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Joel Montague's 1973 Nats Winner


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#151 Horsepower

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Posted 23 November 2007 - 09:22 PM

Cut the crap, Rick. Your stuff is better than any builder from the '70s, '80s, or anywhere past there. Except of course, PdL. :yahoo:
Gary Stelter




#152 TSR

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Posted 23 November 2007 - 09:47 PM

Gary,

I wish that at my slot racing zenith (and that was a long time ago), I would have been half-way as good as Rick...

I am a racer, not an artist... :laugh2:

#153 dc-65x

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Posted 23 November 2007 - 09:49 PM

Thanks, Gary, but my completion of these projects was helped more than you can imagine by the great builders of the Golden Era. Mine might be more highly polished but theirs were not only their own design but race winners.

"I am but an egg..."

Rick Thigpen
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#154 TSR

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Posted 23 November 2007 - 09:53 PM

If you are an egg, it is certainly not fried...

#155 Ron Hershman

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Posted 23 November 2007 - 10:51 PM

Joel,
Donna Hubbell gave me the lap charts after the race. I asked if I could have them because I needed to show Bill Steube what happened. I have enormous respect for your accomplishments in the hobby, and you will be correctly represented in the book I am presently writing. However, you were racing that day, and when one is racing, one is quite busy. I am convinced that you were not aware of the little drama I had to deal with.
I am in Detroit until next week, and when I come back, I will dig up the records and scan then, then send them to you for your own edification.

Did we ever find the lap charts???

#156 Jon Laster

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Posted 23 November 2007 - 11:15 PM

Yeah, I wanna find out where that varmit LaBree got a head of me, doggonnit!

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#157 TSR

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Posted 23 November 2007 - 11:16 PM

Did we ever find the lap charts???

I have them.

#158 Ron Hershman

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 12:30 AM

Can they be scanned and posted here?

#159 TSR

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 11:31 AM

No. See your PMs.

#160 dc-65x

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 08:26 PM

I misspoke in my previous post. The motor Joel sent us is not one of his favorite NATS motors Henri but a motor he patterned after it he named Henri's Friend. Now Henri's Friend has a new home:

Posted Image

Here is Joel's NATS winner and our tribute to it. Adam is going to get some "JOEL" labels made up to finish it off:

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Here are some more views of the rolling chassis:

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The body and air control were beautifully done by "NOOSE":

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All that's left to do is grind up some fresh Riggen orange rubber on some appropriate wheels and this baby is off to Eddie's Blue King for a shake down:

Posted Image

We'd like to again thank Joel Montague for all his help on this project. Without it this project would have been a mere shadow of what it is now, a Pooch powered "Montague Missile" for the twenty-first century!

THANKS AGAIN JOEL!

Rick Thigpen
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#161 Ron Hershman

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 10:08 PM

Too FRIGGIN' cool!!

#162 prplgeez

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 10:12 PM

We REALLY need a pair of Limpach Fresh Cuts to finish this off right... you out there, Jan???
Joel Montague

#163 Noose

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Posted 25 November 2007 - 09:26 AM

Rick, that came out awesome!

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#164 kkjva

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Posted 25 November 2007 - 10:23 AM

Rick and Joel,

Wow! What a great build! Phenomenal workmanship! Thanks for the effort and the look inside the process/workshop.

Be good,

kkjva

PS: If you need a pair of “Fresh Cuts”, I think I still have a pair.

#165 JerseyJohn

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Posted 25 November 2007 - 10:29 AM

Sweettttttttttttttttttt!!!
JJ TRADE MARK BANNER copy.jpg

John Chas Molnar

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#166 dc-65x

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Posted 25 November 2007 - 12:12 PM

We REALLY need a pair of Limpach Fresh Cuts to finish this off right... you out there, Jan???

Here are some of the choices I currently have for rear wheels. The tires will be fresh Riggen rubber from Ron Hershman:

Posted Image

The wheel on the far left is, I believe, an Associated. It has a "telescope" style inside. The Aguirre wheel is from the early '70s and sold for $1.80 but I fear the Limpachs and Camen ($2.99) are more modern.

