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Bruce McLaren’s Cooper-Oldsmobile


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#51 Jairus

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 11:33 AM

Yeah, it'll fold in the middle allowing you to hold it in your shirt pocket is what! :rolleyes:

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#52 dc-65x

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 12:29 PM

Here's the Morrissey chassis I used for inspiration. It works fine with pin tube:

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....it'll fold in the middle....


Not only that but the front end springs like a slinky. Give it a flip with your finger and it will keep springing back and forth seemingly forever :blush: :laugh2: .

But hey, I meant to do that.... :unsure: ....Well maybe not but this fixed the problem and weighs next to nothing:

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It's amazing what a little X-bracing will do. It's quite stiff now. Also, note the brass armature washer I used to reinforce the wire rails to drop arm pivot joint.

With that fixed I added a drop arm....

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...the body mount side rails and a drop arm down stop and the chassis is done:

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Hmmm......that is a funny looking front axle tube :blink:

Rick Thigpen
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#53 Duffy

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 01:03 PM

Naaaaw. Just think of it as a long bushing for an aluminum freewheel.
Michael J. Heinrich
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#54 Tex

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 02:09 PM

Got yer own version of a "Birdcage" almost, Rick.

Niiiice.
Richard L. Hofer

Remember, two wrongs don't make a right... but three lefts do! Only you're a block over and a block behind.

#55 Jairus

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 03:54 PM

Ball bearing fronts? ;)

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#56 dc-65x

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 09:15 PM

Hi Duffy, you're close ;) .

Thanks Tex :)

Ball bearing fronts? ;)


You're on a roll my man :D . I decided to try some of our Russkit repop front set screw wheels, Russkit Cooper wheel inserts, Revell Goodyear front tires and.......

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bore the wheels out to 1/4".....

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.....machine off the set screw boss holding the wheel in a pot chuck.......

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......and convert them to ball bearing fronts using some vintage Versatec ball bearings (stock wheel on the left):

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I've never used the old Versatec bearings because they are a little sloppy for a rear end but man, they spin forever. Just the ticket for front wheels. Another .00001 miles per hour top speed are mine for sure :laugh2: .

I broke the motor in at 6 volts for 2 hours, reoiled the bearings and repeated for another 2 hours. It drew .4 amps or less and barely got warm:

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I'm going to try 3 different rear tires all on our Russkit repop rear wheels. MDC silicones, 40mm Germans and modern Paul's urethane repops of K&B stock car specials:

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I changed my mind on the guide after I took this picture. I went with the old Dynamic with screw in "hairy braid" shown and the small brass guide collar:

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Putting everything together for a "pre-paint" test at Eddie's she looks like so:

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Off to the track........

Rick Thigpen
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#57 Régis4446

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 12:32 AM

:shok: nice work again.
and a great source of inspiration.
Régis Baron

#58 dc-65x

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 04:04 PM

Thanks Régis.

Track testing at Eddie's is always fun. With it being Easter Sunday we pretty much had the place to ourselves. From the moment I put my Cooper-Olds on the track it was perfect...everything I'd hoped for and more.

Everything I build does not turn out this way unfortunately. My Rod & Custom Team Russkit Lotus 25B is a disaster :blink: . Even Rodney (one of the best vintage car tuners there is) put that thing on the floor :shok: :laugh2: .

But that's another story. My 705-6 runs and handles great and it's time to paint it. But first I want to show the runners up in the Pittman Top Speed Challenge event.

Rodney's 705 powered Apollo GT with a survivor body from back in the day:

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Finally Rodney's other Challenge car, a 706 powered Lancer King Cobra. The project started with his sketch and turned into a spectacular space frame:

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I think it's a real work of art. Here are some pictures of the rolling chassis:

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The body is another survivor that was started by an unknown builder back in the day and finished by Rodney:

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The exhaust pipes are intake stacks from the Monogram Chaparral 2D model. I believe the driver and dashboard are from the same kit:

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Is that one fantastic build or what!

Rick Thigpen
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#59 don.siegel

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 04:12 PM

Beautiful guys!

How did they stack up against each other on the track? I see that Rodney also used Weldun gears - did he do nasty stuff to the motor like you?

