3573 replies to this topic

[Victor Poulin]

I'm with them John, for many of us this stuff never gets old !! I know that this is always the very first thread I check every day when I log on. Everyone has their thing, for some it's chassis building, for some it's painting bodies, and for us it's motors. That's what makes this site so great ! Theres something for everyone.

BTW- I finally got some different size wire, so now I can try another wind using the right size wire lol.


Vic

[Robert V.]

Yep i am with everyone else john keep posting your wonderful motor builds it's also the first section i check when i log on and i am really a slot body painter that's what i really do well, Vic that little motor looks very fast let us know how it works out, also glad to here we may be seeing more rewinds from you i can't wait to see what you come up with.

[Victor Poulin]

Yep i am with everyone else john keep posting your wonderful motor builds it's also the first section i check when i log on and i am really a slot body painter that's what i really do well, Vic that little motor looks very fast let us know how it works out, also glad to here we may be seeing more rewinds from you i can't wait to see what you come up with.

Robert,
Thanks for the thumbs up. I built that one just to sell for drag racing and I think it will make a good bracket motor

And don't worry, I plan to start winding up some arms after this holliday weekend. I have a few different wire sizes now , as
well as blanks and coms, epoxy , ect, all ready to go. Now I just have to get it down pat, and I know I will .

We are taking Joe camping for the long weekend, but as soon as we get back home I plan to dive right in lol
That is, after I cut the grass and get my honey do list done !!

Now see John ? I would never have gotten into this if it hadn't been for this thread and all the people involved with it like yourself
I don't know if I should kick you, or shake your hands
Vic

[boxerdog]

John, and all of you...don't hesitate, the rest of us love to see this kind of work. Sometimes we get some really solid ideas as a result, sometimes just a little motivation, but it is NEVER too much..so keep it coming,please.
dc

[havlicek]

Thanks guys

Here's a pair of arms I did for Marty N. He specified a 65T/#30awg wind on Bill Bugenis stacks and coms, and to a length to fit a Hawk setup. This was a cool job for me because 65T/#30awg (as well as 50-55T/#29awg) is my favorite "manageable wind" for Mabuchi FT16D motors. In the Mabuchi, it's a very strong wind with lots of torque and much better top end than stock...yet it can live with some minor tweaks to the Mabuchi setup...post protectors, better springs and magnets. Here, the wind is on a shorter stack with a much MUCH better com (welded) and will reside in a thoroughly modern setup. They should run really well! Marty will send them out for dynamic balancing, but I kept the epoxy to a minimum, polished the stacks and cut the coms.



-john

[Mopar Rob]

Is that a 13D in the upper left corner? If so can you show more about that one

[havlicek]

Is that a 13D in the upper left corner? If so can you show more about that one

Hi Rob,

The motors are packed up and on their way to europe but fortunately, that was opne of the ones I found interesting enough to take a separate picture of. The "13" (I believe the formal name is something like 13UO or similar) has always been a head-scratcher for me. It's an awfully appealing package for a narrow inline aplication, but I think it was originally intended as a "homeset motor" by Mabuchi. As a kid, I loved the idea of the motor but never had any success getting one to perform well and last. On this particular motor, I installed a set of very thin modern ceramic magnets that measure quite strong. They were a pretty near perfect fit for the "13", and the magnets alone completely change the equation here. I did (I think) a #30 wind as I would for an FT16D intended as a runner and sleeved the spring posts with aluminum tubing, added rebent D-motor springs and then just did an average setup. The stack is original, and I replaced the shaft with a drill blank and used a modern D-motor com. The endbell hardware is OK on these as there's a bottom plate and top "hood" that is functionally not unlike the Mura setup and of course predates it...although a little sloppier fitting. I think it's actually a better design idea than the FT16D arrangement of brush tubes/"heatsinks" and hoods and the same basic idea that most modern motors still use. On this particular motor, neither the end bell bushing nor the can bushing were appreciably worn, so the setup was pretty "tight" (for a Mabuchi anyway) and the motor runs really strong ...seemingly comfortably into FT16D rewind territoryand seems like it should "live" just fine.

