221 replies to this topic

[Jairus]

Grego, I received an email that suggested it was the braid. But I think it might be the fact that the braid is recessed slightly and the edge of the track next to the braid is causing it.

However, (big however) my car almost NEVER fishtailed the whole race. Jumped, got nerfed and bumped the foam once but it never fish tailed. (see my previous comment about glue)

Frankly I think it was the fact that there was soooo much glue on the track!

Might true up some vintage orange rubber just incase.... for the next race. That stuff is ironclad when mixed with glue.

[Phil Irvin]

July 3rd 2009 Race report.
Depoe Bay, Stock Flexi Wing cars.

Addendum: I am a little disappointed at the attitude of a few of the members here at Slotblog. Mark Faccone is a really nice guy! He and I have had lots of great discussions about the hobby and despite the fact that he is not a professional racer, is a real advocate for the hobby!
But, he mentioned last night that he had to take down the Youtube video and pull his membership from Slotblog due to the many rude responses he received from members of SB. Seems more than a few of you guys feel that racers should remain standing while driving and more than a few decided Mark should know this via private message! While I may agree... anyone with a brain has to admit that it takes all kinds to drive and NOT everyone HAS to stand while driving! Some, including those who know this track for thousands of hours seem to be able to drive it to the podium while sitting on a damn stool. If it works for them then who are you to disagree and insult Mark and company with your singular opinion?
I was frankly embarrased to no end when Mark told me about the PM's and of course it only added to my stress level Friday night prior to qualification.
If Mark ever comes back it would be nice if at least one of you apologized to him.

As for my promoting this forum to anyone else at Depoe Bay... I may have to think twice....

It's amasing how helpfull most RACERS are. But the FEW bad apples can really STINK up that barrel. I have had people say they can't race because I keep asking them to stand back so I can see the track. I now have a JAYGEE 200 with a 16 ft extention and can drive from either end now. I still get people bitching that I take up too much room and/or block access somewhere..

To all those who complain that a 'RACER' has to stand at the drivers stand. I have a TWO hand full of middle finger salutes to you. I would GLADLY change places with you. I have to LIVE in my 'chair' whenever I get out of bed thanks to a 19 yr old who loved looking at who ever she talks to..While trying to DRIVE her car. " I couldn't see his motorcycle"....A full dress Harley with the lights on ......RIGHT..

I would love to be able to stand at the drivers stand. Just be happy you can..

SORRY TO RANT AND RAVE....BUT ENOUGH IS ENOUGH..........
PHIL I.

[68Caddy]

Jairus
Cool but I think you need to race your own creations, I think you will have more fun?
Gotta go back to the Q.

Nesta

[NY Nick]

Jairus
It looks like your tires are too soft, the glue is no good for the jk's.
If you can clean your lane between heats.
Harder tire would work if you can not clean your lane or punch a hole in the rear spoiler, trim your side dams.
Less down force.
That is my 2cents

[Michael Rigsby]

If the tire is doing that Jairus, it is too soft and the added downforce of the wing car body along with the lateral forces is what's causing the issue. Typically, on my wing cars, I run the Alpha Piranha tires either treated or untreated and use the magnesium hubs. I tend to get a more even wear out of the Piranhas. On non wing cars like flexi GT1, GTP, Nascar, and my retro chassis the JK's do just fine. You might even wish to try some Parma Tuna fishe rubber tires with the aluminum rims.

If the owner is using spray glue on the track, it's really surprising that he is allowing anyone to glue tires. We have signs all around that no glue is applied to the tires....period. When the track is cleaned it's spray glued and that's it. That surely isn't helping any.

Are you limited to two piece chassis in this class, or can you use any flexi chassis????

[NJ Racer]

Jairus:

Based on what I see here, glue on the track and use of a wing body, my recommendation is to use JK Wonder Rubber and this problem will go away. You may pick up > 0.10 in your lap times as well. No need to trim (narrow them).

