3573 replies to this topic

[jockefors]

hi
why i wonder is that i hawe a g15 arm witch my kidd smoked last time we drived at the track can you revind this arm ? and if i put thiker wires in the spools do i hawe more power...

[Robert V.]

Hi Joakim

You can increase the timing of the motor as you build by twisting the comm on the motors shaft closer to the stacks but you will also make the motor run hotter the more you increase the timing. This is how it goes thicker wire less turns more power thinner wire more turns less power remember more power means more heat. This is a very basic description and there are seveal other factors concerning motor performance. I am shore others here may have a better description and or opinions on this subject.

Thanks guys for all the great comments, thinking of my next project maybe a 13D.

[havlicek]

why i wonder is that i hawe a g15 arm witch my kidd smoked last time we drived at the track can you revind this arm ?

You cannot rewind an arm if you can't take it apart because it's been epoxied, and you most often can't balance it even if you can take it apart because of it having been balanced before.

-john

[Champion 507]

Vic,

My hands have wanted to get dirty all year but I still have a little ways to go.

However, in anticipation of returning to motor building, I asked Cheater to move my Motor Shop thread into the new motor building section and he did. So sometime after the first of the year we'll start having "phun" again.

[jockefors]

You cannot rewind an arm if you can't take it apart because it's been epoxied, and you most often can't balance it even if you can take it apart because of it having been balanced before.

-john

Hi
yes i know this ..but i chekt a littel on my g15 arm and i cudent see that it was epoxied it loocks clean and the tvisted vires are nott coverd...this is probably a old pice of sh...
at least 15-20 years old mura engine ...
possible its balanced but not glued ...i dont know ...

otherwise i think this arm would be a perfect objekt too start with like my first arm winding.....perfecct to adjust degrees to ..hmm 40 and put on littel thiker vires on the arm
....

[havlicek]

OK Joakim, but you often cannot see the epoxy since it soaks into the windings. If the armature is burned up anyway, you have nothing to lose by trying to remove the old wire and then you'll know for sure whether the armature can be rewound easily.

possible its balanced but not glued ...i dont know ...

The balancing is the easiest part to tell. If it has been balanced, the armature will have drilled holes on it's outside.

his is probably a old pice of sh...
at least 15-20 years old mura engine ...

Those armatures are not sh.., they are made from quality parts and materials! The old Mura stuff was just great!

-john

[Victor Poulin]

Vic,

My hands have wanted to get dirty all year but I still have a little ways to go.

However, in anticipation of returning to motor building, I asked Cheater to move my Motor Shop thread into the new motor building section and he did. So sometime after the first of the year we'll start having "phun" again.

That's great Doug!! We need you back here wrenching again

[Victor Poulin]

Ok guys, here's my new build. This ones a born again Falcon motor with a little twist. I started by stripping out the old motor.


Then I cut the can down 1/4 inch, and opened up the holes for more cooling. You can see the difference between mine and the original.


Then it's time to cut down an endbell to fit the smaller can. I used a ProSlot C-can. When cutting these down you really have to take your time to ensure a nice tight fit,
Here you see the original, and the cut down endbell. After fitting and drilling the can and endbell, I stripped it down to clean up the hardware, replaced it and aligned and diamond honed the brush hoods and added Slick-7 spring cups to make it perdy.


I removed the old can bushing and installed new roller bearings.


Now It's time for the power plant. I had a 520 hole, so I decided to go with a new ProSlot 500dia X-12 arm with 42deg timing.


After installing the arm and adding new ProSlot brushes and Camen med 3coil springs, Here's the finished product.

It runs like a bear !! and stays nice and cool. Amp draw is 2.3 amps@6volts and this thing really winds up !!
I had a blast doing this build, and only spent a couple of hours doing it.

Vic

[Robert V.]

Hi Vic

Nice work on that little motor, i bet it's fast with a Proslot X12, next we hope to see a Victor rewind. On the next post if it's possible can you make the pictures a little bigger some of us are getting old and can't see as good as we once did.

[Alchemist]

HI Vic,

Sounds awesome and looks real good too!!! I really wish it was possible to upload sound bites of the motors hooked on voltage!!!!

Ernie

[Bill from NH]

Vic, that's a neat looking motor! The can is a Slick 7 Mini Brute rather than a Falcon. It's comparable to a Falcon 3, 4, or 5 but doesn't have the neo magnets of a Falcon 7 or the TSRD3. How'd you end up shortening the can? I haven't tried it yet but I'm going to see if I can do it on a drill press.

[Bill from NH]

... and you most often can't balance it even if you can take it apart because of it having been balanced before.

-john

John, can you add a few words as to what you mean by this? I've meant to ask when you've stated this before. Over the years, I've often gotten arms balanced that were previously balanced. This was arms that were dynamically balanced, but what am I missing if the arms were statically balanced? Is there something more than an increased workload to end up with a balanced arm using a previously balanced blank? Thanks.

[Champion 507]

Great job Vic. Whatch gonna put it in?

[havlicek]

John, can you add a few words as to what you mean by this? I've meant to ask when you've stated this before. Over the years, I've often gotten arms balanced that were previously balanced. This was arms that were dynamically balanced, but what am I missing if the arms were statically balanced? Is there something more than an increased workload to end up with a balanced arm using a previously balanced blank? Thanks.