From the pictures Steve Okeefe sent me of Jan's car, the rear wheels seem to have that "telescope" ID and they also seem larger in diameter than the other wheels pictured except, possibly, the Associated:

Posted Image

I'll donate any of these wheels to "the cause" except the Associated. I only have a couple of those. :unsure:

Rick Thigpen
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#167 prplgeez

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 01:45 AM

The original tires were most definitely Limpach's Fresh Cuts. We were in Elyria... Jan was my pit man... they were Limpachs!!
Joel Montague

#168 dc-65x

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 10:22 AM

Hi Joel,

Could I ask another favor :blush: ? Could you please measure the OD and ID of the wheels so we can find something "korrect"?

Thank you again. :) ,

Rick Thigpen
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#169 prplgeez

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 11:05 PM

Sure thing... OD appears to be approx .475" and ID .390ish but the story doesn't end there. The ID is composed of three different diameters. The major diameter is the .390" as mentioned but at approximately .135" from the outside endge, it steps out to about .400 then at .065" from the outside edge it steps out again to approx .415". I'm not going to take the rubber off to find out but I wouldn't be too surprised if the OD mimicks that progression. It strikes me as a potential way to keep the rubber more firmly in place but that's ALL pure speculation on my part and only Jan would know for sure... not that he would tell us:)

The hub is .755" long and the boss diameter is .295" and .155" long. The depth of the trepan measured from the outside edge is .500" and the distance to the end of the boss from the same reference is .317". The boss diameter appears to be approximately .190".
Joel Montague

#170 prplgeez

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 11:07 PM

OH WAIT... just looked at your pic above... that hub on the end sure looks familiar! (So much for my theory about the od!)
Joel Montague

#171 dc-65x

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 12:02 AM

Hi Joel,

Thanks for measuring the wheels. They are exactly what I thought they were. The only problem is, I don't know what they are :blink: . They match the "telescope" style wheels I have a few of. I swear I found an ad in MAR or MRJ that showed they were Associated but I can't find it :unsure: . I'll keep looking.

Anyway, to those friends who offered to look for the right wheels... it's the one in the picture on the left :) .

Rick Thigpen
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#172 prplgeez

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 12:09 AM

Yeah, I'm confused by them as well... really didn't expect to see what I saw when I started digging into it. I'll email Jan and see if he can/will contribute.
Joel Montague

#173 dc-65x

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 03:11 PM

Joel Montague's 1973 Nats-winning recreation is in Adam's hands. Adam is a racer and as a final chapter in this journey I hope he won't mind me sharing the email he sent me about the maiden outing of, as we call it, the "MONTAGUE MISSILE":

Hey Commander!

I finally ran cars today. I ran the "MONTAGUE MISSILE" (MM). 3.6 with no
glue!!! A gem and then I ran "THE CAR" and could not beat the MM! Both
were sublime and wonderful the FREAKIN MM WAS SPINNING ALPHAS DOWN THE
STRAIGHT!!!!!! I HAD TO GLUE 'EM TO NOT BLOW THE ENGINE!!!! But I must say
DA FLASH'S Starship was great too, but nothing came close to the MM that engine soared
and the car stickkkkkkkks. Beeeeeutiful.

ONWARD

ADam

"Henri's Friend" lives again... :)

Onward indeed. Thank you, Joel.

Rick Thigpen
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#174 dc-65x

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Posted 13 September 2008 - 07:11 PM

Sometimes good things come to those who wait... and are persistent! To properly finish Adam's replica of the 1973 Nats Championship "Montague Missile" we needed the Associated wheels pictured above on the left. I had only a pair of originals and didn't want to give them up :blink: . None were forthcoming from the request in this post. What to do :unsure: ?

Well we bit the bullet and had a run of them made to the exact specs of the originals. Here's my half of my lifetime supply :shok: :

Posted Image

They are mucho niceo, no?

