Jump to content




Photo

Basic paint that works and doesn't cause problems


  • Please log in to reply
105 replies to this topic

#51 team burrito

team burrito

    Posting Leader

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,152 posts
  • Joined: 15-September 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:SF Bay area

Posted 24 November 2023 - 01:09 AM

tap plastics has 1, 2, 4 & even 8 oz polypropylene bottles with caps - they also sell flip-up tops.


Russ Toy (not Troy)
First Place Loser in the JK Products
International D3 Builders Competition




#52 Ramcatlarry

Ramcatlarry

    Posting Leader

  • Subscriber
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,912 posts
  • Joined: 08-March 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:St Charles, IL 60174

Posted 24 November 2023 - 01:23 AM

FYI:  Try window cleaner to wash the bodies and your hands to degrease it all, rinse in warm water and paper towel dry.

 

Butyrate bodies were made in the 1950s - 1970s and like to turn brown in sunlight..  Another material used in many areas is Pet-G or milk bottle plastic.   It also is hard to get paint to stick.


Larry D. Kelley, MA
retired raceway owner... Raceworld/Ramcat Raceways
racing  around Chicago-land

 

Diode/Omni repair specialist
USRA 2023 member # 2322
IRRA,/Sano/R4 veteran, Flat track racer/MFTS

Host 2006 Formula 2000 & ISRA/USA Nats
Great Lakes Slot Car Club (1/32) member
65+ year pin Racing rail/slot cars in America


#53 Eddie Fleming

Eddie Fleming

    Posting Leader

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,771 posts
  • Joined: 27-April 14
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Fayetteville, GA USA

Posted 24 November 2023 - 07:52 AM

Six or seven years ago I bought a GTP body that shall remain nameless. When I took it out of it's bag it felt rubbery. I have no Idea what material it was but paint would not stick to it. It became very ugly as I would run it and some paint would fall off. I would repaint with something else only to have that fall off. Eventually I gave up and threw it away. ???

 

No point to the story but I remember it well. 


Eddie Fleming

#54 Wizard Of Iz

Wizard Of Iz

    Slot Parrothead

  • Subscriber
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,810 posts
  • Joined: 15-November 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Jacksonville, FL

Posted 24 November 2023 - 09:40 AM

"Couple of updates

 

........

 

7) I'm waiting for ralph thorn racing bodies to come back in stock. I'm going to buy a bunch of clear and learn. Yes I will continue to wash the bodies as I have been.

 

8) My 1 concern is, how do I mix the paint in a secondary container without wasting it? I need a 9 to 1 mixture of paint to thinner. I don't think I'll need all of that paint for 2 bodies but we'll see? I'm hoping Michael's or Joann's (craft places in PA) will have stuff that I can use to mix in and count out the correct amounts?

 

Anyways, wish me luck!

 

Mike"

 

 

 

 

You'll get the hang of it.  You'll make mistakes.  You'll curse the day you started racing slot cars.  And, when it turns out right, you'll relish in the fact that you've learned how to do it.

 

7)  ... Ask your track owner if he has any body inventory that he'd like to get liquidate.  Every track gets stuck with bodies that become almost impossible to sell due to rule changes or a new design makes the old one obsolete.  These  will make great practice bodies while you learn without wasting a pricey Ralphie body.

 

Keep in mind .... that another nice thing about painting with Createx (or other water-based acrylic) paint is that you can wash the paint out of the body.  It just takes warm water and some paper towels and/or some Q-Tips.  I have an Outisight COT body that was painted three times before I got the color how I wanted it for the #25 Folgers car that Tim Richmond drove.

 

 

8) ...  I use old paint bottles to mix in.  I've gotten pretty good at eyeballing how much paint I need to paint one body.  It doesn't take a lot ... but I'd rather have a little extra.  A small bottle of Createx will probably do a dozen or more bodies.  Don't get hung up on an exact ratio of paint to reducer.  Different bottles of the same brand, same color can require more or less reducer.  You just want to get the mixture to the consistency of skim milk.  Michaels, Joann's, and/or Hobby Lobby should have a decent supply of small paint jars.  If you can't find any ... send me your address and I'll send you a couple.

 

BTW ... "they" make a cap/lid for the Createx or Faskolor or RTR paint bottles that has a nipple that will attach directly to your airbrush.  I tried one ONCE.  Trying to use the paint without reducer seemed to clog the airbrush and required too much air pressure to have any control over where the paint was going.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Additional things you should consider getting:

 

 

5. Paint pot. I use the one from Harbor Freight, but you should be able to get one at any kraft store. 

 

Don't feel that you need to mix the paint to a predetermined ratio (9:1). Experiment with the consistency of the paint and see what works best for you. Good luck!