The motors (even the ones I've just recently done) all pretty much run together at this point, so I think everything I said above is correct

-john

[Gator Bob]

Thanks guys

Here's a pair of arms I did for Marty N. He specified a 65T/#30awg wind on Bill Bugenis stacks and coms, and to a length to fit a Hawk setup. This was a cool job for me because 65T/#30awg (as well as 50-55T/#29awg) is my favorite "manageable wind" for Mabuchi FT16D motors. In the Mabuchi, it's a very strong wind with lots of torque and much better top end than stock...yet it can live with some minor tweaks to the Mabuchi setup...post protectors, better springs and magnets. Here, the wind is on a shorter stack with a much MUCH better com (welded) and will reside in a thoroughly modern setup. They should run really well! Marty will send them out for dynamic balancing, but I kept the epoxy to a minimum, polished the stacks and cut the coms.



-john

All of them are Very, very nice!
John, what material do you use to tie up with?

[Marty N]

This couldn't come at a better time John as I blew my stock arm up last night just before setting a new personal best of .4989 at 48.42 MPH on the Penrose 1/8 mile track in Sterling Illinois. (Drag Racer) These armatures will find home in a Hawk set up with Emovendo single Neo magnets shimmed .020". Black JK bell with Proslot C can hardware clearanced for these larger commutators. The car is a 60.6 grams scratch build KMR full sidewinder chassis (that's me) and a WRP lexan Corvette Roadster body. Geared 16/51 and running JDS #7017435 tires, medium hub 1.04 X .435 tires.

I asked John to wind these arms at two seperate timing numbers with all else equal. As you know the JK commutator is really small and timed 25*. One arm duplicates that timing. The other is adjusted to match the "effective" timing. The difference in commutator sizing actually works out to 7* but I asked for just a 5* adjustment to keep my records and numbers simple. After a few cuts on the comm the timing will fall right in place.

I've been working this car for a few weeks perfecting the set up and going through stages of motor preperation to extract the most I could from a 65/30 wind in stock form. I have dyno and track data if you guys would be interested in looking at that data. I tell all. Not one of those keep it secret guys

I will be testing some other vendor's armatures as well for comparison data. Alpha, Proslot and Koford, maybe even a BOW or Mura. This could get interesting. I'll also be testing other magnets and perfecting spring, bush, air gaps and the like.

Absolutely beautiful work John!!! Should be a big step up in power and reliablity. Let me know if you guys want the feed back or not, Okay?

[Alchemist]

Wow! I can only imagine that I might faint if all of those fantastic motors showed up at my door step - LOL!!!

I do like to share the builds, but never want to wear out my welcome here at SlotBlog!

I would have to contradict you on that comment John! I know I'm always waiting for more pics of your builds along with the other members like Vic and Robert too!

If I may ask everyone please, what is it about the motor builds that get you really excited? For me, it's seeing the metamorphosis.

Thanks John for sharing!

Ernie

[havlicek]

Thanks for the additional info Marty. This should be pretty crazy with those Emovendo neos, they're ridiculously strong magnets and I have a feeling that there's a LOT left in a 65/30 that can be used with the extra field strength.

Thanks as always Ernie I had done a bunch of motors for this guy before, but they honestly were kind of a hodgepodge of mismatched parts and in "less-than-pristine" condition. This group however was overall a really nice assortment of NOS and lightly used...as well as matching parts. By itself, it's like getting a pretty cool vintage motor collection in one shot, although without the collector value as the work is all new.

-john

[havlicek]

All of them are Very, very nice!
John, what material do you use to tie up with?

I use kevlar thread, the kind used for tying flies, but have changed the way I use it (hey...I gotta have at least some secrets!) a little, for a couple of reasons. I also have some of what I believe is kevlar fishing leader that was given to me by Bill Bugenis. Truthfully, unwaxed dental floss or even 100% cotton thread is probably fine for most arms, since the temperature at which cotton burns or significantly weakens is pretty high...maybe 350 to 400 degrees F or so?

-john

[Bill from NH]

A couple other materials that can be used for wrapping is beading thread & fiberglass threads from an autobody patch. Then there is a European winding article where the author used linen thread on mild rewinds.

[havlicek]

Hi Bill,

Linen thread is probably better than cotton, the material is stronger yet still absorbent to soak up the epoxy. Good one!

-john

[Alchemist]

Hi John,

Pardon my "lack of knowledge" but may I ask you a question please? I've been looking at the motors you've rewound for me and I cannot determine which is the positive or negative post; I don't' see any obvious markings that would assist me in determining which is which.

