475 replies to this topic

[Gator Bob]

Jairus, Any word on the testing?

[draggon]

Finally a small update. After much googling I found brass motor brackets. Next question, it seems that 3/32 axles are common now, they werent available in my area circa 69-70. Are we going with the normal 1/8 axles? Need to know cause that will determine what bearings I use. Heres the bracket whoo hoo!

[Bill from NH]

Glenn, Slick 7 did, maybe still does, sell a reducer to fit 3/16" O.D. 3/32" bearings in the 1/4" bearing holes. If you're going to use oilites or the Slick 7 bronze bushings, both those for 3/32" & 1/8" axles are available in the 1/4" O.D.

[Jairus]

Jairus, Any word on the testing?

Nope. Bryan said he was going to test Saturday. But then, there was a big race that day too so either it slipped his mind or he couldn't find the time.

Are we going with the normal 1/8 axles?]

No rules on axle size. Just remember that this is in the spirit so.... build likewise please.

[Jairus]

Okay dudes! The waiting is over and the results are in regarding the Mule test.
Good news: It is bloody fast as predicted. The need for the aero body is apparent, but needs some tweeking to allow it to handle better.
The bad news: The motor stopped after 6 or 7 laps. Bryan was unsure what happened. Could be a brush hung up or could be something more serious. He just could not tell with-out tearing it apart.

But... for those 6-7 laps he said it was very quick and could be just as fast as any wing car. The biggest problem was the handling. (I think he means cornering)
Bryan was quick to point out that he is not a Wing racer and so is not familiar with the processes of cornering when it comes these cars that require the airflow to maintain contact with the track surface. You know?

A couple suggestions he made were to run a thinner body and add 20oz to the nose. He also asked me why a lightweight car needed such a powerful motor? (It really doesn't)
The motor is a "B" can that John Havlicek built that I added the cooling ears to. I believe the wind uses 24g wire and it indeed is a screamer.
The weight I can do but using a thinner body... I feel breaks the "In the spirit of" rule and so will remain vintage thickness. (But there are options.... )

So the results remain inconclusive at this point. Car is being sent home for a tear down to find out what failed in the motor. And then I plan to lower the CG and add weight to the nose. Might even build a whole new chassis... who knows.
So there you are!

[JohnnySlotcar]

Can we run the One-winger body?? Thanks

[Jairus]

Yes.

[draggon]

Im glad to hear the one winger thing. Got my jig from Ray today. Whoot whoot! I can see how much more precise the building will be. Thanks for the info of bearings and axles Bill. So here is where I am stuck. I know the gear ratio I want, and 1/8 crown gears seem easy to come by, but 1/8 tires/wheels not so much. Is the hot setup shimming the crown gear to 3/32 to take advantage of current sponge, or going 1/8 all around and putting new sponge on vintage wheels? I have a local source for oilites, so thats no problem, I can get just about anything made. Sheesh, just goes to show how far behind I have gotten in 40 years.

[Jairus]

Well, the idea behind this whole thing is to run vintage bits and parts. That would suggest the finding of vintage wheels and gluing new rubber on them.
This forum is filled with vintage guys who have lots of vintage stuff available. All you have to do ask.

That said, some of the best vintage wheels ever used were Russkit, and those are repopped and available through Slotblogs sponsor Electric Dreams.

[draggon]

Thanks Jairus. 1/8" makes it a whole lot easier! And Yea, we've got some great guys here with loads of help!

[Horsepower]

I don't know who the "thingie" builders were after 1969 but they weren't in any of the stack of mags I looked through from Feb 1969 to Jan 1971.

[draggon]

I think it might have been a local deal. The NCC groups were the supposed big thing to cut costs on competitive racing. We had group 12 and 20, and my track was trying to promote this. Open comp was relegated to Tuesday nights while the group races and enduros were on Fridays and Saturdays. I have a note in a column in Car Model Magazine stashed somewhere that advertised the "Open Comp" race at my track in September 1969. It would make sense that the powers that be were promoting the class races at a lower cost to entice new people into the sport. Competition and innovation what it was, any rookie trying to enter an open comp race might never slot race again.