Regards,

[Jairus]

Wow, thank you all for the great responses! Consensus of the three Nick, Michael and Ray confirms it, that the tires are too soft. Except for the fact that not all the drivers are using glue. The owner does not spray glue prior to the race... it is only one driver and he applies liberal amounts during practice and between each heat. I noticed that even Carrie's and Jimmy's cars were doing the same thing (tearing up the inside edge) and they were driving with Parma full width fish rubber. I tried those tires on Ken's car in practice and they slid around a bit. I also had a set of those for my car but loved the way it handled with the narrowed JK's before the race. So that is what I raced with.
I will give the fish rubber a try next time out, but first - passing it over the "glue block"!

Don, the braces were part of the set-up that Cheater suggested. Might not be staying with that motor anyway... I think. The rest of the racers use the PS2105 and when in Rome, one should do as the Romans do. Besides, I want to keep this car USRA legal just incase they start enforcing the rules. So the front wheels go back on, as they are suppose to be "O" ring and freely rotate.


A bit O.T. but this is my thread... spent last evening enjoying the sights and sounds of "Madcap Daze". Rich Butler, my neighbor and friend has a band that plays for the neighborhood free now and then and at each of our Block Parties. For the 4th, they got together next door to me and did only their own stuff. The sound is a bit like Jefferson Airplane (the early days of white rabbit) crossed by Nirvana. The drummer has a distinctive Grace Slick sound while Rich a gravely Bob Dylan sound. The guitarist in the center has such a wide range in his voice that he can do alto and tenor and bass! Lead guitarist on the left was nothing short of fantastic!!!
All together they write their own songs, sing and preform in many of the local clubs in and around Salem. The music was fantastic and got better the more beer I drank.... LOL.
More pictures here.

Incidentally, the band quit just before dark, not wanting to compete with the fireworks going off all around us. Plus, they had been playing for two hours and were tired. We were relaxing on the patio drinking beer and trading stories when someone yelled FIRE!

Oops... the neighbor kids had accidentally got one of the spinners things going toward the greenery and set the arbavida hedge on fire. Hedge is close to 30 years old and about 4 feet thick. Flames were shooting 20 feet into the air. Wow! With three hoses we had it out before the fire truck got there but it was pretty exciting! I was using the hose in the backyard.... standing next to a little metal shed... when Cristy, Rich's wife, popped up and calmly opened the door removing the lawnmower and a can of gas.
Yeah... I was standing next to that little shed spraying a garden hose on a huge inferno burning right next to a stash of gasoline! Hmmmm..... (wondered where they kept that thing)

Rich, you really know how to throw a party!

[Hworth08]

Don, the braces were part of the set-up that Cheater suggested. Might not be staying with that motor anyway... I think. The rest of the racers use the PS2105 and when in Rome,

I believe Greg suggest using a brace with a Group-12 motor and a case could be made for a Super16C on a fast track.

With the lower power motors, it's not unusual to remove part of the frame and uprights behind the axle if it's legal.

It's best to go "braceless" and mark the axle as prescribed by Cheater to check for flex.

[J-Sull]

Just about got my nascer flexi done. All I need now is a front axle,wheels, and a quality guide and wires. Got my parma s16 motor mounted and time to finish it up and do a test run....Jairus you comming? Of course you are.

[J-Sull]

Sorry for the double post here it is with the body.

[chaparrAL]

I painted this stupid Caddy bod and tried to mount it .No way ,the sidepods clash with the front axle. Stupid flexis.

[W. J. Dougherty]

The flexi's are not stupid; it was a poor body choice for that chassis. Anyone that has raced that body or its GTP equivilant could have told you it would not work. Besides there are better choices anyway... Try the JK or RF Cadys for open cockpit cars or if they have it try the OS Mercedes body with the same rear wing. Another good choice is the RF Audi R8 Coupe.

wjd

[Pablo]

Hi Al,
Some suggestions, if I may:
1. The lead wires appear to possibly be restricting the movement of the bite bar/pans.
2. I don't know what your local rules are, but the front wheel assembly could be narrowed up quite a bit. ? When they hang way out like that they get bent, then restrict pan movement. Fronts are a liability here, but, again, depends on the rules.
3. The bite bar looks like 063, try 055 and see if it makes an improvement.

