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1967 Car Model magazine series sports car build


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#51 Martin

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 12:32 AM

"So these parts came onto the market right about the time anglewinders were making them obsolete."

 

Steve to the rescue. Thanks for the research.

It must have been frustrating for the manufactures, they just get tooled up and get ads printed, then those damn speed racers come up with something new and make our stuff obsolete.

I wonder if the major players just got worn out chasing the development curve. Champion gave it a good run,and made some great products.


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#52 Steve Okeefe

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 08:28 AM

Martin,

 

You wrote: "It must have been frustrating for the manufactures, they just get tooled up and get ads printed, then those damn speed racers come up with something new and make our stuff obsolete."

 

It was a very real problem, and for many manufacturers quite a bit more than just frustrating.

 

But Rick is building an early 1967 car, from a time before almost all of this.

 

Personally, I'm waiting to see if he is going to use brass rod instead of tube for his chassis main rails.

 

1/16" brass tube main rails are so... 1966  :laugh2:



#53 dc-65x

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 09:11 AM

 

Personally, I'm waiting to see if he is going to use brass rod instead of tube for his chassis main rails.

 

1/16" brass tube main rails are so... 1966  :laugh2:

 

Yup, I've finished bending all 8 brass rod main rails and cutting off the excess length. I just need to finish deburring the cut ends.

 

Back in the day I would have left them long and cut them all at once after soldering and then filed the ends flat. Now I like the look of a nice little 45 degree chamfer filed on the ends of the rails before I solder them up. :dance3:


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#54 Martin

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 11:50 AM

I get the time line here, rod good. :)  I left them long, made it easier for me to get the angles correct and gave me something to hold while soldering. Then a clip and a file as you did "back in the day"

Looking forward to seeing your progress. :good:


Martin Windmill

#55 dc-65x

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 04:46 PM

The chassis pieces are ready to go:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2023.jpg

 

In 1967 I used a Russkit Adjust-O-Jig to build with. It was the best I had available......not to mention I didn't know any better. I thought about using the Russkit jig for this build but you know what........I don't want to. It wouldn't be any fun and this is a hobby that I'm doing for fun.

 

I'm interested in having the finished car be a nice period parts "Korrect" tribute to the original. And I want to have fun building it. This is my fun:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2022.jpg

 

As a machinist it was all about "the set-up". Hours of set-up and 10 minutes to cut the part. My jig set up has pins to locate front and rear axles, all 8 rails, the drop arm pivot, front and rear body mounts and the drop arm up stop.

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2024.jpg

 

Let the soldering begin  :crazy:


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#56 endbelldrive

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 04:58 PM

 

Yup, I've finished bending all 8 brass rod main rails and cutting off the excess length. I just need to finish deburring the cut ends.

 

Back in the day I would have left them long and cut them all at once after soldering and then filed the ends flat. Now I like the look of a nice little 45 degree chamfer filed on the ends of the rails before I solder them up. :dance3:

Yessiree...except for the filing the ends flat part.  It was a bit of a challenge to do that without nicking the frame after a couple of hours inhaling solder and flux. :scratch_one-s_head:  BTW,  I used Bryan Warmack's frame as a guide back in the day.  Steve Okeefe did a schematic of the Warmack frame awhile back.


Bob Suzuki


#57 dc-65x

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 05:49 PM

Hi Bob,

 

Here is the frame with the soldering done....it took about an hour to tack the joints then go back and touch them all again with more heat and flux to smooth them up:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2025.jpg


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#58 dc-65x

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 08:35 PM

The frame is trimmed out, motor bracket braces installed and all buffed up:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2027.jpg

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2026.jpg

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2028.jpg

 

I need to trim out the body and get the wheels and tires trimmed. Then I can set up the width and angle for the body outriggers..........


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#59 Pablo

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 09:06 PM

:heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :D


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#60 Steve Okeefe

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Posted 15 May 2018 - 09:14 PM

Rick,

 

Fine craftsmanship and exacting historical accuracy.  :good:

 

It is clear that this archetype design has Mike Morrissey and Team Russkit written all over it.



#61 dc-65x

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Posted 16 May 2018 - 08:48 PM

Thanks Pablo and Steve. :)

 

Here's more progress:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2029.jpg

 

Progress!  :shok:  Well sort of.