[MSwiss]

But... for those 6-7 laps he said it was very quick and could be just as fast as any wing car. The biggest problem was the handling. (I think he means cornering)
Bryan was quick to point out that he is not a Wing racer and so is not familiar with the processes of cornering when it comes these cars that require the airflow to maintain contact with the track surface. You know?

Jairus,
If the car is working well I would think Bryan would be able to keep it in the slot.
It's somewhat intuitive.

But if you need a "genuine" (ex) wing racer to try it, I'd be happy to.

[draggon]

Got 9 feet of piano wire coming. Whoo hoo. When that shows up gonna go to Motion Industries for bearings and 1/4 brass tube, and Im on my way! Next hurdle is the 1'16 brass drop arm. Sheeeeesh and to think in 2006 I had a huge drawer full of my scrap **** dating back to the beginning. I had no idea what I was letting go of. Really. Choti frames. group 12 and 20, open class, dynamic stuff Mura Pink motors, Green Cans, super angle-plummer-floppie, crap, everything that is retro now. I even had one of them MPC Dyno-Can Scarabs in the bubble pack I never built, and a host of Mlonogram Midgets. OOOOO , the pain!

[One27ray]

Jairus,

After checking out the body again and your comments/feedback from Bryan's test. One could angle back the guide pod to make it more aerodynamic ?

i-ray

[Jairus]

Jairus,
If the car is working well I would think Bryan would be able to keep it in the slot.
It's somewhat intuitive.

But if you need a "genuine" (ex) wing racer to try it, I'd be happy to.

I might take you up on that Mike. For now I need to get the car back and figure out what went wrong.

Jairus,

After checking out the body again and your comments/feedback from Bryan's test. One could angle back the guide pod to make it more aerodynamic ?

i-ray

Welll Ray, I would rather keep the body I use on my car as original as possible. I was pretty sure the nose was light when I sent it. Bryan had hoped to spend more time sorting things out and said he was just getting the hang of it when the motor stopped.

[havlicek]

No worries Jairus. If there's something fatally wrong, you've always got "the guarantee"

-john

[draggon]

A small update. I have everything to start my frame other than 1/4 brass tubing for the rear axle. Im gonna try to build something like this. Its close to what I ran, except the pans were much thinner, and I had the normal piano wire front axle. The pans in the pic look to be a 16th or more thick. Too much weight!

[Jairus]

Glenn, who built that one? Looks a lot like something I did a few years ago for Maximo is why I ask. Not that it matters one way or another... just wondering.

[draggon]

Yea Jairus, it might be yours! I copied a bunch of stuff I found online that I loved! Hope theres no copyright stuff going on! A question you should have the answer to. 1/4 brass tube worked for the ball bearings I used back then. Will the 1/4 tube be appropriate for 3/32 axles and bearings?

[Jairus]

Copywrite? Heck, I hope not... I copy other builders all the time!

3/32 axle ball bearings require smaller than 1/4" tubing unless it is thick wall tubing. Standard 7/32 K&S tubing should be the ticket sleeved with 1/4" tubing that fits the bracket nicely.

[draggon]

Cool, thanks!

[draggon]

Ugh, the LHS closed up. Gotta do some travelin' to get the brass tube!

[JohnnySlotcar]

Mike Swiss at chicagoland raceway carries all that stuff and does super mail order!

[Jairus]

I concur.

Received my test Mule back a short time ago. Haven't have the time to examine it yet but I can see a couple areas that need fixing including the nose. The darned U-Go nose piece lifts the front of the frame too high off the ground. Bryan said that the Havlicek built B-motor was so powerful that it ran just like a wing car. But wouldn't corner quite like a wing car and maybe the high position of the nose is the culprit.

Soon as I get the chance I'll fix it and take Mike Swiss up on his offer to test it on his track.