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Here is Adam's pair all polished up with fresh Riggen Rubber. They are 1/16" over size as I like to let them shrink a while and then finish grind them:

Posted Image

We did it, Adam ;) .

Thanks again to Joel Montague. Without his help this project would not have been possible :clapping: :sun_bespectacled: :good: :thank_you2:

Rick Thigpen
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#175 Tex

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Posted 14 September 2008 - 12:29 AM

MMMmmmmm... orange! ... like a Dreamsicle!
Richard L. Hofer

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#176 havlicek

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Posted 14 September 2008 - 06:40 AM

Rick,

It must be extremely gratifying to to know that the cars are blasting around a track somewhere with the owner grinning like a cheshire cat to the sound of... whizzzz-whizzz :). On that lifetime supply of wheels, god... maybe become a distributor :shok: :o ;) Again... beautiful work!
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#177 dc-65x

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Posted 14 September 2008 - 07:30 PM

Orange it is, Tex :) .

Thanks, John. I think the Missile is one of the nicest builds I've managed to date. Having Joel Montague looking over my shoulder kept me on my toes :shok: :D . Thanks Joel! His contribution of one of his NATS Pooch setups and a NOS "six-seven" armature meant all I had to do was simply assemble the motor and it would be a screamer.

As Adam said after his first drive, "the FREAKIN MM WAS SPINNING ALPHAS DOWN THE
STRAIGHT!!! I HAD TO GLUE 'EM TO NOT BLOW THE ENGINE!!!"

Onward...

Rick Thigpen
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#178 havlicek

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Posted 15 September 2008 - 06:23 AM

Onward indeed!

... and at very high speed!

... those big-gauge beauties are pretty compelling all by themselves!

Rick,

How much can (and rear magnet!?) contouring was done to achieve such a shallow angle between the motor and the rear axle? I could see the can was modified back there, but couldn't make out exactly what and how much was done.
John Havlicek

#179 dc-65x

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Posted 15 September 2008 - 05:23 PM

Hi John,

The first Champion Cee can didn't have an axle cutout so Joel added one along with a slight relief in the magnet which you can just see in this picture:

Posted Image

Rick Thigpen
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#180 havlicek

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Posted 15 September 2008 - 08:54 PM

... ahhh, thanks Rick. I missed that and the motor looks impossibly close to the axle tube without these cuts. Cool! (er!)
John Havlicek

#181 Gator Bob

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 05:35 PM

Total Outrageous-ness. :shok:

 

I don't think it can get any better than that. :good:  :good: :good:  

 

IMHO, 1973 to 1975 were the best years ever on Planet Earth. :D


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#182 dc-65x

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 06:35 PM

Hi Bob,

 

Wow, I haven't looked at that car for almost 6 years. It was a wonderful experience to work with Joel on recreating his championship car. I think it was the best work I've ever done......probably ever will do.

 

I have no idea where either Adam or the car is now.............


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#183 SlotStox#53

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 06:45 PM

Wow! Rick you pulled out all the stops with this build! ALong with all the help from Joel the finished article along with the Noose body = :heart:

 

Can't even begin to imagine putting something like this together all those rails & little bits :shok: :laugh2: 



#184 Gator Bob

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 07:17 PM

Hi Bob,

 

Wow, I haven't looked at that car for almost 6 years. It was a wonderful experience to work with Joel on recreating his championship car. I think it was the best work I've ever done......probably ever will do.

 

I have no idea where either Adam or the car is now.............

Hmmm... that's a shame that it and it's owner is 'lost' ? :dash2:

Make another one :D


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                            Bob Israelite


#185 SlotStox#53

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 07:27 PM

What Bob said :D :D 



#186 Zippity

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 07:42 PM

WOW!!

 

I've just spent the last hour and a bit reading this thread from end to end.

 

Amazing :)


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#187 SlotStox#53

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 07:51 PM

WOW!!

 

I've just spent the last hour and a bit reading this thread from end to end.