 

 

GREAT advice to get an Airbrush Cleaning Pot/Bottle!  I always dedicate one paint cup to use with Airbrush Cleaner and spray a cupful into the Cleaning Pot between colors.  

 

However ... before I paint with White, I simply take the airbrush apart and clean everything under running water using a couple of pipe cleaners.  Nothing worse than getting ready to paint something white and discovering that there's a hidden drop of blue in the airbrush.


Rollin Isbell
 


#55 Mike Patterson

Mike Patterson

    Village Luddite

  • Subscriber
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,529 posts
  • Joined: 14-October 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Zanesville, OH

Posted 24 November 2023 - 11:13 AM

And now, an opinion from a parallel universe. I never roughen the inside of bodies. I wash them out with Simple Green®, and dry with a cotton towel. Sometimes Q-Tips® are necessary to get the water out of certain tight areas. I don't thin the paint. I spray with high (50 psi) pressure, and lots of thin coats. I back every paint job with white, to make the colors "pop". I should add that I'm going for concours quality, and not a one-race wonder. I use a Binks® Wren® single action airbrush that's almost 50 years old, paired with a cheap, refurbished Campbell/Hausfeld compressor. An example:

 

R44-F1.jpg

 


  • Jencar17, Wizard Of Iz and Eddie Fleming like this

I am not a doctor, but I played one as a child with the girl next door.


#56 Bill from NH

Bill from NH

    Age scrubs away speed!

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,370 posts
  • Joined: 02-August 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Boston, NH

Posted 24 November 2023 - 11:14 AM

"Nothing worse than getting ready to paint something white and discovering that there's a hidden drop of blue in the airbrush." This is one reason for not mixing paint in an airbrush. It lessens but does not eliminate a drop of color remaining somewhere in the brush. You never can be too clean!  :laugh2: 


  • Wizard Of Iz likes this
Bill Fernald
 
I intend to live forever!  So far, so good.  :laugh2:  :laugh2: 

#57 Wizard Of Iz

Wizard Of Iz

    Slot Parrothead

  • Subscriber
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,810 posts
  • Joined: 15-November 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Jacksonville, FL

Posted 24 November 2023 - 12:31 PM

And now, an opinion from a parallel universe. I never roughen the inside of bodies. I wash them out with Simple Green®, and dry with a cotton towel. Sometimes Q-Tips® are necessary to get the water out of certain tight areas. I don't thin the paint. I spray with high (50 psi) pressure, and lots of thin coats. I back every paint job with white, to make the colors "pop". I should add that I'm going for concours quality, and not a one-race wonder. I use a Binks® Wren® single action airbrush that's almost 50 years old, paired with a cheap, refurbished Campbell/Hausfeld compressor. An example:

 

attachicon.gif R44-F1.jpg

 

 

That's an excellent looking body.  You should be quite proud of your work.  Definitely shows the value in using quality masking material.

 

Simple Green's not a bad idea.  I usually use Dawn because it's handy and is a good degreaser.  And .... I'll confess that there have been times that I've been in a hurry and didn't bother to wash the body at all ... if it was fresh out of the bag.  


Rollin Isbell
 


#58 Brian Czeiner

Brian Czeiner

    On The Lead Lap

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 461 posts
  • Joined: 04-March 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Tyler, TX

Posted 24 November 2023 - 01:09 PM

   While mixing the paint in a separate bottle does make sense, the reality is if the color needs reducing, then the whole bottle needs reducing too. You can add your reducer slowly into the bottle until you get the correct consistency.  Another advantage of doing the whole bottle is, the error of a few drops finding the ratio becomes less critical when mixing ounces vs 1/8 of an ounce. (I use an old eye dropper to add reducer) The downside is if you reduce too far you potentially waste a bottle. When I've done this, I leave the bottle set open for a day, two or three in an effort to thicken and salvage some of the paint. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

If you do choose to reduce in a separate bottle, any leftover paint can be put back into the original bottle. It won't hurt anything. Eventually you may even have the contents reduced correctly.

