245 replies to this topic

[Arne Saknussem]

More like 50 years.  I try to keep things in perspective by relating the slot cars I ran to the road car I drove at the time.  The 16D is associated with my GT350 so I make that to be around '65 - '66.   But I digress.  Was there a point hidden somewhere in that AC/DC thing?  Just asking.

[Jay Guard]

Hey Michael C:

 

I second EXACTLY what Michael Rigsby said about why Retro Hawks are superior to 16D's.

 

I also want to say that the Retro Hawks are better for the newbies since they handle so much better.  Fewer deslots= more enjoyable racing and more new racers coming back again and again.

[Michael Rigsby]

There are a few tricks to setting up a Cheetah 11 chassis (learned from Fast Eddie Stilley) that help a heavier 16D motor handle better on most every track.  It's not rocket science, but after trying it, it works, and it goes a long way to making an American armed 16D more competitive, but the simple fact that the Retro Hawk motor is 10-12 grams lighter means it accelerates quicker, decels quicker under power (not talking about the coast after the power goes off), and the Retro Hawk has smoother acceleration out of a turn. Lower center of gravity means less tip overs, and you can run treated tires a little better on the RH powered car due to the lighter weight. Traction depends on the hub size you use.
 
I bought the first ones off the shelf in Jax.  Pushed for them to be made legal in My Series, and never looked back.  Had two My  Series NASCAR races where I TQ'd, and I'm not normally a good qualifier, but the cars just refused to deslot no matter how bad I drove.
 
If I was going to put a car in the hands of a rookie driver, it would be powered by a Retro Hawk.

[Sean Mikuen]

Charlie said: We're gonna need banners for participating tracks, posters, and a website...this is 2015.  Soon it's 2016.

I wouldn't mind volunteering to do things like banners, graphics, photography, and maybe even videos for My Series races (maybe even GRRR too )

as for my opinion, the main reason I didn't do my series is because it was a bit too expensive if wanted to run more than one class. To get a basic car set up from scratch, it's at least going to be $50-60, and that's for basic cheetah chassis, hawk retro, $13 tires, $6 body, and other essential components. Now that's just to race. But if I wanted to win, it looks like I'd need to be spending at least another $35, and it can be intimidating. I wouldn't want to spend $100 and know that I'm still on the lower ground.

I like the idea of the same motor, so then I know I can spend $60 and be on the same footing as the more experienced people as far as the car goes. At least I'll know I have some what of a chance on not being last.

[Michael Rigsby]

Sean is exactly right.  Sean recently joined us in Melbourne for a GRRR Can Am race (his first) with a car he built himself.  With everyone using the same motor he was on equal footing in that department with everyone there and did just great for a first outing. This was due to a retro hawk being used. Well done young man.

 

His observations as far as My Series costs are spot on, and need to be read by everyone here.   It does cost money to race My Series, very serious money. I don't know where everyone comes up with the low price on a Hawk 6/Big Dog combo for GTP, but by the time you get done buying an arm, springs brushes, quality can bearing, etc, it ends up being closer to $70, every bit as much as a built up S16D for that class. And you are not gonna do it on one motor, you need at least two due to the disparity in the armatures from one to the other, provided you don't get one that goes up in smoke because of how hot that motor runs.

 

To utilize a 16D in NASCAR, you have to have the basic motor, have the tools to blueprint everything, buy the arm, springs, brushes, can bearing, etc.  Put it in the car and run it, take the arm out, send it off to be balanced (cause Pro Slot couldn't balance an arm right if they had to), you are looking at least that much again ($70), and again you need at  least two motors.  

 

The LMP class is the only class that comes close to being economical with the use of a stock Hawk 6, but even those add up because you have to service the arm or replace it after about four or five races, then worry about brush life and brush contact area causing heat and arcing.

 

The Retro Hawk is a boon here, it keeps the price down so guys like Sean (and me for that matter), can race and be competitive.

[Michael Jr.]

Hey Michael C:
 
I second EXACTLY what Michael Rigsby said about why Retro Hawks are superior to 16D's.
 
I also want to say that the Retro Hawks are better for the newbies since they handle so much better.  Fewer deslots= more enjoyable racing and more new racers coming back again and again.

And lastly, Retro Hawk vs the PS4002fk. In setting up a regular weekly program, which is superior?

[tonyp]

Retro hawke all the way.

[Michael Rigsby]

And lastly, Retro Hawk vs the PS4002fk. In setting up a regular weekly program, which is superior?