And was it worth saving those tenths of a gram?

Don

#60 dc-65x

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 04:37 PM

Hey Don,

Rodney's King Cobra was faster than his Apollo GT but a little slower top speed wise than my car. His Cobra was way heavier and uses stock gearing so that's not a surprise. Lap time wise my car was quite a bit quicker. Rodney is going to switch to some urethane or silicone tires and that should close the gap quite a bit.

I'm actually quite surprised at how well my car runs but I love that space frame King Cobra!

Rick Thigpen
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#61 dc-65x

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 05:04 PM

........And was it worth saving those tenths of a gram?


I forgot to answer about the weight. Actually I saved 5.5 grams not tenths of a gram. Was that worth the effort? I think only if I enjoyed the process and I had a BLAST! :)
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#62 Alchemist

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Posted 29 April 2011 - 09:58 PM

Hi Rick,

What a gorgeous "gem" of a motor! What do you call it please, since it's a "hybrid" combining both 705/706 parts?

Simply gorgeous!

Ernie

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#63 dc-65x

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Posted 29 April 2011 - 11:05 PM

Hi Ernie,

I just call it a Pittman 705-6. It's a good running motor and the car handles great too. My 1966 R&C cars are super fast in the straights but handle like crap and I mean CRAP. But I'm not giving up on them....yet.
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#64 don.siegel

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 03:55 AM

and I had a BLAST! :)


Rick,

And we're having a blast watching you go through the process! Don't know if you realize how inspiring your work is to all of us, but just wanted to thank you for everything you've done, and how you've brought together childhood dreams and adult know-how in some of the most beautiful slot cars I've ever seen!

Back to the trenches, time to plug in my JBC...

Don

PS: a DC705-1/2?
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#65 dc-65x

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 04:04 PM

Thank you Don. Building these cars wouldn't be half the fun if I couldn't share them with everyone that loves the old slot cars too.

Rick Thigpen
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#66 Tex

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 06:13 PM

Hi Ernie,

I just call it a Pittman 705-6. It's a good running motor and the car handles great too. My 1966 R&C cars are super fast in the straights but handle like crap and I mean CRAP. But I'm not giving up on them....yet.


Ah, the slot racer's conumdrum... looks great on the drawing board and building jig, right up to when it's put on the track in all it's pristine virgin patina. Then it tries to take a corner... and wallows like a beached whale on 2 hydrocodone and a 12-pack. It's time to ask yourself the age-old question:

What would Steube/VonAhrens/TonyP/Warmack/Cukras/Cozine do?

Lead, baby... lead. Add lead until it CAN'T come off. Then back some lead off until you can find some sort of "edge" to drive it on, somewhere between said whale paddling a Radio Flyer around a cul-de-sac as fast as it can vs. straightlining into the wall and being kicked out for damaging the track. :laugh2:
Richard L. Hofer

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#67 dc-65x

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 07:43 PM

Tex, the Lotus 25B is so evil handling it would be declared a Super Fund Hazardous Cleanup Site if I put all the lead on it would take to keep that thing off its back :shok: . Too much traction. So far Alpha Piranhas, Super Naturals and Wonder Rubber have had too much bite. I've ground a pair of original grey Van Cleave and Quad Experience tires to try.

Back to this project.....what in the heck color was Bruce McLaren's helmet when he drove this Cooper-Olds? I thought it was silver but in this picture it looks white :blink: :

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And in this picture it looks like it could be silver:

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Hey Scale Police, what say you please :)

Rick Thigpen
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#68 Bill from NH

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 08:17 PM

I'm not the Scale Police, but when the helmet is compared to a known white area(meatball & numerals) in each photo, it looks to be a light shade of silver. The lower sides of the body are a darker shade of silver. :)

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#69 Tex

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 10:07 PM

From what few color photos I've seen from "back in the day", a silver helmet back then was a silver-gray as opposed to a chrome-silver. Maybe that coupled with perhaps "less-than-full-sun" conditions make that first pic look the way it does.
Richard L. Hofer

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#70 Mopar Rob

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 10:37 PM

Tex, the Lotus 25B is so evil handling it would be declared a Super Fund Hazardous Cleanup Site if I put all the lead on it would take to keep that thing off its back :shok: . Too much traction. So far Alpha Piranhas, Super Naturals and Wonder Rubber have had too much bite. I've ground a pair of original grey Van Cleave and Quad Experience tires to try.