 

   Backing fluorescent colors can also be done with opaque versions of that color. While it may reduce the brightness by a shade or two, it will help hide zebra stripes or spots creating a more even shade of color and therefore reducing your overall thickness of paint. There are some colors, like orange or green, where you can back with yellow and enhance the brightness even further then white. Any backing color only needs a very thin coat to become opaque enough for most rules. These techniques can create some very cool unintended shading effects too. Remember, you are the only one who knows it's a mistake. Play with it a little. Once you get a feel for it, you will learn how easy it is to make nice paint jobs.


  • Racer36 likes this

If it's not a Caveman, It's HISTORY!          Support Your local raceways!

 

cavemanbodeez@gmail.com         CavemanBodeez.com      Womp Mafia


#59 Mad Mark

Mad Mark

    Race Leader

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 568 posts
  • Joined: 03-February 19
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:SoCal

Posted 24 November 2023 - 04:01 PM

Latest createx paint job still scratches off fairly easy with fingernail. chassis bumping the number already put a scratch in it. this is with the balancing clear coat mixed in all the colors. really dont know what people can be doing to make this not scratch off. it does stick and not flake off Ive noticed but not scratch resistant.
07861F39-A02F-4EEC-A4C3-5B2670508E87.jpeg
21EAAC3A-913C-4FD6-8074-F3ECEE9FE7B5.jpeg
Mark Haas

#60 Wizard Of Iz

Wizard Of Iz

    Slot Parrothead

  • Subscriber
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,810 posts
  • Joined: 15-November 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Jacksonville, FL

Posted 24 November 2023 - 05:46 PM

At the risk of being a real "Richard Noggin" ... I guess I haven't had this problem because I don't scratch at my paint job with my fingernail.  I don't think I've even been tempted to scratch at my paint job.

 

On LMP and GTP bodies ... I do put a piece of clear packing or shipping tape in the front of the body to allow the top of the guide flag to move freely across a smooth surface rather than the matte finish of the paint.


Rollin Isbell
 


#61 team burrito

team burrito

    Posting Leader

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,152 posts
  • Joined: 15-September 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:SF Bay area

Posted 24 November 2023 - 07:54 PM

any water-based paint will scratch off if you pick at it - it doesn't stick that good. i have no problems with the spray can stuff, except for the fluorescent colors - they will flake off under impact.


Russ Toy (not Troy)
First Place Loser in the JK Products
International D3 Builders Competition

#62 studentdriver

studentdriver

    Backmarker

  • Full Member
  • PipPip
  • 91 posts
  • Joined: 13-February 23
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:PA

Posted 24 November 2023 - 08:58 PM

I got everything setup and was able to test and actually start painting with the fluorescent first coat. I will put an opaque coat over the fluorescent when it dries and then blue on the back.

 

So exactly what Mark said.. on my test water bottle (I picked something with lots of bends and also something I can move to see how strong it was) I was able to get it to stick just fine but if I scratch a bit it does scratch off... I'll see how this pans out exactly long term.. I don't care about where the guide flag is but if it's scratches off else where I might be a little off put. Can I mix some of the 4050 in or put it on after to maybe help with this scratching? I'll also reach out to Createx and ask this probably on Monday.

 

my only comments so far (it's early and I'm still learning)

 

1) pipettes don't seem to really be needed. I just count the drops I put into the small plastic containers I bought at Michael's craft store. Stir to get the softer/milky consistency as recommended. Close the cap. I hope this things don't let it dry out but I didn't mix a ton of paint so no big deal...

2) I can't always exactly figure out where the heck I am aiming but with my paint schemes it doesn't matter

3)  It's a more enjoyable experience once you get everything setup.. Like rattle can is quick an easy.. this is more involved but kind of fun at the same time, can quite explain it. I think this will vary from person to person.

4) I've probably spent close to 200 bucks for everything including a 2x4' table from lowes for $50. This include paint, thinner and the airbrush kit itself. I think it's avanti and even tho I didn't get it at HF it's the same thing.

5) I'm up here writing this waiting for fluorescent to dry, lol.. it's a bit slower to dry.

 

See attached photos for results.. I did get a little heavy in spots because again, I can't always see where it's going... I wish it didn't scratch as much as it does though...

 

Mike

 

 

 

Attached Images

  • paintbody.jpg
  • testpaint.jpg

Mike Ciccarelli
 
- I don't typically race in series
- Enjoy tinkering 
- Like going fast!

#63 Bill from NH

Bill from NH

    Age scrubs away speed!