 

Retro Hawk..hands down.  It simply does a better job, works in heavier cars and doesn't  the issues that plague all the PS Euro style motors (excessive heat, brush overlap issues, etc, etc, etc).  If you go with the PS4002FK, you better stick with their recommended gearing of no less than 3.2, and they actually like higher numerical to survive. Most of the guys running them in retro Can Am plus are running eight tooth pinions simply because they get very hot trying to pull a nine and will often frag. An EPIC/Trinity comm cooler is almost a must on a P4002FK (in my humble opinion).

[Noose]

I agree Hawk Retros.  The PS 4002FK is a good motor but it also has issues.  The cans still bend too.

[Michael Jr.]

I'll keep the PS4002fk in the GP F wing cars. Probably migrate towards RH in other areas.
I will plan to keep a 16D in something simply because I k ow some really love the 16D. Maybe in the Supertrucks. A big motor sorta fits the class.

[Danny Zona]

I would love too see retro hawk motors run in the scale classes. I love seeing the new racer/rookie as fast as me and top racers horsepower wise. It makes it a lot easier on helping the new racer/rookie set-up a car. At least it does for me.

I'm a die hard so either way I'm racing. The problem is we don't have many insane speed crazed morons like me anymore. Lol.

[Michael Rigsby]

I would love too see retro hawk motors run in the scale classes. I love seeing the new racer/rookie as fast as me and top racers horsepower wise. It makes it a lot easier on helping the new racer/rookie set-up a car. At least it does for me.

I'm a die hard so either way I'm racing. The problem is we don't have many insane speed crazed morons like me anymore. Lol.

 

Danny, the problem is not being a speed crazed moron.  The problem is being able to afford to be a speed crazed moron.  And you can see by your motor program, and the three motor programs  I just got rid of, it takes $$$$...and I just don't have that anymore.

[tonyp]

And you are not alone.

[GW/TRP]

Hey All Racing Enthusiasts,

 

P1 raceway will host the MySeries.org General Meeting to determine what classes, motors, bodies and anything else that may need to be tweaked. Please try to attend the racing; the doors open 8 AM. Marcus sent me the address today. 120 W. Crown Point Road., Winter Garden, FL. 34787. Use this for your GPS. 

 

Meeting: Pizza for all enthusiasts as soon as the racing program is completed. Meeting will follow with a discussion about MySeries.org rules and classes to be run in 2016.

 

MySeries has done very well over the years keeping a racing schedule going and running a year long series with solid results. Now we have a new opportunity to tweak the MySeries racing series. I have really enjoyed the enthusiasm and compassion that everyone has used in the idea of creating something that will allow for new enthusiasts to participate and feel competitive. i am in my 25th year as a track owner. Many series have come and gone. We're not going anywhere!!!  We have rocket scientists, engineers, mechanics, UPS employees, heavy equipment operators, advertising executives, and all kinds of other type backgrounds of enthusiasts to help solve any problems.

 

Key issues to consider: 

 

How long do you want to be at the raceway on race day?  (Approx. one hour for every 8 entries.) Plus practice/qualifying (12 entries - 1 hour and 30 min.)

What do you want to spend your time doing at the raceway?  (Racing, working on your car, qualifying, and eating)

How much money do you want to spend? (Five classes w/ different motors, all classes w/ same motor, or combination of two motors.

 

Looking forward to seeing everyone who cares about the future of slot car racing in Florida.

 

Best regards,

 

Greg Walker

[tonyp]

Sunday?

[DOCinCanton]

Tony, Greg is saying the 2016 MySeries discussion will occur after the endurance race this coming Saturday 10/10/2015. You know, the race that you and Jay are running together.

 

EDIT: Ironically, we will be running hand-out JK RH motors.

[Sean Mikuen]

unfortunately i wont be able to make it on Saturday. If somebody would be nice enough to place my bid with the things i posted in post #154? It would also be nice if somebody would mention that i can do things involving the media, such as posters/banners, videos, and all of that. if anybody can do that, it would be awesome. thanks!

[DOCinCanton]

Sean, I can do that for you. No problem.

 

BTW: Back in my proposal in post #90, car class #2 and #3 use the same motor and chassis combination. So, my proposal meets your desire to have 2 car classes with the same motor. Just change the body from 4" NASCAR to an LMP body, and you can race again. Very simple and cost effective.