 

I tried something and when I looked at the closeup pictures I just didn't like it. I used rather long gentle bends to mate the narrow setup inner rails to the wider Russkit bracket. They look OK in person but in the closeup pictures they just look like sloppy bent up rails:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2028a.jpg

 

So anything a scratch builder builds can be cut out and rebuilt. Even though I tried to very carefully cut out the offending rails I still managed to nick an adjacent one so it got cut out too.  :dash2:

 

All's well that ends well. :crazy:  Now I have a very small little kink at the end of the rail:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2031.jpg

 

Next it's drop arm time...........


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#62 Steve Okeefe

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Posted 16 May 2018 - 10:35 PM

Now the chassis has Rick Thigpen written all over it too!  That little adaptation shall be known henceforth as the "Thigpen Kink".  For what it's worth, I like it better than the longer gentle bend.  :good:

 

Continuing from post 60, I am always curious about chassis architecture; notwithstanding the state of the art, why did the builder choose to configure it the way they did instead of some other way?

 

In the case of this early 1967 chassis, Mike Morrissey's basic design approach is on full display; note how the heaviest part of the chassis (the motor) is closer to the center of the chassis and there are no partial rails at the back (to add weight).

 

Morrissey was a big believer in low polar moment, which is to say having the mass (independent of the CG) concentrated near the geometric center.

 

The belief was that this improved handling the same way full-size mid-engine cars worked better than front engine cars (a popular trend in the full-size racing world in the mid 60's), and you can clearly see it in this chassis architecture.

 

Unfortunately, slot car handling does not work the same as in full-size cars; the guide does the steering, not the front wheels, and in normal operation the car can only over-steer.

 

Years of chassis design development has demonstrated that what would otherwise be known as high polar moment is more desirable (in a slot racer), so the mass has migrated away from the center, while the overall CG has remained almost unchanged.

 

Four rail, five rail or six rail drop arm?  :scratch_one-s_head:



#63 dc-65x

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Posted 18 May 2018 - 08:08 PM

Thanks for your insight Steve :D
 

Four rail, five rail or six rail drop arm?  :scratch_one-s_head:

 

I started out with 4 rails...........

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2035.jpg

 

...........added the pivot tube........

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2034.jpg

 

.........then rails 5 and 6 along with a 6 gram weight:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2033.jpg

 

I decided to make use of the 4-40 tapped hole in the drop arm weight. I drill a 1/16" hole in the set screw and soldered in a piece of brass rod for a drop arm down stop:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2032.jpg

 

The buffed up drop arm:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2037.jpg

 

The center rails are "bird mouthed" for a tight fit to the guide tube and a generous amount of solder strengthens things:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2038.jpg

 

How the drop arm fits the chassis:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2039.jpg

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2040.jpg

 

Wheels and tires are next..........


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#64 SlotStox#53

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Posted 18 May 2018 - 08:16 PM

Stunning chassis Rick :heart:

Love the guide stop idea! Out of curiosity is that thick wall tubing for the guide?

#65 dc-65x

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Posted 18 May 2018 - 08:20 PM

Hi Paul,

 

It's just 7/32" tube so 1/64" wall. I don't remember using anything thicker.......but I don't remember lots of things!   :crazy:


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#66 SlotStox#53

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Posted 18 May 2018 - 09:35 PM

Hi Paul,
 
It's just 7/32" tube so 1/64" wall. I don't remember using anything thicker.......but I don't remember lots of things!   :crazy:


Thanks, I just remember either yourself or Steve using thick wall tubing on one or more of your Rod N Custom cars.

#67 Bill from NH

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Posted 18 May 2018 - 10:20 PM

.Love the guide stop idea! Out of curiosity is that thick wall tubing for the guide?

 

I wonder if a hollow setscrew couldn't also be used too. I'll have to dig one out & see how it fits on some rod & piano wire.


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#68 stoo23

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Posted 18 May 2018 - 11:36 PM

Hi all,.. Whilst often enjoying looking at the various 'builds' of cars of the earlier Era 'posted' on here by 'Rick' and other members, I WAS (in this particular instance), quite amazed to see some pictures of the Real car that I knew and had actually seen racing myself, when much younger.

 

It belonged to a reasonably successful and prominent Melbourne racer and owner of "Porsche Cars Australia" (a company started by his father and importers of Porsche cars), Alan Hamilton.

