92 replies to this topic

[Lone Wolf]

I know Scott has some insanely rare one off pieces like that clear Cuc etc.

 

I was wondering what you guys think is the 3 rarest production slot cars. Cars that the general public could have bought off the shelf if they were in the right place at the right time, not prototypes etc. I imagine there might be an International car or two in there.

 

Lastly, Which of these type of cars have so far eluded your grasp.

[MattD]

I'm not Scott or PDL, can I answer?

[Tim Neja]

Why not?

[Martin]

Go for it Matt.  You are well qualified. IMO.  

[MattD]

1      MPC    Dodge   (if it was ever built at all)

2      International "Furious Fiat"  or the  "A Bomb" I've never seen an "A Bomb"

3      BZ Chap 2E on that list, but I think we've seen 15 or more of them surface the last few years

4      International Taxi, maybe 10-15 have shown up, probably closer to 10.  Piranha could be  in here, but I don't like it, so I'll leave it out.

 

       I'm not sure which  is rarer 3 or 4.    There may be something else I am overlooking.   The more info added the better.

[bradblohm]

Good list Matt.  Steve Daro said that he saw a boxed MPC Dodge Coronet YEARS ago, and if any were made beyond mock-up they're going to be here in Detroit.

 

My addition would be the K&B Ford Mk II.  Haven't seen or heard about many of them over the years.  I know the LASCM has one boxed, and I've got one boxed, but...

[MSwiss]

http://slotblog.net/...ction-slot-car/

[MattD]

K&B Ford GT, I missed that one.    I've seen about 3 for sale,  Isn't there another car in the same series?    

 

If Steve said he saw a boxed Dodge, I would believe that.   Could be a prototype like the car in the magazines, maybe a couple were done, who knows. 

 

 

I guess a couple of those very late Pactra cars (dune buggy, Ford GT Mk4, Lotus, there were a couple of those might be in here somewhere.  Not sure about them, I think  they may have  been out there and nobody realized just what they were.   Many of those kind of cars had bodies replaced  years ago and they ended up as nothing special to most collectors.

 

I think we have discussed MPC  67 GTO convertibles before, not sure how far they got into any kind of production.   Interesting.

 

I'll add this since Mike posted about the Pactra Ford.   I mentioned in that thread that the frame  looked like something  by a good builder back in the day and that they may be out there and nobody realized what they originally came as.   A few days later I found the exact same frame in one of my boxes.   I had no idea it was  from a "rare" car.   I  got a Dune Buggy body from Gene for that frame, but I have since switched it to the Ford body, which fits the fame better.

[TSR]

Matt "rang my bell" to ask me if I could put my 5 cents in here (inflation, 2 cents is not what they used to be!  )

Of course such a list is dynamic because of new discoveries on a regular basis. At this time, let me try to sort it out as I see it. First of course, all hand built cars are not "rare", they are "unique". Hence the finest of the hand built cars CANNOT be in such a list, that should only regard cars  that were commercially produced and available to the public. 
So let me give it a go... and see if we can agree on a proper list.

One last thing: "Euro" cars cannot be included in this list for two reasons: first, our expertise is limited in their production quantity, and second, the truly rare ones are actually not that rare! 

Please note that only complete kits and RTR are listed, and that the MPC Dodge "Ramcharger" and 1/32 scale Iso Grifo, Dynamic RTR Mustang and Cobra, IMC Lola T70 and several Pactra cars such as the Ferrari 330P4 and the so-called "Banana Car" among others are not because never issued to the public.
Please note that almost all the truly rare models were produced in the 1/24 scale. Most cars listed that can be sometimes found "loose" are assumed in this listing, to be intact inside their original packaging.

1/ Precision "Series 2" (advertised as "Custom Slot Car Products) "Pacesetter Lola T70" and "Pacer Lotus 30" RTRs.
2/ Cyclonic "Tornado" Lola GT  RTR
3/ Unique "Mako Shark RTR
4/ Dugan Lola T70 & Lotus 30 RTRs
5/ Gar-Vic "Lunar" in boxed kit form
6/ International "Furious Fiat"  RTR
7/ BZ Chaparral 2E RTR
8/ Lindberg Porsche 906 kit
9/ Monogram McLaren Elva in kit form with painted vacuum formed body
10/ Pactra "Meyers Manx" dune buggy RTR
11/ Pactra Ford MkIV & BRP-Ford Indy car RTRs
12/ Calex Chaparral 2F kit
13/ Classic "Stinger Roadster" kit
14/ K&B Ford MkII RTR in box
13/ Testor 1966 "Harrison-Ford" Indy car RTR in box
14/ Testor Honda F1 RTR in metallic green color (boxed or even loose)
15/ Competition BRP-Ford Indy car RTR (boxed or even loose)

This listing is a tough one because only one example of several of the model shown above is know to exist... hence the numbering is difficult. 