[Mike Henry]

I would like to see nascar and gt1 share a motor and make it to where the new guy can buy one car and 2 body's and have a blast but I really hope we can find a faster sealed motor for gtp and maybe even group f but if we run the exact same motor in nascar gt1 and gtp it will get boring rather quickly and if we do decide to get rid of wing acts all together or just group 12 ( sorry Jeff I love them as much as you but no one else seems to) why not run something similar to a 5-5.5 race at the beginning of the day and let it be open to novice and experienced since that seems to be a very popular class now and let the track owners decide what the time bracket should be if we played that smart we can make that class to were the newer guys who don't put as much time finding that perfect gear ratio for ever track will be just as competitive as someone who does for instance we can simply take a random car to a random track say a nascar at bills dial it in for consistent 5.3s and simply take it to whichever track is next and run it for a few laps and what ever the out come for that track would be the dial in

Just a dumb kid's thought but I think it could be a great idea as far as a bare bones entry class were the rookie can rub elbows with national champions and have just as much of a shot to win as anyone

[tonyp]

I think part of the problem is there are too many classes. The more classes the less entries in each class as everyone doesn't run every class.


To grow racing it has to be simple. People have to be able to buy a car out of the box and essentially be able to race it.

Simple chassis rules
Bodies that look like something people might recognize as a car
1 motor
2 classes, with a novice class run as part of the race
Keep technology low, technology absolutely kills ever form of racing part of what is good about retro is RH motors and a set of rules which allows cars from 8 years ago to still be competitive..

2 retro classes

This would get all the serious racers together one time a month. More people can make 1 race a month, so entries should be up for all classes. This leaves 3 weeks of the month for local race programs instead of 2 .. New racers are going to come from local programs, nowhere else.

[Michael Jr.]

How about a list of interchangeable or complimentary motors?
For example, will you allow a Falcon 7 to run with RH? Or will you allow a Hawk 7 to run with RH?
No matter what you go with, the inexperienced racer will be holding one of these in his hand asking if he can race. He won't have a replacement motor and if he has ever replaced a motor before, he won't have the time or the equipment to do it before the race.
So do we have a paradigm that allows complimentary motors to run together. Or is it "RH or bust" sort of thinking? How far can we stretch to allow hobbiest to race for the fun of racing before it breaks down the competitive pairing of racers?

[Noose]

There aren't that many Falcon 7s used anymore nor TSRs.  Hawk 7s are not used that much either.  The go to motor is the Hawk Retro.  The inexperienced racer probably won't have any of those motors.

[CoastalAngler1]

I think part of the problem is there are too many classes. The more classes the less entries in each class as everyone doesn't run every class.


To grow racing it has to be simple. People have to be able to buy a car out of the box and essentially be able to race it.

Simple chassis rules
Bodies that look like something people might recognize as a car
1 motor
2 classes, with a novice class run as part of the race
Keep technology low, technology absolutely kills ever form of racing part of what is good about retro is RH motors and a set of rules which allows cars from 8 years ago to still be competitive..

2 retro classes

This would get all the serious racers together one time a month. More people can make 1 race a month, so entries should be up for all classes. This leaves 3 weeks of the month for local race programs instead of 2 .. New racers are going to come from local programs, nowhere else.

Mister TonyP - Please use my proxy vote - I would like to vote with you - can't make Saturday, I'm going to the Outlaw race in SC.  

[Michael Rigsby]

How about a list of interchangeable or complimentary motors?
For example, will you allow a Falcon 7 to run with RH? Or will you allow a Hawk 7 to run with RH?
No matter what you go with, the inexperienced racer will be holding one of these in his hand asking if he can race. He won't have a replacement motor and if he has ever replaced a motor before, he won't have the time or the equipment to do it before the race.
So do we have a paradigm that allows complimentary motors to run together. Or is it "RH or bust" sort of thinking? How far can we stretch to allow hobbiest to race for the fun of racing before it breaks down the competitive pairing of racers?

Falcon 7's were never as reliable as the current Retro Hawk. The Hawk 7 is a hotter wind and is faster than the Retro Hawk so that would not be a fair matchup.

[DOCinCanton]

         Mike wrote:    "I would like to see nascar and gt1 share a motor and make it to where the new guy can buy one car and 2 body's and have a blast but I really hope we can find a faster sealed motor for gtp and maybe even group f but if we run the exact same motor in nascar gt1 and gtp it will get boring rather quickly and if we do decide to get rid of wing acts all together or just group 12."

 

 

​Mike: what you propose is car classes #2, #3, and #4 of my proposal in post #90. Thank you.