 

As a slight 'Aside', (with particular reference to one of the photos 'posted' by Rick), I was actually a spectator at the actual event the photo was taken at (as a Keen 12 year old motor sport fan) and may even have a very Bad photo of the car myself, (taken with my trusty Kodak Instamatic,..lol).

 

post-11-0-84636200-1525121421.jpg

 

This photo is from the (Sadly No longer existing) Warwick Farm circuit in western Sydney and I would have been spectating from somewhere to the right of this 'shot',.. :)

 

Alan Hamilton whilst perhaps obviously often and usually racing Porsche's of varying types and models, also had a quite successful and varied racing history in Sedans and open wheel cars particularly F5000. An overview/interview can be found here; https://www.speedcaf...amilton-part-1/

 

Whilst Not particularly 'relevant' to This Car or build, in the above link, there is a wonderful photo taken when the WEC came to race at Sandown in Melbourne in 1984, (for which Alan provided Housing and Workshop space for Many of the teams in His Factory space nearby the circuit), showing a few of the 956's making their way along 'Dandenong Rd' heading to the Track, from the Workshops nearby, that I thought you all might like,.. :)

 

porsche-299x299.jpg

 

I have also found some Other Local 'Time-Warp' pics of that 'Particular' 906 of Alan's that may be of interest, which I can 'post' if you are interested, but don't want to 'De-Rail' the 'Thread'.

Apologies for This slight 'Diversion',.. :),.. Nice build btw.

 

Cheers,

Stewart


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#69 dc-65x

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Posted 19 May 2018 - 12:31 PM

Hi Stewart,

 

Thanks for the interesting information on that 906. Love the picture of 956's cruising down the highway. :)


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#70 dc-65x

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Posted 19 May 2018 - 08:34 PM

Here are the parts to finish off the mechanicals of the build. Most things I have are loose without any packaging. But when I do have things in a package it's fun to show them:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2016.jpg

 

Here are the loose parts I pulled for the build:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%201.jpg

 

The rear wheels are Steve Okeefe and my repop Russkits and I used a single Alpha humongous wonder rubber donut cut in half for tires:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2041.jpg

 

The fronts are also our Russkit repop wheels with the Pro's favorite K&B hard vinyl tires:

 

CM%20Trophy%20Car%2042.jpg

 

Both the front and rear tires were ground to 7/8" diameter.

 

Now I have to get the body successfully trimmed (there is no second chance) so I can finalize the body mount tube length and solder on the single outriggers.........


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#71 Pablo

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Posted 19 May 2018 - 09:23 PM

Awesome, as always, Capt. Rick :sun_bespectacled:

I enjoy seeing the parts in packages, it's genuine eye candy :dance3:

 

What do you use to secure the K & B front tires to the rims?


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#72 dc-65x

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Posted 20 May 2018 - 09:49 AM

Thanks Pablo.

 

I used Klenk's....... :crazy: .......I mean Devcon epoxy. I use the slow drying stuff so I have plenty of time to line up the tires on the rims before grinding and clean off any excess epoxy with a cotton swab and acetone.


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#73 Steve Okeefe

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Posted 20 May 2018 - 10:47 AM

Thanks, I just remember either yourself or Steve using thick wall tubing on one or more of your Rod N Custom cars.

 

Paul,

 

That was me.  I'm inclined to use the thick wall tubing for two reasons:

 

1. It's clearly stronger.

 

2. It adds a bit of weight in a place where it's good to have a bit of weight.

 

 

Rick,

 

Couldn't help but notice that your finished drop arm (with the down stop through the set screw):

 

Drop Arm with Gun Turret.png

 

Bears a certain resemblance to a well known Civil War era warship:

 

U.S.S Monitor.jpg

 

I'm weird,  :crazy:  I know, but I see things like that. :pardon:

 

The chassis is coming along very nicely, and those fronts are going to sound like bowling balls rolling down the main straight - I love it!  :good:


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#74 dc-65x

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Posted 20 May 2018 - 11:26 AM

:D

 

tank.jpg

 

I couldn't help myself.............I kept thinking I should be able to do something with that tapped hole in the guide weight.......


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#75 Pablo

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Posted 20 May 2018 - 01:23 PM

I can hear him aligning it before soldering - "Weps, Bridge. Come 2 mils left and 0.5 degrees up, fire for effect" :aggressive: :ph34r:


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