of a gap between the top of the magnets and the can and the magnets weren't centered in the can.

 

I had some extra Champion shims so I cut 2 in half and made a set of top and bottom shims. Here they are with a couple of vent holes added and all "buffed up":

 

36DSportsCar65.jpg

 

Here's the finished motor as it might have appeared from the French Motor Company's "Performance Center".....if that ever existed :crazy:

 

36DSportsCar62.jpg

 

This version has French's optional "Srew-Lok Can Drive Mount":

 

36DSportsCar63.jpg

 

The motor doesn't buzz up as impressively as I would have thought. I guess it's supposed to be all about torque with 36D's. The air gap is pretty tight at about .007" per side. The magnets guass reading is 580 on my meter. French 16D and Hemi magnets gauss about 500.

 

Time to assemble the roller and test it...........


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#66 SlotStox#53

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 01:50 PM

Motor looks really sweet Rick :good: :D That white paint is so crisp & clean .  Love what you did making the top & bottom shims just like the late Champion 2 piece 16D shim.. the twin cooling holes makes it look faster!!



#67 Pablo

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 02:47 PM

Are the house lights gonna dim and the heater groan when this monster hits the track ? :laugh2:


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#68 dc-65x

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 09:52 PM

With the motor done I need to track test the car....or as Rodney would say, "See it move".

 

Wheel, tire and insert time. For front tires I'm running the darling of the R&C series, K&B hard vinyl fronts:

 

36DSportsCar54.jpg

 

They were epoxied onto Russkit set screw fronts and trued just enough to get them round. They ended up just under 15/16".

 

For wheel inserts I'm using some resin cast Russkit inserts, Riggen knock-off's for 1/16" axles and some 2-56 allen screws to attach them to the inserts:

 

36DSportsCar61.jpg

 

The wheel inserts get drilled.........

 

36DSportsCar58.jpg

 

.........and tapped 2-56:

 

36DSportsCar59.jpg

 

Same goes for the knock-off's. A Riggen knock-off wrench worked great to hold them during drilling.....

 

36DSportsCar55.jpg

 

.........and tapping:

 

36DSportsCar57.jpg

 

Here's the finished wheel, tire and insert package:

 

36DSportsCar66.jpg

 

Almost done :)


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#69 SlotStox#53

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 10:28 PM

Nice wheels Rick :D They are gonna look good under the GT40 , very good indeed :good: Any ideas on color yet for the shell?



#70 dc-65x

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 02:06 PM

More goodies to hang on the car.

 

Cox 9T 16D pinion reamed out to .0905" for the 36D:

 

36DSportsCar30.jpg

 

Weldun aluminum 35T crown gear. These are super light and mesh really well. I wonder why they didn't catch on?

 

36DSportsCar60.jpg

 

Oilite's instead of ball bearings this time:

 

36DSportsCar52.jpg

 

Cox quick change guide:

 

36DSportsCar53.jpg

 

And..........BAM!

 

36DSportsCar69.jpg

 

36DSportsCar67.jpg

 

36DSportsCar68.jpg


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#71 Gator Bob

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 03:01 PM

Perfect ! :good:


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#72 TSR

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 03:13 PM

Is there a word above "perfect"? If so, it should describe this piece of jewelry.


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#73 Pablo

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 04:25 PM

Muy Macho :D 


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#74 SlotStox#53

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 06:05 PM

Just ..... WOW...... that is all :good: :D Carry on!



#75 dc-65x

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 09:27 PM

I like this thing too. The big motor looks right at home in a Pro style frame. I know they ultimately weren't competitive with the 16D's but it's a fun project.

 

My first testing was very encouraging. The motor runs strong, cool and has amazing brakes. With my controllers brakes set on full the car will lock up the rear wheels and do the sideways crab slide braking for the turns. :shok:

 

The handling is surprising too. No tilting but I think my track surface is a bit slick. I'm going to clean the track with Naphtha and mix up a new batch of spray glue. At Eddie's road course a couple of my R&C cars tilted with modern tires. They ran fine with vintage VC tires but with the modern rubber it was tilt city.

 

I need to try and duplicate that level of grip on my track...........


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