Please note that I have not listed here, rare kits such as the Champion Ford Galaxie, bagged Strombecker kits such as the 1/32 scale Lotus 38 or Brabham Hawk or similar, because "post classic" items.
Which other models do you think you would like to add?
I would be happy to post pictures of any of the above if questions arise.
 

[MattD]

Picked up this one a few weeks ago

 

and this one, late issue Monogram Lola

 

Several of these have come thru 

 

I think there was a boxed "Precision" car on ebay a few weeks back.   I don't remember anymore about it.

 

I did have Dugan Toronado I sold a few weeks ago.  All the  Dugan cars were low production.

 

P you mentioned the green Testors Honda, you didn't mean the Lola T90 did you?

 

I enjoy discussing the old stuff and what does turn up here and there andmakes us change out thinking.

 

 

 

 

[TSR]

 

you mentioned the green Testors Honda, you didn't mean the Lola T90 did you?

 

No,the Testor green Lola is not rare. The Honda is. Very.





The Monogram LolaT70 RTR is not rare. Seen plenty of them over the years, loose or boxed.

 

 

[MattD]

I like green!!

[Martin]

Just when I thought I had restored a rare car.

More green for you Matt.Thanks for your help on this one.

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[MattD]

That came out really nice.     One of these days a body or car will turn up.    

 

I was able to come up with this.

 

 

[Martin]

Love the Duck Tail Indy cars.

How about this VERY rare Blue Harrison Special.

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[TSR]

Martin,
your "very rare" Harrison is actually rather common, it is a Champion RTR car featuring a body that Champion purchased in quantities from Pactra. Pactra and Testor shared certain bodies are all were manufactured by Stormer in the San Fernando valley, north of Los Angeles.

The actual rare car is this one (please note that the car is fully decaled, unlike the models later assembled for liquidation by REH):



A loose body,  or loose chassis, or bodies purchased by another company to assemble RTR cars, cannot be associated with a truly rare example of a factory-built RTR model. Champion purchased bodies from multiple sources: Russkit, Revell, Pactra...

Here is another one of these Champion RTR cars, that are all over the place now within collections the world over:



That it shares its body with the rare Testor model does not make it rare. 
 

[Martin]

Thanks Philippe, I had not realized my Blue Harrison Specials was a Champion assembled car. I actually thought it was built from parts by a customer.

I was joking about being rare. But happy to see another in the box "Ready to win"

[Dave Crevie]

Just out of curiosity, Doc, were all the Pactra bodies that were used on RTRs available separately and unpainted? I used a lot of Pactra bodies back in

the day, and still have some. I'll have to look to see what they are. 

[TSR]

Dave,
as far as we have been able to assert, most or all of the Pactra bodies, some of them also used on Testor models, were available unpainted. A quantity of them were also available painted, some of them in "deluxe" versions with painted details and decals applied. There were also special versions painted gold with black fogging. All the Pactra bodies were supplied by Stormer, a company purchased by Pactra in 1964. When Stormer closed their doors in late 1966, Pactra purchased bodies from Lancer.

Some of the bodies used by Testor (especially their early models) were never marketed by Pactra, as they came from another (unknown) source: the Honda F1, Mirage-Olds, Plymouth-Hemi, Alfa Romeo SS, XVR, Ford hot rod "high boy" and "Terror truck" were not made by Stormer, hence not available from Pactra.

One last precision: the bodies used by Pactra and Testor on their RTR cars were never sold separately in the same color schemes.

Yes, it is a bit complicated...

[MattD]

Martin, I thought your car was a customer built car!    We learn something every day.     Like the green Testors Lola, the metallic colors look great.

 

 

 

With home made  decals

[don.siegel]

I actually found the Calex Chaparral 2F here in France about 20 years ago, listed in a collector's magazine - bought it by mail, assembled and painted it, and later sold it for about what I had paid for it. The Calex Chappy was just a collection of parts: Lancer body, Dynamic chassis and motor, etc. But it was sold in its own plastic box, with a cardboard liner.... 