Hi Bill,

You can usually easily re-balance an arm, say because the coils may have shifted a little. That only takes a bit of touch-up. But take an arm that has been balanced, strip it and then rewind it and it's likely that the old balancing is way different from what the arm needs after rewinding. If the arm has had significant holes drilled in it previously, there may not be enough material left on the crown to safely redrill and balance the arm without weakening it. This can be even more true on some arms that have a very thin web and crown, leaving very little material to drill even when "fresh". That's the way it's gone for me anyway.


Hi Vic,

Sweet little motor there...nice job! I measure the ceramics in those things as not far off from average C-can territory after zapping, and I would think that *MAYBE* even a G20 wind would work in the right length can. Of course, the neos come in at somewhere around 25-30% stronger (or something like that), but can 't be zapped as easily and won't hold up to heat as well either...so that makes the ceramics a good choice for different reasons than the neos. If you're going to be screwing around with these little motors, which is cool because so many of them get tossed, it's good to have both the ceramics and the neos and use whichever makes sense for the build.

-john

[Victor Poulin]

Hi Vic

Nice work on that little motor, i bet it's fast with a Proslot X12, next we hope to see a Victor rewind. On the next post if it's possible can you make the pictures a little bigger some of us are getting old and can't see as good as we once did.

Hi Rob,
Thanks, I had a heck of a time uploading these pics. They were to large to upload so I had to resize them to fit. Guess I went a little to small lol. I,ll try to get them larger next time. I'm waiting for a winding crank from Rick, but in the meantime, Bill has one we can use if I don't get mine in time.

John,
You read my mind buddy!! The next one is going to be a group 20 in a new Falcon 7 with Neos. My only concern is like you said, HEAT !! Usually when I'm working on the cans, I like to remove the mags and reinstall them when done. But these little suckers are nearly imposable to get out without breaking them. One this one I wasn't to worried about it, as these are ceramics and I re- zapped them when I was done. With the neo's it's a different story. I,ll figure something out.

Doug,
I don't really have anything to put it in lol. I just wanted to build it to prove to myself I could I more or less built it with drag racing in mind.

Bill,
To shorten the can I just use a cut off wheel . The tricky part is figuring out how much you need to take off depending on the arm you plan to use. I find that with most C-can arms, about a quarter of an inch seems to be about right. If it's still loose fitting when test fitting the arm, just take a tad more off the can till you get it where you want it.

Ernie,
Thank you, I suppose I could upload a short video clip of the motor under power, If I can figure out how to do it

[Bill from NH]

John, thanks for your explanation!

[havlicek]

Hi Bill...It was my pleasure and about time I got to answer one for you compared to the bazillion you've answered for me! I'm still waaaaay behind though

-john

[Dante]

I would like to fool around with the mini motors to see if I could build a killer motor!!!!!
I don't know to get the Falcon 7 undone!
Can some one help me?

[Victor Poulin]

I would like to fool around with the mini motors to see if I could build a killer motor!!!!!
I don't know to get the Falcon 7 undone!
Can some one help me?

Dante,
If you look at the endbell you'll see 4 small tabs one on each corner. Using a small grinder IE- dremel tool, grind off each tab. Turn the motor on it's pinion side, and just push lightly and the endbell and arm assembly will slide right out. When grinding off the endbell tabs, don't worry if you get into the can a little, as you will probably need to cut the can down some anyway.

Vic

[Prof. Fate]

Hi

Simpler, I used a circlip pliers with flattened ends to open the tabs without making marks or changing anything. That was part of the process Larry Shepard and I were doing 12 or so years ago to build monster "cheetah" motors just to do it.

Fate

[havlicek]

That might make sense Rocky if they were looking at keeping the original "endbell". If not, then a couple of seconds per tab to grind them off is about as simple as it gets.

-john

[Victor Poulin]

Hey John,
I,ve got a couple of old 36-D motors I'd like to play around with, any ideas?

Vic

[havlicek]

Hi Vic,

The thing with Mabuchis (and of course the 36D size) is that people will either completely revamp the endbell with modern parts and then stick in a wind that wouldn't have a chance of surviving with the stock harware...or do the best they can with "period-correct" modifications. Both are fun, but guess which one is more difficult I mean, modifying the endbell isn't exactly easy or simple, but getting a 36D to run well and be able to live a decent life is really hard.

First level 36D is doing what you can to improve the basic stock non-Champion motor
Second level is getting a hold of some Arcos and then spring post protectors
Third level (not counting modern retrofits) is getting hold of a complete late model Champion 36D and installing a fairly warm rewind.

I've thought for a long time that a Classic Manta Ray with a warm 36D with Arcos would be cool as all get out! Forget Cucarachas, the Manta Ray was "IT"! (the Viper not far behind )

-john

[Victor Poulin]

Good food for thought John, I just may have to try one the FUN way

Thanks
Vic

[Bill from NH]

Nobody has yet told you that a 36D arm blank has a lot more room for fat fingers than the others. I'm not sure when I'll be coming over yet, since I just got home from Thanksgiving. But my winder does have a 36D holder.