105 replies to this topic

[Tampabay racer]

Show me 1 person that used the retro eagle last season!

Reasons the Roadrunner should be legal.
1- like Brandon said, it would simplify tech. It would save time in tech as only 1 pinion would be used 14.
2- its cheaper than the CR 102. Its about $2.00 less expensive


No reason to keep the retro eagle as NO ONE uses it anyway. Why is everyone stuck on the 102?
The roadrunner is still produced by Mid America, as the retro eagle.

[Tampabay racer]

If keeping everything simplified this thing. Why are there so many different bodies on the list as to we used to have 3?

[Tampabay racer]

That Kelly body is a damn GTP body. Wow. No where near the same as the Mid America Mustang or the rtr.


Some people still use the retro eagle? Name 1 that still uses it?????

Waiting.

[Bucky]

Has anyone tested the Kelly body against the MA and RTR? Is it faster than the legal bodies from last year?

[Wizard Of Iz]

Has anyone tested the Kelly body against the MA and RTR? Is it faster than the legal bodies from last year?

 

Yes.  Marcus has tested all three.  He said that the Kelly is not any better nor any worse on any given day.  

 

My guess is that, like now, there are tracks where different drivers will find different bodies to their liking.

 

 

Sometimes I think the ISRA guys have the right idea where some (all?) of their classes allow just one body.

[Tampabay racer]

With that spoiler its not any better. Now how can that be? Look at it. If thats legal why not allow us to use the Mid america corvette? Its got the same wing on the back. I cant post the pic here from my phone.

[Tampabay racer]

Crickets about who uses the retro eagle. I figured this would happen.

[Wizard Of Iz]

Show me 1 person that used the retro eagle last season!

Reasons the Roadrunner should be legal.
1- like Brandon said, it would simplify tech. It would save time in tech as only 1 pinion would be used 14.
2- its cheaper than the CR 102. Its about $2.00 less expensive


No reason to keep the retro eagle as NO ONE uses it anyway. Why is everyone stuck on the 102?
The roadrunner is still produced by Mid America, as the retro eagle.

 

I can only go by what Ed said at the meeting. 

 

Neither you nor I know if it was used or not as neither of us teched - or even looked at - every entry.

 

 

 

If keeping everything simplified this thing. Why are there so many different bodies on the list as to we used to have 3?

 

 

Considering how little the O/S and Red Fox are used - in reality - it's still a 3 body class.  Mid-America, RTR, and Kelly.

 

LMP is - in reality - just the RTR Orca, Kelly LMP, and Mid-America Toyota.  I only saw a couple of Mid-America Porsches on the track this year.

 

And, GTP is - in reality - just the RTR Viking, Kelly GTP, and now the RTR Revolution.   I think you're the only person that I saw use the Mid-America GTP body as most racers found it less effective due to being a little shorter than the others.  Does Roger make a GTP body that is closer in length to the RTR and Kelly?

 

 

 

That Kelly body is a damn GTP body. Wow. No where near the same as the Mid America Mustang or the rtr.


Some people still use the retro eagle? Name 1 that still uses it?????

Waiting.

 

I don't think the rear wing on the Kelly is much different than the wing on the Red Fox body.  

 

Relax ... Again ... neither of us teched or looked at EVERY car.  If Ed says he has guys using the Retro Eagle, I have to take his word for it.  Call him and ask him.

 

I give you credit .... you're a staunch supporter of your sponsor.  I hope they appreciate your commitment.  Something tells me if the Roadrunner was called the "JK Buzzard" there wouldn't be the same level of passion.

[Wizard Of Iz]

Crickets about who uses the retro eagle. I figured this would happen.

 

Hey ... There are going to be some more crickets because I have other stuff to do this afternoon.  As I said before ... you should call Ed and ask him who all he saw using it because I didn't tech cars.  

 

I know Eddie/Nathan had one in a car (or two?) early in the season.  No idea whether they made it into a race or not.  I'd guess, not. 

[Tampabay racer]

Rolling,,, in no way am I bitching at you. Im posting this to speak my mind. Ill be much more clear on this post.


Ed, if the board whats it to be more simple why keep the retro eagle, it takes a 13 tooth pinion? I cant be the only one to understand this issue. If the road runner is legal then we all would be forced to use a 14 tooth pinion on every car.

Ed, if its up to the racers to which motor to buy. I am 100% positive 95% of us racers would choose to buy the road runner if they are the same speed since its $2.00 less expensive or more.

Ed, who uses retro eagles in the Florida State Races? Oh maybe the guys that only race at your track that borrow your car. Not one person that follows the series uses the retro eagle. AGAIN NOT ONE PERSON. Keeping that motor in our series makes as much since as trying to nail jello to a tree.

[Wizard Of Iz]

Rolling,,, in no way am I bitching at you. Im posting this to speak my mind. Ill be much more clear on this post.