If I place the motor in an anglewinder chassis and looking at the endbell, I'm guessing that the rear post closest to the rear axle is the positive post while the post closest to the front axle is the negative?

Thank you for your patience in my asking.

Ernie

[Bill from NH]

Ernie, not to cut in on John, but keep a 9 V battery handy for checking. When you get the motor to rotate in the direction that you want, see which battery terminal you have where. That tells you which terminal is which polarity. In the same light, if a motor's magnets are reverse magnitized, the terminals change polarities.

[Alchemist]

No concerns Bill - thank you for the information.

It is really appreciated!

Ernie

[havlicek]

...bingo! (thanks Bill). See, if I were a little more anal-retentive, I'd make sure I put the south magnet at the rear of the motor (or is it the other way around...ahhh whatever). That way, the polarity would always be the same. Then again Ernie, I figure I should leave at least some stuff for you guys to do!

-john

[Gator Bob]

Wow @ 102,075 Views this is a hot topic. More then some lady GaGa youtubes

BTW doesn't timing effect direction?

If the south magnet is at the rear, what happens when these are shipped down under?

[Gator Bob]

anal-retentive,
-john

- - - -
John FYI, I would check with der Administrators before using that word, they may pull your post.

[havlicek]

...ummm...OK...maybe substitute "detail oriented"!?

-john

[Bill from NH]

Wow @ 102,075 Views this is a hot topic. More then some lady GaGa youtubes

BTW doesn't timing effect direction?

If the south magnet is at the rear, what happens when these are shipped down under?

Timing will effect which direction(CW or CCW) an arm runs the best, but not change a motor's polarities. A hemi wound arm will. I don't keep track of which are north & south magnets. But I do have the poles on my zapper marked so I can determine & wire all my motors without needing to cross motor leads. That's important to know if doing a motor change during a race.

John, I would say anal-retentive is okay. Back when I was a moderator here, I wouldn't have blinked an eye when seeing it. Not all anal-retentive people are detail-oriented.

[havlicek]

Wow @ 102,075 Views this is a hot topic. More then some lady GaGa youtubes

BTW doesn't timing effect direction?

If the south magnet is at the rear, what happens when these are shipped down under?

Just to restate what Bill said, the timing advance of the arm will determine which direction (CW or CCW) the motor will spin faster. In order to have the motor spin in that direction, you may wind up with the positive lead on the top or the bottom of the motor when it's installed in the car depending on how the magnets are oriented in the can. Of course, this goes for two-magnet motors. I haven't a clue what the deal is with open frame and padlock motors...they scare me. They scare me even more when they have 5 and 7 poles arms!

-john

[havlicek]

I've been working on another Walnut^TM from my "mixed nuts" series of motors, and I figured I'd post it because it's a little different. First off, there's all the goodies...the magnets are Emovendo neos and, once I was able to pry them apart , installation is a simple drop-in. I will be shimming them just a little...maybe , but for now they set nicely in the can. I ground off the internal magnet stops so as to better center the arm and magnets in the setup, so once I do the final assembly I won't have any troubles. Since I'm taking this one "all the way", I also installed ball bearings in both the can and the endbell. Speaking of endbells, this one got the usual Mura, trimmed to fit the cut down Falcon can.



After cutting the length of the can and truing/squaring it, I also opened up the top and bottom holes for a little better breathing/airflow and then polished the can up...taking it to #600 before taking the felt wheel to it because (as Rick sez!)...shiny stuff just goes faster!:




For motivating the setup to move forward, I built an arm using Bill Bugenis' parts. I've settled on a stack length for Walnuts^TM and Strapnuts^TM of .330" (seems to work about right) and, after assembly, did a #28 single wind...tensioning the wire to just this side of breaking it. As a matter of fact, I did have to redo one pole because...er...I broke the wire . Anyway, the arm came out very nicely and meters consistently as far as I can tell with my less-than-NASA-spec meter. I put a lot of wire on this thing, so I used a special winding pattern that produces a compact coil and can help when the number of turns doesn't work out for the arm blank. With it epoxied, tied and a fresh cut, it looks like this:



I'm going to probably send this one out for dynamic balancing, because I figure it deserves it

-john

[Jairus]

John, where do you get the "Emovendo neos"? I would like a set for a cool vintage runner I am building.