Call me stupid, just don't call me late for dinner

[chaparrAL]

I picked the wrong body, this for Gp 12 i think. And thnx pablo ,we are going to try that.

[Pablo]

Those pans HAVE to float. If not, the whole enchilada is spoiled.

[Michael Rigsby]

Jairus, Probably treated Piranha or JK tires would be the way to go if you are going to have to run through someone else's excess glue. I am really surprised that the track owner is allowing this, but hey,what do I know. On a freshly glued track (where the owner uses spray glue), I tend to use treated tires as they are a little harder and tend to shed the glue better whereas the glue makes a softer tire shred easier as it permeates the tire. Koford makes fishe rubber tires in different hardness also, all the way up to a hard compound. I might even try a set of those in a medium. Anyway, good luck and have fun, thats the important thing.

No front wheels are required??? I'd almost be tempted to put a small set of 1/2" diameter wheels on the front with a .047 axle just to put a few grams of weight up there near the flag, but that's just me.

Also, and it's just an experiment, try a 1" wide piece of teflon fiber reinforcement tape on the bottom of the chassis just behind the flag where it limits the movement of the front of the pans. Sometimes on these older design flexi chassis that can make a difference of several hundreths of a second by keeping the movement in the rear of the pans and the front planted. Doesn't always work so well on a Cheetah 11, but the older Parma and Flexi chassis it can work pretty well depending on the track. I know some people will preach otherwise, but I've had my butt dusted by some of these old chassis that had all the movement taken out of the front and left in the rear. Experiment.....Play....have fun....

Michael Rigsby

[Jairus]

Michael,
What? You didn't notice my tape in this very spot? Not fiber reinforced strapping tape but I used white paper tape which seems to do the same job. (right under the two lead wires) I experimented with differing widths and found a 1/2 inch is just about perfect!

Front wheels are in the rules, but the rules are not hard and fast (YET) so I tried the mini-motor and dropped the front wheels for advantage. It worked and my car is just about as fast (if not faster) than the opposition. My problem is my experience is not!
Front wheels are going back on but now I have to paint yet ANOTHER body because this one has no clearance for FW.
Track ower was so impressed with the mini-motor he is changing the rules to allow it... so maybe everyone else will end up using them. LOL.

I am staying with those tires. If one set of tires is the cost for going fast then that is what I will be doing. Ordered another set of JK treated tires... should be here today! However, I think I can clean up the edge and use the first set for one more race.... practice at least!

[Jairus]

GOING RACING!

Yup, after a hot week of temp's in the hundreds and a blistering 94 today (hey, it's cooling off!).... I decided that I am heading to the coast where the weather is more liveable and the racing NASCAR!



Yeah, it's bright... but I need to be able to pick out my car in the pack!


Motor has had the magnets shimmed and zapped. Gearing 64 pitch and chassis set up using most of Cheaters tips. Rear rubber is full width PSE tuna... which is what the competition uses. Race is Sunday night so will report back on Monday morning if anyone is still reading this thread.

[68Caddy]

Jairus,

Question: why are you wasting your time on Flexis? You are building great cars of your own, I sure wish you would race D3s instead because you could tune them to your liking.

Nesta

[mdiv]

Let us know how you did brother!

- Mikey

[Jairus]

Just got home. Tired after that long drive... lucky the traffic was light and the classic rock great! Love that "Lil' Stevens Underground Garage"!