Back to this project.....what in the heck color was Bruce McLaren's helmet when he drove this Cooper-Olds? I thought it was silver but in this picture it looks white :blink: :

Posted Image

And in this picture it looks like it could be silver:

Posted Image

Hey Scale Police, what say you please :)



I think it's silver. In the black & white photo it looks lighter, but I think that's just the sun or some other reflection. Look at the silver stripe on the hood, it looks lighter than the bottom and I would bet they were the same?

In regard to the silver paint. Metalic back in the day is different than today's mica based paint. Most were ground much finer and gives a grayer look. I had a bottle of some old color change paint that I think Joe Lupo had given me. If you spray it dry it's just silver and would be correct looking for the day. Maybe Joe has more? Tomorrow I can take a photo of two modern 1/32 cars with one painted Pactra silver and the other painted with the paint I got from Joe to illustrate the example.
Rob Hanson

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#71 Prof. Fate

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Posted 01 May 2011 - 11:20 AM

Hi

With either survivors or new builds, when the "too much traction" thing is observed, it is usually no such thing, but flex in the rear axle carrier, bent axle, out of round wheels. Just look at twisting the wheels in the hand and seeing if the motor and axle carrier are moving around. If you can kill this movement, the tire issue usually goes away.

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#72 dc-65x

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Posted 01 May 2011 - 11:50 AM

OK, thanks, a silver helmet it shall be :) .

But now the bar has been raised in this Pittman Top Speed contest. Rodney has moved his King Cobra out of the All Pittman Class and into the new Vintage Unlimited Class (any brand vintage parts, rewinds OK, but must fit inside a 703 - 706 setup) :shok: . Here is his email and pictures:

Rick,

Full ball bearings. Epoxied, trued and balanced arm. Weldon gears. Turned 9.01 on the Blue King and a bunch of 9.10
New tires also.

Rodney

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Boys, that ain't no Pittman armature :unsure: ! It's a 3-pole with a different comm. And, that wire under the old school "full epoxy encapsulation" looks pretty hefty :blink: . He found the armature in a box of stuff from the old Oakland Speedway.

I'm going to postpone painting the McLaren Olds for my "All Pittman Class" car and build a new "Vintage Unlimited Class" car ................

"Come Watson, the game is afoot!" :laugh2:


Rick Thigpen
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#73 Jairus

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Posted 01 May 2011 - 01:16 PM

Sir, Yes sir? ;)


Pardon me for asking but what is Rodney doing for magnets? I only ask because I have never seen bits of metallic material clinging to a Pittman like I seen in your pictures gov'ner. I suspect "Neo" may be the culprit here sir.

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#74 TSR

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Posted 01 May 2011 - 02:37 PM

Rick,
Bruce's helmet was plain silver with a clear coat, standard stock color for a period Buco or Bell. The clear coat is what makes the color appear darker than it really is. In the day, few drivers painted their helmets, and Bruce was too busy with more important things to bother about his personal equipment... :)

#75 dc-65x

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Posted 01 May 2011 - 09:46 PM

Thanks Philippe, silver it will be ;) .

Jairus wrote:

Pardon me for asking but what is Rodney doing for magnets? I only ask because I have never seen bits of metallic material clinging to a Pittman like I seen in your pictures gov'ner. I suspect "Neo" may be the culprit here sir.


Rodney responded:

Rick,
Jarius is on to something. Not sure what the magnet was from for the 706. I dug up every part that looks kinda like a 704 style part. I picked the strongest magnet and did not have it re-zapped. It does make the motor attract metal like crazy. The motor was clean when assembled. When you work on the car, it sucks up body pins and wrenches. Stronger then most C-can magnets.
Rodney


I'll put the gauss meter on Rodney's magnet and compare it to my Ram and Pittman magnets soon......

Rick Thigpen
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