Ed, if the board whats it to be more simple why keep the retro eagle, it takes a 13 tooth pinion? I cant be the only one to understand this issue. If the road runner is legal then we all would be forced to use a 14 tooth pinion on every car.

Ed, if its up to the racers to which motor to buy. I am 100% positive 95% of us racers would choose to buy the road runner if they are the same speed since its $2.00 less expensive or more.

Ed, who uses retro eagles in the Florida State Races? Oh maybe the guys that only race at your track that borrow your car. Not one person that follows the series uses the retro eagle. AGAIN NOT ONE PERSON. Keeping that motor in our series makes as much since as trying to nail jello to a tree.

No worries. Though I am starting to see what Dale has gone through. BTW ,,, Dale and I truly don’t vote. I’m just sharing what happened. From my sales career, I learned that confrontation is rarely the best way to get someone to do what you want them to do.


There’s some good points here and I’ll bring them to Ed, Marcus, and Joe. Those guys are smarter than us and stay off of the internet. But give them a chance before you run your (and my) blood pressure up.

[Tampabay racer]

Rollin,,, another valid point is on the roadrunner we dont have to cut the shaft. The stack in the shaft has been moved to stop having to cut the shaft from hitting the tire. Thats thanks to me for mentioning that to Roger.

[Hot Slots]

The wing on the Kelly Body is aggressive, the only thing that might keep Mid America Mustang Competitive is the lower roof line, it's pretty low compared to the RTR. The Mid America body has the smallest rear spoiler of the 3 but the lower roof makes its it more aero.

I dont understand why the Road Runner wasnt added to the motors and the Retro Eagle dropped being nobody uses it. Nothing wrong with beating a dead horse.

Im pretty sure one of the posts said something about simplifying the rules, only having 1 pinion size sure would have helped with that. 🔨 🐎.

[dalek]

A few months ago, Marcus gave me a Road Runner to try out.  I geared it 14/35, raced it at P-1 and found that the lap times were typical of a 102. 

 

But that was only one motor.  

 

In regard to Ed's and Marcus's decision to not adopt the Road Runner just yet, Marcus said he's heard that some racers (I don't know from what area(s) of the country) have said that the Road Runners haven't been as consistent, one to the next, as the 102's have been.

 

That's all I know about it.

[Hot Slots]

The rule changes haven't been bad for the season. I'm sure the track owners wanted the best for the racers. My purpose for chiming in, is to try and make things even between the different manufactures options avaiable to the racers.

I guess I'm stuck in the 90's when there was 2 groups of racers in Florida. The Fast Ones Racers and WFO racers those 16d's seemed evenly matched and everyone used the Turbo Flex Chassis (it was best option during the time frame i raced). It was the best, I remember those guys hated each other it was great racing. I loved it. We had 1 motor to use but there were a couple options for blue printed motors and the other option of building them yourself. I wish we could open the motors up and build are own, a lost art in the entry level racing classes we race in the FSCS.

[dalek]

In regard to people mentioning that tech would be simpler if there were only one size of pinion:  

 

Yesterday I discovered a faster, simpler way to check the gears than using the "go, no-go" tools I made for checking pinion and spur diameters.

 

To check the gears, you can simply do the following:  

 

Position the setscrew of the spur gear so it's pointing directly at you then count the number of times the motor cogs as you turn the axle one revolution.

 

The car is geared 14/35 if the motor cogged 15 times when the setscrew has come around and is pointing directly at you again.

 

It's geared 13/35 if it cogged 16 times.

 

Note:  In the case of 13/35, the motor doesn't cog exactly 16 times, but it's so close that you have to look really hard to tell that the setscrew hasn't quite made it all the way to it's original position, but it's so close that it works just fine.

 

For example, in both scenarios above, if the spur is 34T instead of 35, the position of the setscrew, after 15 and 16 cogs, will make it clear that the gearing is not spec.

 

[Hot Slots]

I'm sure Rollin will enjoy counting the cogs on 17+ entries.

Hahaha

[Wizard Of Iz]

I'm sure Rollin will enjoy counting the cogs on 17+ entries.

Hahaha

 

Not too bad .... odd vs even.

[Wizard Of Iz]

While I think the Mid America Toyota is the only LMP body presently allowed that is a true LMP body with their Porsche almost keeping the true spirit of LMP. Allowing the Mid America Toyota HD only seems fair since the others have already gone to an HD version (side wings). And yes I know RTR has an even more HD version too. Now go back to true LMP bodies would make for a true scale looking car.

 

I'm with you!  Probably a good thing I'm not the "Body Czar." I'd have us running the JK or Red Fox bodies that at least resemble the real LMPs.   And they'd either be 0.010" or at least a true 0.007 thick.

 

Then we'd hear some griping.

[Wizard Of Iz]

Show me 1 person that used the retro eagle last season!