 

Amazing :)

Exactly what I just did before posting! Really great build/thread :good:


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#188 Jairus

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 06:46 PM

You know...... Adam asked me to paint a body for this car too.
Only because the original body seemed... off compared to the black and white photos.
Not the paint of course... because Noose does first rate work. But the body itself...

Consider the original car:
lastmarpg4-vi.jpg


I did a little experimentation by ordering a handfull of the "Outasight" bodies to work with and set about cutting the waist down to match the photo.
Eventually I arrived at this, after cutting up most of them:
joel1-vi.jpg

And the final result after shooting some color.
P1010071-vi.jpg


Notice the greatly reduced "wasp waist"? 
P1010072-vi.jpg

 

P1010073-vi.jpg

It's my contention that Joel eventually took two bodies and cut them so that once laid on a flat surface, could be mated back into one body and thus producing a radically altered piece that appeared to be off a stock mold.

 

B)


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#189 Noose

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 06:53 PM

I did use the cut in two versions to make one.

Joe "Noose" Neumeister
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#190 Jairus

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 07:55 PM

Where did you cut it Joe?
This photo of the original shows it clearly cut just behind the drivers station.
bodytop2-vi.jpg

 

But your painted version is so smooth that I can't see the cut.
Do you have any "in progress shots"?

 


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#191 Noose

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 07:59 PM

Never did in progress shots but I know I cut it in the same spot

Joe "Noose" Neumeister
Sometimes known as a serial despoiler of the clear purity of virgin Lexan bodies. Lexan is my canvas!
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The only thing bad about Retro is admitting that you remember doing it originally.


#192 Gator Bob

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 08:24 PM

:shok:  :good:   A possible 2-11 in progress. :sarcastic_hand:


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                            Bob Israelite


#193 dc-65x

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 08:56 PM

I wasn't involved with the body of this car. I had my hands more than full trying to replicate the rest of it!
 
But I do know this. Adam LOVED to have Jairus and Noose paint bodies for him. He once told me he loved art, and they were artists.
 
He had multiple bodies painted for many of this cars. We would talk about a new project and the first thing he would say is, "OK, I'll get the bodies painted!"
 
Anywho, I sure would love to have that car back. Pro's like Joel could bang a chassis like that out. As for me..........
 

Even with all Steve O's great pictures we still could not find an axle brace for the end bell side of the chassis. Joel came to the rescue with a perfect picture of what it looks like and it's really cool. Trouble is, when something looks really cool it's usually not easy to make. Here are my first five attempts and the tools used:

1973Montaguechassis007.jpg

YIKES! Persistence, lots of pliers, and luck resulted in success:

1973Montaguechassis008.jpg

Here it is installed:

1973Montaguechassis009.jpg

 

..............every step was a challenge!


Rick Thigpen
Check out Steve Okeefe's great web site at its new home here at Slotblog:
The Independent Scratchbuilder
There's much more to come...


#194 Half Fast

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 09:44 PM

It is a crying shame that this car and its mysterious owner "Adam" has disappeared. :frown:  Too much work and love was put into it by many people to result in such an dubious outcome.

 

Cheers


Bill Botjer

Faster then, wiser now


#195 dc-65x

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:01 AM

Hi Bill,

 

Adam had a real love for these cars, as I do. We really hit it off. I don't know what happened. But I do know that bad things happened to even good people in our "great rescission"..............I wish him all the best.


Rick Thigpen
Check out Steve Okeefe's great web site at its new home here at Slotblog:
The Independent Scratchbuilder
There's much more to come...


#196 Bill from NH

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 09:02 AM

He still might show up some day. :)  Socal has had a lot of people drop in & out of the hobby.


Bill Fernald

 

You have to be odd to be #1. :laugh2: 


#197 Tracy

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 08:34 PM

I remember running upstairs at the lane changes with Joel's car to get the motor cool.  Full glue racing had its drawbacks.  I'm still looking forward the completed story on the reproduction of Joel's race winner.  Its great piece of slot car history.  I built one for myself when I got home from the Nats.


Bruce Adamson

#198 Tracy

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 08:46 PM

Mine was not that pretty.


Bruce Adamson





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