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,370 posts
  • Joined: 02-August 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Boston, NH

Posted 24 November 2023 - 08:58 PM

Two acrylic paints I've found to be highly scratch resistance are Liquitex tube acrylic colors & Delta Ceramcoat. The Delta requires 72-96 hours to dry thoroughly. The late Frank Valentine on OWH clued me in about Delta. The JOANN Fabric generic paints are one with poor adhesion on Lexan. stay away from it.

 

For those worrying about body scratches from a guidepost, just shorten the post. I have always cut mine off even with the top of the guide nut.


Bill Fernald
 
I intend to live forever!  So far, so good.  :laugh2:  :laugh2: 

#64 Mad Mark

Mad Mark

    Race Leader

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 568 posts
  • Joined: 03-February 19
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:SoCal

Posted 24 November 2023 - 09:09 PM

When it comes to thinning it also depends on temperature and the specific color. you can check out my thread in here it has lots of good tips from everyone.
Mark Haas

#65 studentdriver

studentdriver

    Backmarker

  • Full Member
  • PipPip
  • 91 posts
  • Joined: 13-February 23
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:PA

Posted 24 November 2023 - 10:26 PM

These would be brush on tube based paints right?

 

Are there any air brush paints that are more resistant to scratching?

 

thanks,

Mike

 

 

Two acrylic paints I've found to be highly scratch resistance are Liquitex tube acrylic colors & Delta Ceramcoat. The Delta requires 72-96 hours to dry thoroughly. The late Frank Valentine on OWH clued me in about Delta. The JOANN Fabric generic paints are one with poor adhesion on Lexan. stay away from it.

 

For those worrying about body scratches from a guidepost, just shorten the post. I have always cut mine off even with the top of the guide nut.


Mike Ciccarelli
 
- I don't typically race in series
- Enjoy tinkering 
- Like going fast!

#66 team burrito

team burrito

    Posting Leader

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,152 posts
  • Joined: 15-September 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:SF Bay area

Posted 24 November 2023 - 10:27 PM

I'm up here writing this waiting for fluorescent to dry, lol.. it's a bit slower to dry.

i use a hair dryer in-between coats - it really speeds up the painting process.
 


Russ Toy (not Troy)
First Place Loser in the JK Products
International D3 Builders Competition

#67 Bill from NH

Bill from NH

    Age scrubs away speed!

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,370 posts
  • Joined: 02-August 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Boston, NH

Posted 24 November 2023 - 11:25 PM

Delta is a craft paint that can be thinned for airbrushing. The Liquitex paint actually comes in tubes & in glass jars.  Both can be thinned for airbrushing. I haven't used the Liqutex jars I have yet. Most department stores carry some Delta paints. Craft stores such as Michaels. Hobby Lobby, & maybe JOANN's Fabrics will have both brands,

 

If you found something that work for you, stay with it.  Ease of spraying & cleanup are more important to me than scratch resistance, If I was a collector rather than a racer, I might be more concerned with scratch resistance.


Bill Fernald
 
I intend to live forever!  So far, so good.  :laugh2:  :laugh2: 

#68 studentdriver

studentdriver

    Backmarker

  • Full Member
  • PipPip
  • 91 posts
  • Joined: 13-February 23
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:PA

Posted 25 November 2023 - 08:30 AM

Can I just buy some sort of clear coat to finish it off? Maybe put 1 or 2 coats of krylon uv resistent clear on top of the acrylic? I might buy the createx 4050 and mix it in next time and see if it helps otherwise I'm ok with just using something strong but smelly to finish the job off...
Mike Ciccarelli
 
- I don't typically race in series
- Enjoy tinkering 
- Like going fast!

#69 Mike Patterson

Mike Patterson

    Village Luddite

  • Subscriber
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,529 posts
  • Joined: 14-October 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Zanesville, OH

Posted 25 November 2023 - 11:20 AM

The ability to scratch off the water-base paint is actually an advantage. When some paint leaks under a mask (and it will!), you can take a toothpick and scratch it off, no solvents necessary. If you're that worried about scratches, save some of the paint, and use a small brush to touch it up. And if you're using 0.007" bodies, they tend to wad up pretty easy in a crash, and a few paint scratches will be the least of your problems.


  • Eddie Fleming likes this

I am not a doctor, but I played one as a child with the girl next door.


#70 Eddie Fleming

Eddie Fleming

    Posting Leader

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,771 posts
  • Joined: 27-April 14
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Fayetteville, GA USA

Posted 25 November 2023 - 12:30 PM

One thing that surprised me about acrylic paint was that the gunk that accumulates inside the body as the car runs can be cleaned with lighter fluid on a rag or paper towel., and the paint holds up well.