Reasons the Roadrunner should be legal.
1- like Brandon said, it would simplify tech. It would save time in tech as only 1 pinion would be used 14.
2- its cheaper than the CR 102. Its about $2.00 less expensive


No reason to keep the retro eagle as NO ONE uses it anyway. Why is everyone stuck on the 102?
The roadrunner is still produced by Mid America, as the retro eagle.

 

 

That Kelly body is a damn GTP body. Wow. No where near the same as the Mid America Mustang or the rtr.


Some people still use the retro eagle? Name 1 that still uses it?????

Waiting.

 

 

Crickets about who uses the retro eagle. I figured this would happen.

 

 

Rolling,,, in no way am I bitching at you. Im posting this to speak my mind. Ill be much more clear on this post.


Ed, if the board whats it to be more simple why keep the retro eagle, it takes a 13 tooth pinion? I cant be the only one to understand this issue. If the road runner is legal then we all would be forced to use a 14 tooth pinion on every car.

Ed, if its up to the racers to which motor to buy. I am 100% positive 95% of us racers would choose to buy the road runner if they are the same speed since its $2.00 less expensive or more.

Ed, who uses retro eagles in the Florida State Races? Oh maybe the guys that only race at your track that borrow your car. Not one person that follows the series uses the retro eagle. AGAIN NOT ONE PERSON. Keeping that motor in our series makes as much since as trying to nail jello to a tree.

 

 

Ed is right.   Chris Zimmerman WON the Nascar race at FER in August using a Mid-America Retro Eagle.

 

Notice that there's no armature shaft on the endbell side of the motor.

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[Wizard Of Iz]

The wing on the Kelly Body is aggressive, the only thing that might keep Mid America Mustang Competitive is the lower roof line, it's pretty low compared to the RTR. The Mid America body has the smallest rear spoiler of the 3 but the lower roof makes its it more aero.

I dont understand why the Road Runner wasnt added to the motors and the Retro Eagle dropped being nobody uses it. Nothing wrong with beating a dead horse.

Im pretty sure one of the posts said something about simplifying the rules, only having 1 pinion size sure would have helped with that. .

Again ,,, Very good point. And since I volunteered to tech, I like simple.

Marcus is the only(?) one to test the Kelly body and he said it’s just another option ,,, no better, no worse. I’m good with his word on that. Just looking at it, I could see how it might be better in the corners and slower on the straights than the Titan (which is a Nissan Truck name???) and the Mustang.

As I said, I’ve taken all of the input to Marcus, Joe, and Ed. But it takes a minute. These guys wisely don’t spend time on here. And I really do have other stuff to do. Retirement is way busier than I thought it would be.

Remember ,,, these are changes for January 2024 and we’re not quite 10 days into November. There’s time. I think these guys have created a fun series that’s easy for

Seriously ,,, I genuinely appreciate the input. I hope your interest means you’re going to make more FSCS races next year.

[Tampabay racer]

Oh so I person used one in one race. Excuse me please. Simplified rules is what the bod has been asking. To count the number of times a gear turns over seems very easy, however sitting there counting the gear turning over 14 times seems like it would take much longer than just sliding a gear jig on it, just my opinion. Simple rules 1 pinion 2 motors.

Whats the reason the RR motor isnt being considered here? Its no faster its no better its less expensive than the cr102. It has the same spec. No its not the same motor just the same specs.

[MSwiss]

Brian, 

What spec is different that it's 2 grams heavier than the CR102?

[Bucky]

Opinion from an outsider, but if the MA RR is similar/identical to the CR-102 it wont make any significant competitive difference to allow it in. I would add it, and leave the Retro Eagle on the list for the handful of guys that use those motors. Maybe change the rule that for any motor the largest pinion that can be used is a 14t so if guys are running 13t on the RE the 14t jig tool will quickly show its smaller than 14t and legal.

If the owners have some other reason besides a competitive advantage not to allow it thats their decision, so I wouldnt be upset

[Tampabay racer]

Swiss, it was built to be irra legal. The specs are the same as the 102. 2 grams heavier? Big deal for a flexi cars that we have a minimum weight rule and have to add lead to the chassis anyway. I add my weight in the back of the chassis. Ive tested several Roadrunners and havent had a motor blow away the cr102. Same speed within .05 of 3 102s and 3 roadrunners all in the same chassis, tires and body, just swapping out the motor and pinion but the same 14 tooth.

I remember someone on the board saying to keep it cheap as possible. Well lookey here this Roadrunner is less expensive as the cr 102 by $2.00.

Why cater to 1 racer that ran 1 retro eagle 1 race and he dont really follow the series. How many races did he make,,, 2 or 3? Why cant new rules be voted by use racers over the track owners just thinking what they think is best of all? Some track owners dont race and some are not competitive at all. Win on Sunday sell on Monday. More money for the tracks to make because now they will sell more motors and pinions to go on those motors.