781 replies to this topic

[MantaRay]

BTW Graham...... The only practice John Austin and I had in Chicagoland was in Barrington on Brassrodmans home track.......The car was NOT run since the last Shake Down/Warm up race months ago........Mike used sticky fingers fluid on ALL Cars

[MSwiss]

Yes,Ray's and John's car weren't tested
at Chicagoland.

[FastG]

I was not implying that Ray had put thousands of laps to fine tune his machine. But I think Ray has built just a few more cars to race at Chicagoland than Jens. 

 

Graham 

[MantaRay]

got it

 

Ray

[Jencar17]

It was and it still is great fun!

 

As result of the late finishing I didn't try to to give the car more weight.   Could be the reason for the nervousness.  

 

But one has to be the last!  

[slotbaker]

What are the standings after the 2 rounds (3 races)?

Are there any more races planned with these cars?

[Gator Bob]

Jaak, You asked "what...."

 

First off, your chassis looks great !

 

Now...

Are your fronts rolling independently ? 

Did you take full advantage of the maximum guide length ?

What dia. rails? Does it have a lot of bite (flex) ?

 

I think the car had 'too much' traction, Ray narrowed up some tires that helps.

 

 

 

Body is under construction as we speak.

 

Car will be in the mail on Monday with priority signed for post 

 

 

 

 

[Jaak]

Poop....no independent front wheels....even silly me now realizes that would have been a good thing to do.

Not sure what size rails I used...forgot   but I made sure the chassis had flex but I am not sure how much flex a chassis needs.
Also did not have the option to test my car so I build it and send it untested 

 

I was also not sure on the guide length thing so I used the second indentation on the guide tongue as I seen that mentioned here somewhere.

Was not aware there is such a thing as too much traction 

 

Bob thank you for thinking along with me I Greatly Appreciate it !!!!

One of the biggest reasons I join proxies like this is to learn where things where done wrong and do it better the next time around.

[Pablo]

"Also did not have the option to test my car so I build it and send it untested  "

The white car had zero testing also.

 

Manta Ray said something about my car being a "rear steer" chassis.

I have no idea what that means. I've heard guys talk about that but still don't understand how a slot car "steers" ??  I just built it with some lift and tilt to the body attachments.

As I stated in my build thread, I pretty much copied what Manta Ray did with his.

 

These cars are so close in performance, any car could win on any given day.

Next round could be a different story........every dog has his day, that was mine.

[MSwiss]

Congratulations Pablo and Steve and Pablo again for the overall win 

 

Great event I hope that the drivers had fun and I would like to thank them and Mike for making it all happen.

 

I am not totally sure how those papers work but it seems I am last or second last.
All good for me it was more for the participating and wanting to test idea's.
I noticed my car was a handful and I hope I can get some constructive criticism on where I wen't wrong and what if any worked for my build.

 

The more the better this way I can learn for the next build.

 

 

Thanks again to all make this happen!!

 

One question to you experienced drivers and builders: what made # 17 so slow?  

A common thread among 3 of the late arrivals was no body movement (Jens and Ken) or unique movement (Jaak's)

 

Also, while the body rattling around on probably wasn't ideal,IMO, the main problem with Jaak's car was that his front wheels were a mile up off

of the track.

 

Even if it was easier to get Jaak's body off, it wouldn't of been the typical easy fix of taking out guide washers. 

 

With Jaak's guide tongue soldered on top of a fairly thin pc. of .032" brass, there wasn't any.

 

It would of took some solder work which isn't real easy with the car all assembled.

 

Back to body movement, I just hot-lapped the cars again on the King.

 

The top 2 King cars had the most body movement.

 

While they weren't "one lap fast", they were very predictable.

 

While I "Sticky Fingered" all the tires before the prerace shakedown on the King, Pablo's car really seemed to benefit from running on the flat track.

 

While I could only go 7.14 in that prerace shakedown, I ran a nice 6.43, earlier tonight.

 

Steve's winning King car could only manage a high 6.5 tonight, but as mentioned, it was predictable.

 

Steve's car would start to chirp it's tire loudly, giving me plenty of warning, before it would deslot.

 

The Pablo car would swing it's tail out wildly , giving me plenty visual warning to get out of the trigger.

 

Jaak's, Jens, and Ken's car would be going around the donut, seeming very stable, and then without warning, start rolling over.

 

While some cars lost some of their nose decals from the lane stickers, both of Jen's back #'s are also almost gone.

 

.

[slotbaker]

Good feedback Mike, thanks.

[MSwiss]

 Are your fronts rolling independently ? 
 

 

 

Poop....no independent front wheels....even silly me now realizes that would have been a good thing to do.
 

I ran all the cars earlier tonight, and the cars from Jens and Jaak, indeed , had non-independent fronts.

 

They would get about half way around the donut, looking and feeling OK, and then they would get possessed by the devil, barrel rolling off of the track.

 

Even in the dead-man, one would come off, and it would be easily clear of the lane.

 

I would leave it there, thinking 2 or 3 lanes away, it was out of harm's way, and stick the 2nd car on.

 

The 2nd car would then come off, and hit the parked car. LOL

 

Below is the sheet with the times I ran on Blue, on the King,. before the race, and tonight.