 

Still have the Precision Pacer Lotus... and I also have a Lancer McLaren M8A RTR - that's got to be kind of rare! 

 

The Champion cars may not be all that scarce, but the boxes are! They don't seem to have been saved nearly as much as the better looking boxes by Cox & Co. 

 

What about the Adam & Sons Quad Mk1 and Mk2? No, not super rare, but out of several hundreds sold (to be confirmed by Mark Mattei), how many have actually survived - maybe 40 or 50? Same class as the Scalextric Bugatti... 

 

I wouldn't consider rare colors as rare production cars - just makes it too complicated, and then you also get into tints and shades... 

 

Don 

[TSR]

 

I actually found the Calex Chaparral 2F here in France about 20 years ago, listed in a collector's magazine

Well Don, how many have you seen before or since? 
And it was a genuine kit, that was quite popular in its days. So how many survived (I am talking intact and boxed, because it would be easy to build one from parts, not the same thing).

Like your "Pacer" Lotus, beside the boxed example that surfaced, no one had ever seen an example. That makes two examples, TWO... and I can speculate than less than 20 (and likely far less) still exist out there...

The three known boxed BZ Chaparral 2E only exist because the french distributor (Chahian) received a case of 12 samples, and those were disseminated only to few people. Recall that one person had six of the twelve, only one retaining its box. The other found was the sole example in the possession of the former owner. Add the single example found in the US, add the 8 to 10 incomplete and hacked bodies or cars that have appeared (and promptly disappeared) and you have a fairly rare model there. How many have surfaced over the past 4 years after that little avalanche of discovery? ZERO.

Yes, the Lancer RTR cars are quite rare (the most commonly found apparently being the Lotus type 49 F1 RTR), but I have limited my scope to kits and RTRs produced in the true "Classic Era" and the lancer RTRs are in some way, similar to the Auto World "Pro Kits", today ultra rare but outside the scope of this study I think. Otherwise I know of quite a few 1969 Riggen and Champion cars that are very difficult to find...

As far as colors, as long as  cars or kits were marketed inside a production box with a production label, I have to include them... the case for the Testor green Honda F1 and the '66 Harrison-Ford illustrate this, as they are genuine production RTRs. The same applies to the Competition BRP-Ford, that came in its own box in the metallic blue color (and none other so far), and has to be included as a true rarity.

Maybe we should do several listings...

Regardless, I have to reshuffle my listing as my order is a bit incorrect if rarity is THE factor.  

 

[MattD]

All good stuff.   A lot of the very limited stuff is beyond what most of us have seen or even heard of.    But  we all learn a bit.

[TSR]

Matt, in fact it is a curse and a blessing at the same time: because a vast majority of slot car enthusiasts or eBay buyers have never seen such models, the rarest ones often went/go for cheap money. As knowledge increases, so do prices...
Think that I paid 65 bucks for the mint Pactra Meyers Manx, and so far, only ONE factory correctly painted body with the white styrene interior, not even a complete car, has been seen.
Some chassis have surfaced since, about a dozen or so, but always fitted with an unrelated body. No one likes sand buggies I guess, of the bodies got demolished and replaced by Can-Am jobs from other companies.
The Unique Mako, that to this day is the sole example known, cost a couple hundreds. The Stinger Roadster kit, still to this day the sole known intact example, sold for a paltry $173.00 from an online catalogue in Seattle. 

Other rare cars came dear... real expensive. But the museum needed it, so it had to cough up for it.

 

[MattD]

Philippe I bought that first BZ 2E for under $100.    it just looked like something home made to most guys.   That is the car you started the SB thread on. 

 

 After the Dune Buggy thread, I found that chassis in a a box of parts. I  agree that  lots of semi rare items like that are just "parts" to most collectors.  Most of us have never seen such rarities and are not aware of them.    

 

Still just old toys, but the collecting side of slot cars is enjoyable  thru discussions like this.     Most questions  could be solved, somewhat, with a good book showing most of these  rarities and  low production items.    I got an OK from my banks loan department to buy  such a book when it is released!!!!!

 

I guess 80% or more of the 60's commercial slot cars are gone and the later 67-69 era factory stuff was probably  recycled thru REH into something else. 

We can be sure we'll never run out of the ultra rare Classic Manta Ray.    I just saw one listed the other day and it was the rare orange color!