Short report was that I took 4th again. Car took a bit of adjusting since I just finish building it so I arrived a couple of hours early and spent the better part of one hour running 130 laps just sorting out the problems. Best time after adjustments 5.68 which was not bad. Carrie managed a fast lap time of 4.8 or 4.6. She has a very fast car and is a fantastic driver. Of course she managed to win again tonight.

Parma motor seems much more powerful than it did in my first Wing car race back in May. Shimming the magnets and zapping really increased the torque a bunch! I piled on the lead to the pans and one piece behind the guide. Easily the heavest car on the track and it really showed in the turns since I nerfed other cars successfully three times. (That was a lot of fun) The other drivers were getting so that they didn't like passing me unless it was on the straight. I might not have had the fastest car but I sure could take the corners faster than any of the other three.
Oh... there were only 4 racers this time....
But, I was only 10 laps behind 3rd by the final heat so I didn't do so bad.

Need a new body. That was a brutal "crash fest" taking and giving plenty of hits. Body is well banged up and a piece of the nose is missing. Pretty sure I managed to keep the car in the slot longer but the others had faster cars overall. So... next NASCAR I am moving up to the PS 2105 with the Chinese arm. Only Carrie was driving with the Outlaw American Arm and it showed in the straights as nobody could out-run her there. However, that required a lot of braking to keep under control and she deslotted pretty often.
I am not faulting the Parma S16D motor for my losing. The car did well and ultimately I just need more driving experience.

Anyway, magnets in the PS motor I am building for next race will get a good soaking by Hershman and the arm is going to John for a com wrapping, balance check and com truing just to be safe. These Chinese arms have a tendecy to lose wire.


Next race is Flexi Wing on the 30th. Night all ...

[Jairus]

Got three cars heading out tomorrow. My son Ken, My car and daughter Karli will be joining us with the green beast with the blue flames. Found out at the last practice that she has as much driving talent as I do. Sooooo thought it would be a great swan song for her (heading off to college at Simpson in 5 days) to join us and Jeremy for the 30th's Wing Car Extravaganza!

[Jairus]

Not sure if anyone is still reading these reports.... but like outlaw radio in the 30's coming from occupied France... I keep on reporting.

Tonights race was the most professional and definately the most fun so far in the series I have personally experienced. The action was quick and the crashes few.
The lineup tonight....


The Racers....

Ken decided to not take part, instead he helped with the marshalling.
Top qualifier was Carrie with a blistering hot lap of 3.88 (Whew!).
Daughter Karli on her first time out managed 175 laps with no racing experience and a 4th place over all. She has great response but still needs more driving experience. Even so she did very well and I am proud of her in many ways for sticking it out!
Jeremy took 3rd after admitting that he hadn't touched his car for 8 weeks since the last race. It was that fast!
Jeff and Carrie managed to place 1st and 2nd on the last heat by a bare 40 inches....

They both managed to generate 209 laps each.

Your intrepid reporter had mechanical problems which required firing up the soldering iron to resolder one of the motor mounts. The malfunction cost him pretty much the race in the 6th heat ...with a last place finish at only 160 laps.
But I had fun anyway!

Incidentally, Jimmy made an appearance just before qualifying. We waited for him a bit.. but when he showed it was with a long face and no slot box. Not sure what is going on but I will miss him if he quits the hobby. Frankly we cannot afford to lose a single racer and my daughter Karli starts at Simpson University this Fall!
WE NEED MORE RACERS!






(and I have no more family....)

[Bill from NH]

Jairus, we're still reading these race reports, so keep them coming. When soldering in your motors, are you using a piece of piano wire or brass tubing to reinforce the joint at the motor's front? Either one works & provides additional strength.

[Jairus]

I am now!

Alternatively also considered placing the motor screw in the hole and tightening that down. Even though the motor bracket is almost totally cut away leaving just a hoop to solder to at the front of the motor - a motor screw in the upper hole will bite on to the top of that hoop and keep the flex down to a minimum on the solder joint.

In all reality it was a freaky thing to happen and easier to fix than a spun pinion.