 

All improved, with Pablo's being the most dramatic.

 

Also there are some pics, showing the starting grid, the drivers, and the very unpopular with said drivers, staggered start on the King, instituted by the bastard race director, in an attempt to minimize the carnage. LOL

 

 

 

 

[MSwiss]

Super-thanks to all the drivers and volunteer turn marshals for coming out and doing a terrific job.
 
It's not easy getting 12 guys to make it the same night, on a random weekday.
 
Especially 10 who can drive both my flat track and King, with bodies with virtually zero downforce.
 
Because they had to stay on their own lane the whole race , and maybe it was a gutter, it's tough to give out a best driver award.
 
He didn't run a true gutter lane, like I usually insist he does, in proxy races.
 
But on the strength of being the only guy to run a 17 on the King, with Larry Kelley's car, wrestling 15's out of both Jaak and Jen's cars, and Sano Dave leaving after the Flat track race, I'm going to declare Chuck Gambo, the Indy Proxy Driver of the Year, if there was such an award. LOL
 
Flat track
Geary Gaspord - Red - 139
Kevin Van Pelt - White - 151
Sano Dave Fiedler - Green - 161
Dan Blankschein - Orange - 154
Graham Climpson - Blue - 153
Chuck Gambo - Yellow - 161
Bernie Schatz - Purple - 148
Lee Verdich - Black - 147
 
King
Dan Blankschein - Red - 147
Manta Ray Price - White - 151
Bernie Schatz - Green - 153
Lee Verdich - Orange - 154
Geary Gaspord/Graham Climpson - Blue - 154
Kevin Van Pelt - Yellow - 160
Chuck Gambo - Purple - 162
Dave Crevie - Black - 156

[Jaak]

Ok thanks Mike this really helps me.

So it seems the basic chassis design etc, is good but that I should have changed 3 things:
1/ Raise the guide tongue to allow both front tires to touch the track.

2/ Attach the body with pin tubes instead of my way 

3/ Make both front wheels independent 

4/ Narrow the front and possibly rear wheels to allow a bit more slide instead of roll
(was not aware that it was allowed but nowhere it says you can not so should be)

Please let me know if I miss any other mistakes.
 

 

 

Quote Pablo:

"Also did not have the option to test my car so I build it and send it untested  "

The white car had zero testing also.................  
 

Pablo my comment was not to take anything away from your victory...

You spanked us all  ,
I was trying to make an excuse for my cars performance..but with that comment you took not only the victory but also my excuse away

[MantaRay]

Pablo......I described the movement of your chassis as "Rear Steer" beause if you held the car in the middle with one hand and grabbed the rear wheel between thumb and forefinger the rear of the chassis would move left to right while the middle of the car would not move. What ever it is....It works Well

[slotbaker]

4/ Narrow the front and possibly rear wheels to allow a bit more slide instead of roll
(was not aware that it was allowed but nowhere it says you can not so should be)

 

Jaak, early on in the thread (post #33), Mike posted this;

After running the cars for a whole race on Saturday, my thoughts are rim width, along with looking good, runs fine.

So .575" max width on the rears, .375" minimum width on the fronts, 1.000" minimum dia. on both.

.050" clearance, front and rear.

Which seems to have worked out to be correct thing to do.

[slotbaker]

Pablo .........

You spanked us all

Yep, Pablo is da man.

 

[slotbaker]

Is there an oval track anywhere close to Chicagoland that would be interested in having these cars do a few laps on.

 

I reckon that would be pretty cool.

[Jencar17]

     

[Jaak]

Hi Steve,

 

Thank you for pointing that out,  it somehow eluded me eventhough I read trough the thread several times.
It is totaly my fault for missing that, I scrolled trought the posts too fast and should have read better as I did get the clearance info from that exact same post 

[MSwiss]

 

2/ Attach the body with pin tubes instead of my way 

 

Please let me know if I miss any other mistakes.
 

 

I would do something like making "shakers", using .050" dia. stainless tubing, floating in 3/32" or 1/8", K & S square brass tubing.

[MSwiss]

What are the standings after the 2 rounds (3 races)?

Are there any more races planned with these cars?

 

 

Is there an oval track anywhere close to Chicagoland that would be interested in having these cars do a few laps on.

 

I reckon that would be pretty cool.

There is a real nice tri-oval about a mile down the street at Mid-America Raceway.

 

As far as future races, I would be thrilled to ship one box off to another raceway, but as far as keeping up with points and such,

someone else would have to takeover.

 

I have zero time to devote to this anymore.

 

Along with guys begging me for my Retro parts, I have 5 parties booked in the next 75 hrs.

[Gator Bob]

Mike,

Thanks for running the cars again for a best balls out lap on the King.

 

Is my ride slow on the straight? Too heavy .. motor? Just not stuck enough / over stuck ... no brakes ?

 

I hope some more drivers jump in with on track impressions and pictures too

 

Thanks...

 

PS: I'm game to run again.

[Jaak]

I would love to run more but then after I fixed the flaws that the chassis design has.

At the moment it is not competitive and I would love to see what it does when these changes are made.

[Gator Bob]

Well ..... what's next ?