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Rodney's Drag Racers


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#51 dc-65x

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Posted 24 August 2015 - 10:03 AM

Here's Rodney's reply, Paul:

 

Rick,
 
The "Germans" used on the dragster are from you (same as pictured above). Thanks again. 
 
Rears are Russkit "drag wheels" (not the "road wheels" pictured).
 
The mag frame has unflanged ball bearings installed in the front. They are located in a useless position. I installed the drop axle front end to raise the axle location for normal size front tires.
 
Rodney

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#52 Gator Bob

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Posted 24 August 2015 - 11:29 PM

Very cool!

 

From my experience having a drop arm up stop is important for consistent passes on braided tracks. Probably not need when they were run on foil tape BITD.

 

Will we be seeing any of these cars in the 3rd Annual 'Rods & Rails' proxy?


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                            Bob Israelite

#53 hiline2

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Posted 25 August 2015 - 05:42 AM

Thank you, Rodney. When will apprentice classes start!! :)


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#54 dc-65x

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Posted 06 October 2015 - 04:32 PM

Rodney's acquired one of the coolest vintage rails I can imagine. Here's the story from Rodney's email:

 

Rick, Ron and Dee,

 

I restored the idler gear dragster from Johnny McCall.  Thanks Johnny for selling this one.  Before and after pictures are enclosed. 

 

(Before Restoration Picture)

 

d3.jpg

 

The Rod & Custom pictures are from an October 1966 issue.  As the caption states, idler-geared cars places the Ram 850 motor forward and allows for a narrow tread (narrow rear track)..

 

idier gear dragster2.jpg

 

In restoring the car I borrowed some rear wheels/tires from another dragster.  Set screw Russkit wheels replaced the threaded wheels.  I agree with Ron, that drag racers used set screw wheels back in the 1960's.

 

The front ride height was raised.  The nose was on the deck and the lower body work was arching against the track braid..

 

A rear gear cover was made.  There were epoxy marks showing the size of the missing cover.

 

(After Restoration Picture)

 

idler gear dragster1.jpg

 

More pictures  to follow showing the details and construction of the dragster.

 

Way cool Rodney. Looking forward to more on this beauty...Thanks!


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#55 hiline2

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Posted 06 October 2015 - 04:55 PM

So that's who I was bidding against!! :dash2:


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#56 dc-65x

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Posted 06 October 2015 - 05:06 PM

Was it on eBay? I didn't even see it... and I look every day.  :wacko2: :laugh2:


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#57 SlotStox#53

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Posted 06 October 2015 - 06:24 PM

Yes it was on epay Rick :good:

Had it in the watch list but was ending when I didn't have enough cash :laugh2:

Question is .... how does it go now after Rodney worked his :wizard: ??

#58 dc-65x

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Posted 06 October 2015 - 06:52 PM

 

Yes it was on epay Rick :good:

 

OK, I guess I was "asleep at the wheel" :crazy: But actually, I'm glad Rodney's got it.

 

asleep-at-the-wheel.jpg

 

 

Question is .... how does it go now after Rodney worked his :wizard: ??

 

Rodney is going to give us that info after it's restored maiden voyage. Watch this space :)


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#59 SlotStox#53

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Posted 06 October 2015 - 07:03 PM

This is just the perfect combination of parts and design that make it a super example of a magwinder :D

Mag rails, hot motor, sweet idler gear setup and those oh so rare Speedway ball bearing fronts :heart:

#60 don.siegel

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Posted 07 October 2015 - 04:31 AM

Amen! Beautiful rail and restoration job. I didn't see it on ebay either, and I wonder if this is one of the auctions that doesn't appear in international markets (like the BZ Chappy). Or was it classified under modern? 

 

Anyway, must not have been a lot of the idler gear setups at the time...

 

Don 



#61 hiline2

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Posted 08 October 2015 - 05:30 AM

Here is the listing plus other one with it :

http://www.ebay.com/...=p2047675.l2557

 

 

http://www.ebay.com/...=p2047675.l2557


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#62 dc-65x

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Posted 08 October 2015 - 10:36 AM

Thanks Paul. I see it was listed in 1970 to now category, why I don't know but.......... :unknw:


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#63 dc-65x

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Posted 11 October 2015 - 11:08 AM

I received an email and pictures from Rodney with more detail information on the idler gear dragster"

 

Rick, Ron, Dee, and Jerry,

 

Pictures attached comparing the idler-gear dragster to the Fred dragster.

 

dragsters side.jpg

 

Notice overall they are about the same size.

 

dragsterstop measured.jpg

 

The front and rear track are narrower with the idler-gear dragster.  Note how far forward the Ram motor is in the idler-gear car.

 

dragstersbottom measured.jpg

 

The gear guard is a work of art like the rest of the car.  As Dee stated in the Proxy race coverage, the idle-gear dragster is epoxied together.

 

dragstergearguard.jpg

 

The motor brush spring on the idler-gear dragster is very stiff and is for a higher voltage than what we run now.

 

1966 was the year when the Cox quick change guide was introduced.  The idler-gear dragster features a quick change guide that is directly mounted to the drop arm.  The guide does not turn!

 

dragsterguide.jpg

 

The Weldon gears are 27 teeth to 64 teeth and 41 teeth to 52 teeth.  This results in a three-to-one gear ratio.  Perfect.