 

At least the paint I use does.  


Eddie Fleming

#71 Brian Czeiner

Brian Czeiner

    On The Lead Lap

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 461 posts
  • Joined: 04-March 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Tyler, TX

Posted 25 November 2023 - 01:08 PM

You might be rushing the scratch test. All paints, including acrylics, need some sort of cure time. 

 

However, don't knock the easy scratch option. In cases of tape bleed, once you start taping stripes and graphics,  you can take a pointy tooth pick and scratch the bleed area away saving the paint job. Not to mention scratching lightning, cracks or something in the main color. Concourse can be that easy. Just sayin..... 

 

I also agree with the hair dryer method to assist in drying. Figure which heat setting and distance will work for you.

 

Painting isn't a black and white answer. There are dozens, if not more, tricks to the trade.

 

The fun you are having is the unlocking of the creative portion of your personality. Just use the force and let it flow........ :icon22:  :icon22:  :icon22:


  • studentdriver likes this

If it's not a Caveman, It's HISTORY!          Support Your local raceways!

 

cavemanbodeez@gmail.com         CavemanBodeez.com      Womp Mafia


#72 Bill from NH

Bill from NH

    Age scrubs away speed!

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,370 posts
  • Joined: 02-August 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Boston, NH

Posted 25 November 2023 - 02:58 PM

I once read the RC cars that were given a final undercoat of clear applied to gas cars. The purpose of their doing it was to fuel-proof the body paint rather than to make it scratch-resistant.

 

I used final undercoats of white, silver, & gold, usually while. Black & other opaque colors could be used, but I didn't.


  • studentdriver likes this
Bill Fernald
 
I intend to live forever!  So far, so good.  :laugh2:  :laugh2: 

#73 studentdriver

studentdriver

    Backmarker

  • Full Member
  • PipPip
  • 91 posts
  • Joined: 13-February 23
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:PA

Posted 25 November 2023 - 04:20 PM

1 more update! I got the body "done".. it's cut out and mounted. I took the picture below right before cutting and mounting it to the chassis...

 

couple of notes:

 

1) Per what Brian said, letting it cure over night did seem to make it a bit stronger.. that said the guide flag did make some very small marks in it already but nothing I haven't seen elsewhere..

2) I am going to buy the Createx 4050 and add it on the next bodies I do. The only negative I read about it is that it can tend to block the small exit at the end of the airbrush if it dries even a little.. Also you really should get some "official" cleaner other than water to help get rid of left over 4050.

3) If the 4050 doesn't do it then I might resort to a clear enamel paint (maybe 1 or 2 coats). I honestly want to try to avoid this because of the extra weight but we'll see.

4) I think 1 issue with my original testing was I didn't clean the test water bottle I was using so it might not have stuck as well as it did on the bodies. Heck I even used rubber gloves to attach the masks which I think helped.

 

I'm looking forward to developing this airbrush technique a bit more! I've learned so much with this thread.. I want to thank everyone that commented and gave me suggestions. I do appreciate the feedback and am very grateful!

 

I'm trying to wait patiently for the 1 body I need to come back in stock so I can order like 5 of them. I want to play around with backing colors and just throwing different colors together and see what happens. I want to try fluorescent backed by maybe white vs the opaque version.

 

thanks again,

Mike

 

 

Attached Images

  • airbody.jpg

  • Mike Patterson likes this
Mike Ciccarelli
 
- I don't typically race in series
- Enjoy tinkering 
- Like going fast!

#74 Hot Slots

Hot Slots

    On The Lead Lap

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 324 posts
  • Joined: 04-November 20
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:FL

Posted 25 November 2023 - 04:42 PM

She looks ready to race.
Brandon Eden

#75 Bill from NH

Bill from NH

    Age scrubs away speed!

  • Full Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,370 posts
  • Joined: 02-August 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Boston, NH

Posted 25 November 2023 - 08:30 PM

This body has good paint ccoverage Mike. add numbers, an interior, & race it. I still recall my first airbrushed body I did in 1970. It was a Dynamic or Kirby McLaren painted white with pink, purple, green, & black fogging. It wasn't a thing of breauty. but was colorful & useable. I used a single-action Binks Wren airbrush with a medium tip. That airbrush was retired in 2005 but is still useable. I replaced it with two double-action brushes, a Paasche & an Aztek. 


Bill Fernald
 
I intend to live forever!  So far, so good.  :laugh2:  :laugh2: 





Electric Dreams Online Shop