 

dragstergears.jpg

 

dragstergears2.jpg

 

 

Rodney and Ron both believe this is the same car as seen in the Car Model Magazine October 1967 article.  :shok: What a cool find Rodney!   :good:  Compare the magazine photo with the car:

 

Dragsterarticle.jpg

 

I'm a believer too! :sun_bespectacled:

 

The idler-gear dragster weighs an ounce less than the Fred dragster.  The magazine states the four gear idler-gear dragster was not as quick as the conventional two geared dragsters. 


idler gear dragster1.jpg

 

My opinion is the idler gear dragster does allow less nose weight hence less overall weight.  As Ron told me, the motors have so much torque that adding more weight to make the slot car dragster hook up better results in a lower E.T. even if there is more weight to drag around.  The conventional two gear dragsters probably hook up better than the idler-gear ones due to more rear weight bias. 

 

dragsters front.jpg

 

Also, as I told Rick, having the four gear idler-gear sidewinder motor armature spinning in the opposite direction from a two gear sidewinder motor armature probably makes the front end light due to the torque reaction of the motor.

 

It is an honor to be the caretaker of these pieces of slot car history.

 

dragsters side.jpg

 

We're all lucky Rodney that you care enough to lovingly restore, preserve and share these wonderful cars.   Thank you  :victory:


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#64 SlotStox#53

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Posted 11 October 2015 - 11:15 AM

They look awesome together :D

Thanks for sharing with us and keeping such beauties alive & running. Definitely the holy grail of vintage slot dragsters :heart:

One day there maybe some magnesium sheet obtained to do a recreation... maybe ...

#65 hiline2

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 10:24 AM

Fantastic !  I almost had it !! :shok:  :dash2:


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#66 dc-65x

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 10:40 AM

Here's Rodney's track test results from yesterday:

 

dragster at Eddie's.jpg

 
With not the best track conditions, I was getting 1.40 E T and 37 mph with the idler-gear dragster.  The track batteries were a little low.  Gary's bracket racer was .2 seconds slower than usual today.  Track picture attached.
 
If the idler-gear dragster motor was set up for 16 volts (much less motor brush tension) and with more battery power, I think the E.T. would still hit a wall at about 1.3 second times.  The mph would go up though.
 
The idler-gear dragster does not hook up off the line as good as the Fred dragster does.  There does not seem to be as much weight transfer off the line. Gear friction with four gears probably hurts acceleration but all of the gears help the dragster stop quickly.  The idler-gear dragster tracks absolutely straight.
 
Thanks for the update Rodney

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#67 MSwiss

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 10:55 AM

Rick,
Any idea if Rodney has any interest on his car running on higher voltage?

Mike Swiss
 
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#68 dc-65x

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 01:34 PM

Hi Mike,

 

I know I'd like to see it run at higher voltage. :crazy:  But if I owned it, I might be reluctant to risk it. It is a piece of magazine documented slot car history. Rodney reads all posts so we'll see what he thinks......


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#69 MSwiss

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 01:38 PM

NBD.

I'll have up to 30V and approx. 40 ft. of shutdown.

Is stopping these cars a problem?

If so, I wouldn't risk it.

Mike Swiss
 
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#70 dc-65x

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 01:59 PM

 

Is stopping these cars a problem?

 

It's more than a problem, it almost impossible! My 1.4 second Cobra shown below after it sailed through the glue trap and buried itself in towels and other stuff to try and stop these cars:

 

20140907_124622.jpg

 

:wacko2: :laugh2:


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#71 dc-65x

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 02:40 PM

Rick,
Any idea if Rodney has any interest on his car running on higher voltage?

 

Here's Rodneys response Mike:

 

Thanks for your Mike.  I am happy running the vintage dragsters on 16.2 volts.As Ron and I discussed yesterday, it is safer to run the Ram and Pittman motors on 16.2 volts than the higher voltages used back in the day.  I have only a couple of spare Ram 6 volt armatures and no spare 3 volt armatures. The idler-gear car uses a 6 volt armature.  Most dragsters back then used 6 volt Ram armatures.
 
The January 1967 Rod & Custom magazine article written by Gene Husting and Arnold Brownstein describe running the dragsters on higher voltages.  One of the points of interest in the article is the law of diminishing returns holds true regarding running on higher voltages.
Gene ran Arnold's Ram powered magwinder dragster with the following results:
 
24 volts  1.30 ET
 
30 volts  1.25 ET
 
36 volts  1.22 ET
 
36 volts armature blew
 
36 volts with a Husting prepared motor 1.15 ET
 
The "Fred" dragster turned 1.247 ET at 44.39 mph during the proxy race last year.  This is with near perfect track conditions.  Not bad for a measured 16.1 volt run.
 
Rodney

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#72 MSwiss

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 03:01 PM

No problem.

I wasn't sure how rare the motor parts were.

How long is the shutdown at Eddie's?

Mike Swiss
 
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#73 dc-65x

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 07:38 PM

 

How long is the shutdown at Eddie's?

 

Without measuring, Ron thinks it's 35 feet Mike.


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#74 MSwiss

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 07:54 PM

Then I wouldn't want to do it, no matter what.

It sounds like the vintage rubber doesn't get "grabbed" by the glue.

Mike Swiss
 
IRRA® Components Committee Chairman
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Two-time G7 World Champion (1988, 1990)
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#75 dc-65x

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Posted 12 October 2015 - 08:21 PM

I imagine the vintage cars are heavier too. My King Cobra weight a ton!


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